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Girlfriend caught driving without insurance - and it's my fault

Fez909

Fez909

toilet expert
Bit of a nightmare this.

So, my girlfriend is the main driver of our shared car, and she usually sorts the insurance out. It seems like last year I did it, but we both don't remember this. I received two emails saying that the policy was due to expire but I didn't see either of them.

Girlfriend was pulled by the police today and told she would be given a FPN and 6 points. She had no idea the car wasn't insured. The police said if she can prove they didn't notify her and backdate the insurance, they will waive the charges. I'm going to guess they will say no to this, but I will call them in the morning to check.

Is there anything else we can do? Have no previous driving convictions, and 12 years of no claims, so our insurance was pretty cheap previously. This is probably going to massively increase the premium.

I also feel terrible that I fucked up and she's paying the price.
 
Seems a bit harsh not to get a warning letter first. I did recently. The letter was full of 'we understand there may be many reasons for this' and gave me the chance to get insurance straightaway. Which I obviously did.

Give it a go, your explanation. It might work. But I specifically didn't get an intention to prosecute letter.

There are ANPR cameras everywhere now.

Shortly after being let off, I noticed a load of nicked for no insurance stories in the local press. Everyone got fined £700 plus costs. And 6 points. I see the fines start at £300 so I don't know why everyone around here got £700.

Good luck.
 
planetgeli said:
I don't know why everyone around here got £700.
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I imagine they tried to say they weren't guilty so it went to court, hence it was their names in the papers and the increase in fine.

I had this a few years ago, insurance company cancelled my auto-renew so it didn't get paid and I got pulled over.
My insurance actually went down as it turned out Direct Line had been screwing me for years with annual price increases.

They really need to make it law that an insurance company has to write to you if your insurance ends with them, loads of people get caught because there's been some unintentional cock-up in it being paid and the policy gets cancelled without them realizing.
 
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Indeliblelink said:
I imagine they tried to say they weren't guilty so it went to court, hence it was in the paper and the increase in fine.

I has this a few years ago, insurance company cancelled my auto-renew so it didn't get paid and I got pulled over.
My insurance actually went down as it turned out Direct Line had been screwing me for years with annual price increases.

They really need to make it law that an insurance company has to write to you if your insurance ends with them, loads of people get caught because there's been some unintentional cock-up in it being paid and the policy gets cancelled without them realizing.
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I had the same with NHS Prepaid being cancelled and not telling me, idk why even if they send things that unregistered/unsigned for mail is somehow supposed to be some definitive thing. I have other peoples insurance, home insurance, car insurance, NHS letters, multiple parcels, huge amounts of junk mail despite us being here over a decade. Proof should be required if a standard thing whereby you expect it to go on then stops, they have phone lines, they have email we applied on, they have addresses, cannot imagine something which schedules all of these would be all that complicated to setup until someone confirms one way or the other.
 
Several years ago I was in this position. There was a misunderstanding about my insurance and it had lapsed. The police took the car leaving me and my wife at the side of the road with no way to get home.

I was certain I had insurance. But, in fact, I hadn't done so.

I was fined, given points, and had a large bill to get the car back. My insurance went from £300 a year to about £800.

The onus is on the drivervto ensure they're driving legally, and the car is legal too. The authorities have no sympathy.
 
dessiato said:
The onus is on the driver to ensure they're driving legally, and the car is legal too. The authorities have no sympathy.
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yes. ultimately responsibility is with the driver and / or registered keeper of the vehicle.

maybe diary notes (paper or electronic) for important renewal dates?

Fez909 said:
Girlfriend was pulled by the police today and told she would be given a FPN and 6 points. She had no idea the car wasn't insured. The police said if she can prove they didn't notify her and backdate the insurance, they will waive the charges. I'm going to guess they will say no to this, but I will call them in the morning to check.
Click to expand...

i'm not a lawyer or anything like it - but which of you is registered keeper of the car (the one who's name the registration document is in)?

She might just have a defence if it's you, although there's a chance they would prosecute you instead or as well (driving licences can get points for allowing or 'aiding and abetting' a driving offence, so you might want to tread carefully or seek more specialised advice)
 
It’s use, cause or permit with driving rather than aid and abet. Two bits of advice:

Speak to a lawyer; and,
Speak to a lawyer.

I doubt she will get off* completely but there may be some mitigation to reduce the penalty, a specialist lawyer will advise better than the Urban hive mind.




(* As a massive over simplification, in English law, most road traffic offences are almost absolute, as in if you have committed the act then you are guilty of the offence no matter what was in your mind. There’s hardly any place for the mens rea- huge over simplification, I’m not a lawyer, speak to a lawyer.)
 
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it's worth the phone call to try but not sure it will work, pretty sure insurance can't be bought retrospectively, I guess the planetgeli story is because they got a letter from an ANPR automated system rather then getting pulled over by plod.
PCN and 6 points would be the basic "no contest" outcome, getting a lawyer to help would mean actually going to court.
obviously IANAL
 
dessiato said:
The onus is on the drivervto ensure they're driving legally, and the car is legal too. The authorities have no sympathy.
Click to expand...
That maybe the case but is ridiculous. What is a driver supposed to do? Check every few minutes whilst driving to check that the insurance hasn't been cancelled for some reason? And then risk getting done for using your mobile while driving. :facepalm:
 
WouldBe said:
That maybe the case but is ridiculous. What is a driver supposed to do? Check every few minutes whilst driving to check that the insurance hasn't been cancelled for some reason? And then risk getting done for using your mobile while driving. :facepalm:
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But, ridiculous or not, it's the way it is with uk driving rules.
 
