Entirely unashamed anti car propaganda, and the more the better.

[platinumsage]

Such cities are indeed already here, but the transport dinosaurs want to prevent us having them in the UK.

I don't know whether you've been to Tokyo or not but it's definitely full of cars.

 

[T & P]

Nonsense. I use car clubs too and I know what it costs. Most journeys will cost significantly more than the public transport equivalent. Hence, I only use it when public transport is not a viable option.

Why do you want to continue to own your bike? Because you have already decided that that's how you want to make the majority of your journeys. You've no interest in moving to public transport for every journey where it's feasible, because you don't actually want to do stuff to significantly reduce the number of motorised vehicles on the road (despite all the waffling on about how you're fully behind reductions but it just doesn't have to mean banning everything etc etc etc). You consider your own convenience to be of higher priority.

I'm very curious to see where will you go with your argument once ICE machines are gone and we're all driving electric vehicles. Can I privately own an electric motorbike when it comes to retiring my current one, sir? Pretty please? And if not, will you also demand an end to private ownership of e-bikes as well?

 

[platinumsage]

In teuchter’s world we wont own anything, we will live in airbnbs and get around in Ubers, apparently this will mean no cars and no urban expansion because outsourcing something to efficient corporations instead of owning it privately means it ceases to have an impact.

 

[T & P]

In teuchter’s world we wont own anything, we will live in airbnbs and get around in Ubers, apparently this will mean no cars and no urban expansion because outsourcing something to efficient corporations instead of owning it privately means it ceases to have an impact.

Yet I've never heard him demand an end to the private ownership of bicycles, either fully human powered, or e-bikes. One rule for them, and another for the rest of us, it seems.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

 

[teuchter]

I don't know whether you've been to Tokyo or not but it's definitely full of cars.

Yes I have been to Tokyo and I have spent several weeks living in one of its residential neighbourhoods. They are not full of cars - the streets are incredibly calm, quiet and safe. They are not cluttered with cars because if you own a car you have to park it within your own property. All houses are accessible by car but there is not a lot of traffic and drivers never speed. The roads are effectively shared by pedestrians, bicycles and motor vehicles. Most people do their regular shopping on foot or by bike. They take their kids to nursery by bike. Primary age schoolkids walk to and from school (and use public transport) by themselves and safely. There is ample bicycle parking at most metro stations and the entire public transport network is very efficient.

Tokyo partly achieves its quiet residential streets by confining all through traffic to expressways, and I don't consider this an ideal solution - I would still want to reduce the amount of traffic on these roads. It is essentially kept separate from people's day to day lives though, and people are very able to live their day to day lives without any reliance on a privately owned motor vehicle.

When I stayed in Tokyo I was actually enormously impressed with how well set up their residential neighbourhoods are. In terms of noise pollution, safety and accessibility, they are even better than Europe's best examples which are mostly in countries like the Netherlands. I have since wondered why Tokyo is not used more as an example or case study. Part of the reason, I think, is their system relies on deeply ingrained cultural values and habits that can't be transplanted to Europe. Nonetheless, it absolutely demonstrates how well a city can function when pedestrians and cyclists have complete priority in residential areas and local centres.

I know this reply is of no genuine interest to you but it might be to others.

 

[teuchter]

I'm very curious to see where will you go with your argument once ICE machines are gone and we're all driving electric vehicles. Can I privately own an electric motorbike when it comes to retiring my current one, sir? Pretty please? And if not, will you also demand an end to private ownership of e-bikes as well?

Don't know why you're "curious" seeing as I've already told you all this, and the answers are pretty obvious anyway.

 

[Spymaster]

Yes I have been to Tokyo and I have spent several weeks living in one of its residential neighbourhoods. They are not full of cars - the streets are incredibly calm, quiet and safe. They are not cluttered with cars because if you own a car you have to park it within your own property. All houses are accessible by car but there is not a lot of traffic and drivers never speed. The roads are effectively shared by pedestrians, bicycles and motor vehicles. Most people do their regular shopping on foot or by bike. They take their kids to nursery by bike. Primary age schoolkids walk to and from school (and use public transport) by themselves and safely. There is ample bicycle parking at most metro stations and the entire public transport network is very efficient.

Tokyo partly achieves its quiet residential streets by confining all through traffic to expressways, and I don't consider this an ideal solution - I would still want to reduce the amount of traffic on these roads. It is essentially kept separate from people's day to day lives though, and people are very able to live their day to day lives without any reliance on a privately owned motor vehicle.

