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wow, heavy manners or what! i think plod etc are trying to finish em off by the end of a year where they have mishandled things, like Walsall, portalooville, march for england, etc, and spent millions on a spent force.
 
EDL claim they're doing a demo in Sheffield in May. How many do people reckon they'll get to it? Some antifash obsessives here claiming we need to start mobilising now to smash them - personally I can't see them being capable of organising much around then.
 
they are over. they call these demos which get smaller and smaller. there is so much infighting its unbelievable. however, we must remember AFA 'if you cannot smash them when they are weak, how can you smash them when they are strong?'
 
The39thStep said:
Not sure that there is any evidence to say that the EDL have been smashed by physical force anti fascism either when they have been weak or strong Mal.
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Been massively demoralized by Antifa on a few occassions, Walthamstow springs to mind. Massively humiliated by plod as well.

So far this week they have clocked up nearly 35 years prison between them and there is still two days to go
 
krink said:
Am i the only one who thinks these sentences are way ott? it probably means anti-fascists (especially militant ones) can expect the same
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the key is they all pleaded guilty which is a big no-no. Violent disorder 18 months- 2yrs isn't that harsh
 
krink said:
Am i the only one who thinks these sentences are way ott? it probably means anti-fascists (especially militant ones) can expect the same
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Seems that the judiciary are passing deterrent sentences like they did after the Mark Duggan riots.
And yes they might well do the same with anti-fascist militants.
 
Nice one said:
the key is they all pleaded guilty which is a big no-no.
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Really?

If you plead Not Guilty and get convicted, you will get a much harsher sentence. Maybe the Defence had looked at the videos the Plod had. The general idea is one pleads Guilty in order to get a lighter sentence.

These sentences - and others like them - are way OTT IMO.
 
brighton x 2 bristol and walthamstow? but this year in brighton was one of the rare full on encounters with EDL where they got proper slapped and run around.
 
also one reason why they pleaded guilty is that there was so much footage of the EDL taken and posted by themselves that they could hardly deny it. i mean, if you are rioting, dont put footage of your mates doing it on youtube.
 
krink said:
Am i the only one who thinks these sentences are way ott? it probably means anti-fascists (especially militant ones) can expect the same
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of course they will.this is something AFA warned about with 'state antifascism' being used against antifascists. also a lot of these eejits have previous.
 
Fingers said:
Been massively demoralized by Antifa on a few occassions, Walthamstow springs to mind. Massively humiliated by plod as well.

So far this week they have clocked up nearly 35 years prison between them and there is still two days to go
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Well i agree with your second sentence as I have for the past two years argued that the police have been at the forefront of anti fascism
 
LiamO said:
Really?

If you plead Not Guilty and get convicted, you will get a much harsher sentence. Maybe the Defence had looked at the videos the Plod had. The general idea is one pleads Guilty in order to get a lighter sentence.

These sentences - and others like them - are way OTT IMO.
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that's the myth, and in certain crimes often the case but with public order arrests, especially those involving joint enterprise like violent disorder then you're doing yourself no favours by pleading guilty because you are essentially admitting to the whole thing. If there was 'large scale disorder', you'll get blamed for everything regardless of your contribution. Plus only the police's version of events get presented to the court as a true picture of what happened.
 
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LiamO said:
Really?

If you plead Not Guilty and get convicted, you will get a much harsher sentence. Maybe the Defence had looked at the videos the Plod had. The general idea is one pleads Guilty in order to get a lighter sentence.
Click to expand...

Well, thank fcuk that 'plead guilty for a lighter sentence' tactic didn't quite pay off for Ian Watkins and his co-defendants...

LiamO said:
These sentences - and others like them - are way OTT IMO.
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Part of the reason (historically) as to why jails are so overcrowded relates to 'OTT' sentences for relatively minor offences, but sentences for acts of violence are pretty consistent, regardless of guilty or not guilty pleas. For example, go back to 1990 and the three AFA lads who got 11 years between them for the attack on Nicci Crane for evidence of consistency in sentencing in cases of violent assault, even a violent assault that lasted for only seconds and in which the injuries sustained were minor. They plead Not Guilty and were sentenced harshly imho, but it appears now to be the norm for these type of cases to be dealt with consistently in terms of sentencing and regardless of the plea.

 
Nice one said:
that's the myth, and in certain crimes often the case but with public order arrests, especially those involving joint enterprise like violent disorder then you're doing yourself no favours by pleading guilty because you are essentially admitting to the whole thing. If there was 'large scale disorder', you'll get blamed for everything regardless of your contribution. Plus only the police's version of events get presented to the court as a true picture of what happened.
Click to expand...

Fortunately, british Fascism has a long history of 'activists' being dumb-as-fuck recidivists who default to 'Orwhite guv, it's a fair cop' on capture (S'pose cos they assume all their mates will grass them up anyway). Plus all the other 'mates' who will no doubt have filmed their moment of glory and posted it on facebook.

But, imo, these sentences are political. What did they do apart from the usual fuck-arserey they get up to most weeks at football - that usually results in no more than a push back the crowd or even an occasional slap? Was there a mass brawl/riot I didn't hear about?


