Edinburgh - London: train vs plane (Scotsman challenge)
- Thread starter teuchter
- Start date
mattie
missing in inaction
That surprises me. I thought your approach was firmly in the 'blindly throw money at it' camp.
That depends on how far ahead you book it - just like the train........
It depends on the airline - e.g. Air France have the same seating throughout the jets that they use from Edinburgh - London City, however in business, they don't use the middle seat.
BMI now have a single seat style throughgout the cabin to Heathrow (which has always been the case with the Edinburgh-Leeds Embraers) and if you're sleazyjetting it (only a total muppet/loser would travel from Edinburgh - Bristol by rail!), then all seats are the same.
There's no real comparison as you're only using the seat for an hour as opposed to being stuck in it for four and a half hours.
I find the First Class seating on the East Coast train sets particularly uncomfortable - although there's a recline function, it generates a sort of slouch (sometimes all by itself as the maintenance is piss-poor) and I've yet to find a position from which it's comfortable to use a keyboard (an elf'n-safety issue surely).
How are the seats in the security queues at London airports?
Edinburgh I'll grant you is fairly painless to depart from, but you do have to come back, and if it's London you're coming back from, it is a bit shit, you've got to admit, even compared with the King's Cross bunfight (until the remodelling is done).
editor
hiraethified
No, they're not, and there's acres more space compared to the plane. And there's far more space for using a laptop, there's wi-fi and a power socket on hand and no attendant telling you to turn it off.
So trains are more comfortable, more work friendly, more productive, more relaxing, more environmentally friendly and drop you off far closer to where you want to be, without the need to get into cabs/buses, wait around luggage carousels or be frisked and patted down. And there's a proper restaurant car if you want to eat in a civilised manner on the move.
Get much wi-fi coverage when you're in the air, cobbles?
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
Fully flexible business class on BA from EDI to LCY is £473.50.
Fully flexible first class on the train is £379.00
Seats are much larger on the train, as is leg room. The actual time in the seat on the plane is scheduled to be one hours twenty five minutes, on the train 4 hours forty five minutes.
Until Crossrail is complete of course, when you can be whisked from Heathrow to your central London destination in no time at all
It was the processing I was referring to...
Departure Area Control > Security Screening > Gate Control > Aircraft Door Control.
All of that becomes a massive pain when spread out, as they are at a large airport.
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
How are the seats in the security queues at London airports?
Edinburgh I'll grant you is fairly painless to depart from, but you do have to come back, and if it's London you're coming back from, it is a bit shit, you've got to admit, even compared with the King's Cross bunfight (until the remodelling is done).
tbf London City is a fucking breeze.
teuchter
je suis teuchter
Mostly between 4h15 and 4h30 actually.
Once upon a time you could do it in 4hrs...
Well, I suppose you may as well be playing Tetris as you need something to fill the extra three and a half hours.....
The main problem is that trains don't start until 06:00 with the last return at 18:00 so you can't really use them for a full day's work (sleeper doesn't count - why on earth would I want to spend 2 nights on something less comfy than a 1940's campbed with the prospect of a public shower stall at Kings Cross as opposed to sleeping in my own bed and using my own ensuite).
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
I used a sample of times here:
evolvi said:
I want maglev trains in the UK, sod HS2 etc.
True. And if it could handle the flight volumes, it too would be shit. It's good, because it can't handle any volume of traffic. I think that's the fundamental issue with air travel and big cities. High capacity airports = lots of space = prolonged trudging for passenges also= rubbish locations for most travellers.
editor
hiraethified
Not so great if you live anywhere near its flight path.
teuchter
je suis teuchter
I think it's a mixture of that, and extra padding in the timetable to reduce the number of "late" trains and ensuing compensation claims etc. You might remember a couple of years ago many London commuter services were "retimed" to take a bit longer for this reason.
teuchter
je suis teuchter
Looks like they take a bit longer in the morning and evening peaks. Most of the daytime trains are under 4h30.