When I stayed in Tokyo I was actually enormously impressed with how well set up their residential neighbourhoods are. In terms of noise pollution, safety and accessibility, they are even better than Europe's best examples which are mostly in countries like the Netherlands. I have since wondered why Tokyo is not used more as an example or case study. Part of the reason, I think, is their system relies on deeply ingrained cultural values and habits that can't be transplanted to Europe. Nonetheless, it absolutely demonstrates how well a city can function when pedestrians and cyclists have complete priority in residential areas and local centres.

Nonsense.

 

[T & P]

If your answer is privately owned fully electric motorbikes= bad, privately owned e-bikes= good, I can assure you that it is pretty fucking far from obvious...

 

[platinumsage]

Yes I have been to Tokyo and I have spent several weeks living in one of its residential neighbourhoods. They are not full of cars - the streets are incredibly calm, quiet and safe. They are not cluttered with cars because if you own a car you have to park it within your own property. All houses are accessible by car but there is not a lot of traffic and drivers never speed. The roads are effectively shared by pedestrians, bicycles and motor vehicles. Most people do their regular shopping on foot or by bike. They take their kids to nursery by bike. Primary age schoolkids walk to and from school (and use public transport) by themselves and safely. There is ample bicycle parking at most metro stations and the entire public transport network is very efficient.

Tokyo partly achieves its quiet residential streets by confining all through traffic to expressways, and I don't consider this an ideal solution - I would still want to reduce the amount of traffic on these roads. It is essentially kept separate from people's day to day lives though, and people are very able to live their day to day lives without any reliance on a privately owned motor vehicle.

When I stayed in Tokyo I was actually enormously impressed with how well set up their residential neighbourhoods are. In terms of noise pollution, safety and accessibility, they are even better than Europe's best examples which are mostly in countries like the Netherlands. I have since wondered why Tokyo is not used more as an example or case study. Part of the reason, I think, is their system relies on deeply ingrained cultural values and habits that can't be transplanted to Europe. Nonetheless, it absolutely demonstrates how well a city can function when pedestrians and cyclists have complete priority in residential areas and local centres.

I know this reply is of no genuine interest to you but it might be to others.

If you're that impressed by a city with 32% car ownership (albeit one where the residential areas don't tend to have pavements) then I'm surprised you are advocating for the abolition of private cars. If the 32% of households that own a car in Tokyo are the high-hanging fruit, then abolition would make their lives more difficult with apparently little gain.

 

[maomao]

Nonsense.

What exactly are you disputing?

 

[Saul Goodman]

What exactly are you disputing?

That it might be of interest to others?

 

[Spymaster]

What exactly are you disputing?

What do you think? Have you read it?

 

[maomao]

What do you think? Have you read it?

I'd agree with the bits that I know about. Japanese friends in China always complained about the traffic there. And it's a long time since Tokyo was the most polluted city on earth.

 

[Spymaster]

I'd agree with the bits that I know about. Japanese friends in China always complained about the traffic there. And it's a long time since Tokyo was the most polluted city on earth.

Ok. So you didn't read it properly.

 

[maomao]

Ok. So you didn't read it properly.

Whatever, timewaster.

 

[Spymaster]

Whatever, timewaster.

Not my time. I didn't read it.

 

[maomao]

Not my time. I didn't read it.

Well duh. I wasn't accusing you of wasting your own time.

 

[Spymaster]

Well duh. I wasn't accusing you of wasting your own time.

Whose then?

 

[teuchter]

Meanwhile in London three people dead in a high speed crash on a 20mph road; victims of a culture that doesn't take dangerous driving seriously.

I expect the driver decided they were a good judge of the road conditions and therefore didn't need to pay any attention to speed limits.

As a result they've killled their two passengers - luckily they didn't also hit anyone on the pavement or in the retirement home they smashed into.

Three people killed as car smashes into Notting Hill retirement home

Witnesses told how a topless man bravely tried to rescue the victims before the vehicle was engulfed by flames

www.standard.co.uk

 

[platinumsage]

Meanwhile in London three people dead in a high speed crash on a 20mph road; victims of a culture that doesn't take dangerous driving seriously.

I expect the driver decided they were a good judge of the road conditions and therefore didn't need to pay any attention to speed limits.

As a result they've killled their two passengers - luckily they didn't also hit anyone on the pavement or in the retirement home they smashed into.

Three people killed as car smashes into Notting Hill retirement home

Witnesses told how a topless man bravely tried to rescue the victims before the vehicle was engulfed by flames

www.standard.co.uk

Similar to the kind of thing that happens in Tokyo: Man who lost family in Tokyo car crash addresses driver in blog post, hopes to 'end fight' - The Mainichi

 

[T & P]

I think I'm going to start a thread calling for alcohol to be banned nationwide fully and permanently, and pubs to be closed forever. I will then populate the thread with news and reports of individuals who cause criminal damage, assault, beat up, rape or kill people during a drunken rage, as proof that all people who ever drink alcohol are potentially violent thugs, rapists and murderers in the making, and banning booze is undeniably the correct thing to do for the good of society.