I understand the sentences those Scousers got for attacking an anti-fascist musician and his son - but that was mostly for a) the malice aforethought, the clear, evidenced element of conspiracy and intent and b) their stupidity in doing it in a heavily CCTV'd City Centre where their entire journey was filmed.
 
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I also believe there is also widespread disdain/antipathy amongst many ordinary plod towards the edl/infidels. Don't forget these are the orrible bullies who tormented the average plod at school
 
LiamO said:
Fortunately, british Fascism has a long history of 'activists' being dumb-as-fuck recidivists who default to 'Orwhite guv, it's a fair cop' on capture (S'pose cos they assume all their mates will grass them up anyway). Plus all the other 'mates' who will no doubt have filmed their moment of glory and posted it on facebook.

But, imo, these sentences are political. What did they do apart from the usual fuck-arserey they get up to most weeks at football - that usually results in no more than a push back the crowd or even an occasional slap? Was there a mass brawl/riot I didn't hear about?


I understand the sentences those Scousers got for attacking an anti-fascist musician and his son - but that was mostly for a) the malice aforethought, the clear, evidenced element of conspiracy and intent and b) their stupidity in doing it in a heavily CCTV'd City Centre where their entire journey was filmed.
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not the case at all, on some of the football sites today they're expressly pointing out that this an extension of how w/c lads are now treated at football , ie : getting sent down for 18 months for bouncing up and down and mouthing off within the vicinity of a football ground ( and obviously in the company of an identifiable firm etc ) , "the occasional slap "from the OB era is long, long gone.

but agree, it's political policing on both the football and EDL related fronts
 
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whilst having absolutely no sympathy for these wankers, the sentencing is political, way heavy and clearly a warning. the EDL have lost any 'political direction' now and it really is down to a few 100 having regular argy-bargy (is that a latin american onion snack?) with plod as antifascists rarely get near em.
http://www.itv.com/news/central/201...s-sentenced-to-60-years-for-walsall-disorder/
and mugshots to show what villains they really are:
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/local-news/32-men-sentenced-more-55-6433214
name and shame and publish photos.
 
http://londonantifascists.wordpress...rs-sent-down-no-tears-but-no-gloating-either/

EDL SUPPORTERS SENT DOWN: NO TEARS, BUT NO GLOATING EITHER

Anti-fascists and the left should derive no pleasure from the prison sentences handed out to English Defence League supporters for disorder at a demonstration in Walsall in 2012.

We have consistently organised to confront the EDL, and while we won’t be organising prisoner solidarity for these individuals, we cannot applaud or welcome the role of the state in fighting fascism and far-right nationalism.

A total of 60 years jail time was handed down to around 30 EDL supporters. LAF has stated since our inception that we are completely opposed to state bans on far-right organisation and activity, and to heavy-handed policing of demonstrations. The same state that locks up asylum seekers, that looks to cut benefits to the most marginalised people in society in the name of profit, and which routinely harasses and even kills people in black working-class communities cannot be relied on to deal with the far right.

As anti-fascists and working-class activists, we have also felt the strong arm of the state in recent years – from pre-emptive and political arrests of activists around the Royal Wedding in 2011 and the Critical Mass protests at the London Olympics, the mass arrests at the Whitehall and Tower Hamlets anti-fascist demonstrations and subsequent draconian bail conditions, to the police violence against student demonstrators at the University of London. We also remember the political arrest and imprisonment of comrades from the Antifa group.

Political policing, pre-emptive and mass arrest, and draconian bail conditions are increasingly becoming part of the “normal” experience of many activists. For black and Asian working-class communities, police harassment and brutality has been part of the reality of day-to-day life for decades. The state behind all of this cannot be an ally in the fight against racism and fascism.

We should also think about why the 30 jailed EDLers ended up on the side of the racists in the first place, and whether being chewed up and spat out by the prison system is likely to dissuade them from their beliefs, or merely galvanise their sense of injustice.

The English Defence League feeds off feelings of powerlessness and disenfranchisement amongst (mainly) young, white working-class men. They are right to feel disenfranchised, frozen-out, and brutalised by the current system.

All over the country, working-class people of all ethnic backgrounds are finding it harder to make ends meet. The EDL and other far-right nationalists give white working-class people an easy scapegoat — Muslims, or “immigrants”. Locking up EDL supporters, or banning their marches, will not make the social issues they exploit go away. The working-class movement must provide alternative, anti-capitalist, anti-racist political answers to undercut the poison of the EDL.

Distinctions of “race”, ethnic identity, or immigration status are exploited by both the far-right and the state to keep us divided. For us, the key dividing line is the one that divides the vast majority of us — black, white, British-born, and migrant — from our bosses and their state: class. We will deal with the EDL by confronting them wherever they organise, and by helping develop working-class political alternatives, in our workplaces and communities, that can cut the roots of racism. A class-based anti-fascism must understand the state as part of the problem, not the solution.

We shouldn’t shed tears for imprisoned fascists, but the same draconian laws and police powers used to imprison EDLers could be turned on anti-fascists and the far-left just as easily.
 
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