WouldBe said:
That maybe the case but is ridiculous. What is a driver supposed to do? Check every few minutes whilst driving to check that the insurance hasn't been cancelled for some reason? And then risk getting done for using your mobile while driving. :facepalm:
Click to expand...

Think really you only need to check that you're paying for the insurance each month. If it's a true admin cock up at the insurance company (like you're paying for it but it's not going through to the central database for some reason) the insurance company will sort it and say you were covered. But if you weren't paying for it, for instance it ran out and didn't renew, then unfortunately no one can help you.

I agree with car insurance it should be on the insurer to just auto renew, if they don't hear from you it just gets renewed automatically at whatever price. They can do it with pet insurance. Kind of seems like they want people to fuck up.
 
smmudge said:
Think really you only need to check that you're paying for the insurance each month. If it's a true admin cock up at the insurance company (like you're paying for it but it's not going through to the central database for some reason) the insurance company will sort it and say you were covered. But if you weren't paying for it, for instance it ran out and didn't renew, then unfortunately no one can help you.

I agree with car insurance it should be on the insurer to just auto renew, if they don't hear from you it just gets renewed automatically at whatever price. They can do it with pet insurance. Kind of seems like they want people to fuck up.
Click to expand...

All car insurance that I’m aware of will auto-renew unless you opt out of that option at some point. This year was the first time ever that my renewal premium has been more competitive than the cheapest I found by shopping around.

Regarding the OP; speak to a motoring lawyer, but I think she’s going to have to take the points unless you tell the old bill that you assured her that she was insured, in which case you’d get the points.
 
Spymaster said:
All car insurance that I’m aware of will auto-renew unless you opt out of that option at some point. This year was the first time ever that my renewal premium has been more competitive than the cheapest I found by shopping around.

Regarding the OP; speak to a motoring lawyer, but I think she’s going to have to take the points unless you tell the old bill that you assured her that she was insured, in which case you’d get the points.
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Can't speak for other people but both mine and Mrs Q's automatically renew and we get a letter/email telling us it will.
The rules were changed last year so that they have to charge existing customers the same as new ones. Mine dropped last time as well as a result
 
Is it your fault or was it a mistake?
Do you check the pressure on her tires before she drives the vehicle or does she take that responsibility herself?
It’s either both your fault or just one of them things. Just sounds like a load of bureaucracy to handle. Not the weight of the world.
 
Not much help now but you can check if a vehical is currently insured on "ask mid". Although it doesn't tell you the named drivers.

Check your vehicle - Navigate

Help the insurance industry use data to offer a better service and fight fraud
ownvehicle.askmid.com ownvehicle.askmid.com

I doubt she can avoid the 6 points unfortunatly :(
 
Not a driver but have done the same with house insurance - discovered I'd missed renewal / assumed it had auto-renewed when actually I'd not been covered for about nine months. Easily done especially if you are just completely awful at admin stuff. So no advice but much sympathy. And has reminded me I'd better check I've not done it again...
 
  • Take a life insurance policy out on her
  • Fake her death
  • Use proceeds to create a new Identity and a new life for her
  • Get back together in a new country once the heat has died down

It’s the only way to duck those 6 points and the insurance industry caused this so don’t feel guilty about the fraud.
 
Fez909 said:
and told she would be given a FPN and 6 points. She had no idea the car wasn't insured.
Click to expand...

An ex did something like this to me. After a short visit, she borrowed my car without permission and had a very minor shunt in a car park, not realising that one of the first things I did after we broke-up was to remove her from my insurance.

She got 9 points and a fine that IIRC was in the region of £500. They let her off with TWOCing, although I had to effectively disown her in my statement to avoid a charge myself.

I didn't give two-hoots about it..!

From what I understand, police have got a lot more determined about prosecuting insurance offences in recent years, since the last major revision to the road traffic laws.
 
OK, finally got through to the insurer. No help, as expected. They did say they sent a paper letter, though. We definitely didn't get one.

I doubt it's worth going down that route, as it's unlikely to change anything and might end up with a bigger fine, but it's annoying.

Glitter said:
Fez909 if the insurance won’t back down report them to the ombudsman. An issue we had years ago went from them wanting 12.5k off us to them paying us £1500.
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Report them for what?
 
Fez909 said:
OK, finally got through to the insurer. No help, as expected. They did say they sent a paper letter, though. We definitely didn't get one.

I doubt it's worth going down that route, as it's unlikely to change anything and might end up with a bigger fine, but it's annoying.


Report them for what?
Click to expand...

For not sending the letter. Complain might be a better word than report.

Basically, ombudsman investigations cost them money and they also don’t want them sniffing round.
 
What Glitter said, but tell the insurers you intend to complain to the Financial Ombudsman Service. Every complaint after the 3rd each year will cost the insurer £750 to resolve no matter the outcome, so it's in their interest for you not to go down that route and to listen to you.
 
Glitter said:
For not sending the letter. Complain might be a better word than report.

Basically, ombudsman investigations cost them money and they also don’t want them sniffing round.
Click to expand...
I remember losing my bank card once in days before mobile phones etc and I had little in the way of ID. The branch I entered was adamant I couldn’t access my own money until I told the manager he could discuss it with the Ombudsman and suddenly they had a change of heart and decided to be reasonable.
 
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