Stands to reason

 

[David Clapson]

4.50 am....empty straight road. They went north over the canal bridge, pretty fast. Maybe the suspension went light and they couldn't make the corner? The Mail estimates the speed at 90. The marker is the building they hit. 42 Woodfield Rd · 42 Woodfield Rd, Maida Hill, London W9 2BE

90 seems improbable...wouldn't the shell be a bit shorter?

Looks like a Honda Civic Type R, 2007-11. Top Gear Magazine's 'Hot Hatch of 2007'. The Stig said it was 'an utter gem'. Notable for its placement of the fuel tank under the seat. You can't get a hatchback any hotter. Honda Civic Type R - Wikipedia

If this was just reckless driving, having 'fun' on an empty road, it's very much the Top Gear culture. If you get a chance you have to 'put the car through its paces'. You're entitled to it. You bought a car which does 0-60 in x seconds. (6.3 seconds in this case). Don't let anyone stop you...you've paid lots of money for your bhp and your torque. No point having a fast car if you never thrash it.

 

[teuchter]

4.50 am....empty straight road. They went north over the canal bridge, pretty fast. Maybe the suspension went light and they couldn't make the corner? The Mail estimates the speed at 90. The marker is the building they hit. 42 Woodfield Rd · 42 Woodfield Rd, Maida Hill, London W9 2BE

90 seems improbable...wouldn't the shell be a bit shorter?

Looks like a Honda Civic Type R, 2007-11. Top Gear Magazine's 'Hot Hatch of 2007'. The Stig said it was 'an utter gem'. Notable for its placement of the fuel tank under the seat. You can't get a hatchback any hotter. Honda Civic Type R - Wikipedia

If this was just reckless driving, having 'fun' on an empty road, it's very much the Top Gear culture. If you get a chance you have to 'put the car through its paces'. You're entitled to it. You bought a car which does 0-60 in x seconds. (6.3 seconds in this case). Don't let anyone stop you...you've paid lots of money for your bhp and your torque. No point having a fast car if you never thrash it.

90 seems improbably but all that really matters is that the car was out of control, 3 people died as a result, and others would have been killed if they happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Almost certainly none of this would have happened if cars had mandatory speed limiters.

Also, it would have been much less likely to happen if there was any attempt to actually enforce 20mph limits.

 

[David Clapson]

But if we had speed limiters, how would the car industry sell things which do 0-60 in 6.3 seconds? You really haven't thought this through.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

 

[T & P]

Without cars, dogging wouldn’t really be the same thing at all. Those calling for private cars to be banned should think about the potential loss of such quintessential part of British culture

 

[platinumsage]

Yet another reason to drive long distances - to stay away from polluting rail vehicles:

Pollution on some new UK trains ‘13 times one of London’s busiest roads’

Nitrogen dioxide levels far exceed average recorded on traffic-clogged Marylebone Road, according to a study

www.theguardian.com

 

[teuchter]

Yet another reason to drive long distances - to stay away from polluting rail vehicles:

Pollution on some new UK trains ‘13 times one of London’s busiest roads’

Nitrogen dioxide levels far exceed average recorded on traffic-clogged Marylebone Road, according to a study

www.theguardian.com

Nah.

Key Findings​

The levels of health-related pollutants and the exposure of the passengers were found to vary depending on the train type, the location of the exhaust, the track gradient and whether the train was in a tunnel. High levels of all pollutants were found during time spent in stations and tunnels.
The key points are:

• Air quality on board trains was different along the different routes.
• The highest levels of particles were found on the journey between London Euston and Birmingham New Street on the Class 221 trains. These levels were significantly higher than typical levels routinely measured at busy urban roadside locations.
• The highest levels of nitrogen dioxide were found between Paddington to Bristol Temple Meads, on board a Class 800 bi-mode train when in diesel mode. These levels were also significantly higher than typical levels routinely measured at busy urban roadside locations.
• There was a large difference in measured nitrogen dioxide when comparing diesel mode to electric mode on both the Class 800 and Class 755 train.
• Newer train types do not necessarily have better on-board air quality compared to older trains.

Air quality on diesel trains was found to be close to that found when travelling by bus, bicycle or car, but electric and bi-mode trains were cleaner.

​

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Nah.

​

Don’t go confusing the issue with facts