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
There's no way that Cobbles is real. Come on, people.
The train has pros and cons, as I see it. The biggest thing against it is what it's like on a Sunday, which is when I'm most likely to be travelling back. Last time I did Edinburgh-London, I ended up having to take a rail replacement bus from Newcastle to Darlington (or something like that, which most definitely involved Darlington). The total journey time was something around the 6 hour mark.
In contrast, however, the trip up on Friday night was a breeze, taking about 4 hours, leaving from where I wanted to leave from and arriving where I wanted to go.
I'd say it was a case of trip up >>> flying >>> trip back.
The biggest issue for time, however, is presumably your start and end points? If I'm going from home then Gatwick is 30 minutes away, whereas Kings Cross is over 90 minutes away. That gives the plane an hour's head start before it even gets going. Plus the journey to Kings Cross is much, much nastier than the one to Gatwick.
Personally, I have solved this conundrum by refusing the last three potential trips to Edinburgh, thus saving myself the whole headache.
The train has pros and cons, as I see it. The biggest thing against it is what it's like on a Sunday, which is when I'm most likely to be travelling back. Last time I did Edinburgh-London, I ended up having to take a rail replacement bus from Newcastle to Darlington (or something like that, which most definitely involved Darlington). The total journey time was something around the 6 hour mark.
In contrast, however, the trip up on Friday night was a breeze, taking about 4 hours, leaving from where I wanted to leave from and arriving where I wanted to go.
I'd say it was a case of trip up >>> flying >>> trip back.
The biggest issue for time, however, is presumably your start and end points? If I'm going from home then Gatwick is 30 minutes away, whereas Kings Cross is over 90 minutes away. That gives the plane an hour's head start before it even gets going. Plus the journey to Kings Cross is much, much nastier than the one to Gatwick.
Personally, I have solved this conundrum by refusing the last three potential trips to Edinburgh, thus saving myself the whole headache.
teuchter
je suis teuchter
Once the Thameslink upgrades start to kick in with longer and better trains (and hopefully less delays and overcrowding), getting to Kings Cross should become a more pleasant experience for people living south of London near the Brighton Main Line (which passes through Gatwick). Gatwick to St Pancras is only about 45mins.
If you ask National Rail Enquiries how to get from somewhere like Gatwick to Kings Cross it sends you to Victoria and then on the tube - this seems silly when you can just get a direct train right through to St P and then make a short walk to KX - no messing about with the tube.
If you ask National Rail Enquiries how to get from somewhere like Gatwick to Kings Cross it sends you to Victoria and then on the tube - this seems silly when you can just get a direct train right through to St P and then make a short walk to KX - no messing about with the tube.
Cid
Proper break this time
geminisnake
a complex mass of conflicting ideas
I think there was one left on the whole train(Aberdeen to London) which is thoroughly unacceptable on a train which is SUPPOSED to have two toilets per carriage. Plus there were at least 2 disabled ladies on the train, and they had no toilet access from at least Newcastle afaik.
I also have friends who have travelled by train between Dundee to York, again the train had no functioning toilets. East Coast line btw. I've never had any problems on Virgin trains(though I seem to be the minority on this)
geminisnake
a complex mass of conflicting ideas
No, you get poxy vouchers for train travel. A percentage of the cost of the journey unless the train is VERY late. I got roughly 25% back. I haven't used the train since so the vouchers were handy eh??
Also they have to be used at one time and you don't get change, which means another long distance journey. Don't fecking think so. And they're only valid for a year. Cnuts!
geminisnake
a complex mass of conflicting ideas
Basically Fuck Off teuchter. I am fully aware of how a train should work and the facilities that should be available especially for the prices charged. Maybe there were working toilets in the first class but I didn't go in there.
mattie
missing in inaction
The sewage outlet is right next to the vent inlet
But I think they're rolling a fix out for that one.
I've fallen asleep in design reviews as well. I'm glad it's not just me.
