Donald Trump, the road that might not lead to the White House!

[J Ed]

Flagship liberal comedian to people: drop dead, I have a far-right administration to ingratiate myself with.

 

[seventh bullet]

White House Reviewing Democratic Coalition Report On Trump’s Russian Ties That FBI Ignored

Well surprise, surprise, he's got more links there than a chain link fence.

I know there were plenty Russian sock puppets on social media, egging on Trump as a saviour, etc. Most you could spot with their not completely convincing affectations of good old "down home boys and girls." But, I don't think it was just these folk that I noticed Putin and his approach as being just what America needs.

I'm old, all my formative years were during the cold war, and the very whiff of an idea that anything Russian wasn't the antithesis of American values would have been rejected in any political discussions amongst ordinary folk. Okay, that was American propaganda that got under our skins collectively and Russians weren't demons - some of us knew that. But, I find this seemingly genuine willingness to embrace totalitarian proto-communist values and ways now both very weird and unsettling. I wasn't expecting that.

What the fuck are totalitarian proto-communist values and ways?

 

[Idris2002]

What the fuck are totalitarian proto-communist values and ways?

Borscht.

 

[seventh bullet]

Borscht.

Pickled cabbage.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Trump's not going to actually do the job he just got is he. If he tries to do the job of president he'll hate it because it's hard but I doubt he'll even try. He doesn't read and has the attention span of a 3 year old. So for all the showmanship he'll probably be a very weak and absent leader and question is who will really be in power, making the decisions.

Gore Vidal was of the opinion that most presidents did not wield much power, and that weak presidents wielded virtually no power at all. So yes, it is very pertinent to ask who will be the actual energy behind a Trump presidency.

William Burroughs had a very simple answer when asked by a magazine to write a piece about what he'd do if he became president - exactly what those who got him into power told him to do. He then spent the rest of the article describing what he'd do if he were put in charge of sewers. Perhaps Trump is a little different here in that he used his own money for the campaign and comes from outside the political machinery. But he will be beholden to someone no doubt.

 

[Treacle Toes]

Surely a notable difference between Obama and Trump for example with regard actual power is that the house and senate are largely republican? Obama was blocked repeatedly.

 

[Idris2002]

Pickled cabbage.

Kvass.

 

[seventh bullet]

Arbuz.

 

[killer b]

I was reading some speculation that the Repubs - who have no real loyalty to Trump, quite the opposite - will impeach him at the first opportunity they get. Which is likely to be relatively soon.

 

[andysays]

I was reading some speculation that the Repubs - who have no real loyalty to Trump, quite the opposite - will impeach him at the first opportunity they get. Which is likely to be relatively soon.

Eg this
Donald Trump could be impeached within weeks, claims legal professor

There is a strong case for the beginning of legal proceedings that would stop Donald Trump from being president, says law professor Christopher Peterson. A paper from Professor Peterson says that there is ample evidence to charge the new President-elect with crimes that would see him potentially being removed from office.

Some of those calling for it don't seem to have very clear grasp of what impeachment really means though

“Donald Trump has won the 2016 presidential election,” write the creators of a petition posted online under the title ‘Impeach Donald J Trump’. “It is clear something is wrong here if an openly homophobic, racist, xenophobic and sexist individual can become the most powerful man in the world.”

And of course there is a downside

If Donald Trump were impeached, it’s likely that his Vice-President, Mike Pence, would take over to lead the country.

 

[J Ed]

Mike Pence is probably worse than Trump.

 

[killer b]

Yes, of course. I wasn't suggesting it'd necessarily be a good thing. Just a 'thing'.

 

[Idris2002]

Arbuz.

Pelmeni.

 

[Treacle Toes]

I was reading some speculation that the Repubs - who have no real loyalty to Trump, quite the opposite - will impeach him at the first opportunity they get. Which is likely to be relatively soon.

Yes, have been thinking about this too. Mostly that any really damaging attack on him would probably come from the repubs themselves...also wondered if that was wishful thinking though.

 

[killer b]

As I said, it isn't wishful at all. Have you seen his VP and cabinet?

 

[agricola]

Mike Pence is probably worse than Trump.

Pence is far worse than Trump is.

 

[bimble]

Yep Pence actually means what he says it's properly frightening.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Pence is scary. An actual young-earth Creationist. Put on the ticket by Trump, well, first I guess because he said yes (bet he wasn't the first person asked), but second to reassure the evangelical, ultra-conservative vote.

 

[andysays]

I have a very vague recollection of a cartoon of Nixon saying something to the effect of "with Spiro Agnew as my VP, I'm safe from assassination".

Same logic may apply with Trump, Pence and impeachment

 

[killer b]

Except the party machine would doubtless prefer Pence.

 

[brogdale]

Interesting "post-mortem" piece in the Washington Post...includes this quote from Cathy Kramer on her identitarian findings for her book The politics of resentment...

The economic woes people communicated to me … were interlaced with their sense of who they are, who is a part of their community, what their values are, who works hard in society, who is deserving of reward and public support, and how power is distributed in the world. This complex set of ideas is the product of many years of political debate at the national level as well as generations of community members teaching these ideas to each other. This entwined set of beliefs was not something that any one politician instilled in people overnight — or even over a few months.

 

[Idris2002]

The wanker's not even going to live in the White house.

This should complicate his security arrangements nicely.

 

[Treacle Toes]

As I said, it isn't wishful at all. Have you seen his VP and cabinet?

Yeah but given the level of crazy lately I really can't have total faith that it will happen.

It does need to come from within the repubs though so that they are the ones that deal with the voter backlash against it. Anything else will spark a shitstorm that no one wants to see.

 

[agricola]

Yeah but given the level of crazy lately I really can't have total faith that it will happen.

It does need to come from within the repubs though so that they are the ones that deal with the voter backlash against it. Anything else will spark a shitstorm that no one wants to see.

Such is the scale of reaction from the defeated (or at least the defeated commentariat) that, sadly, I think its hard to see how a shitstorm could be prevented.

 

[DotCommunist]

The wanker's not even going to live in the White house.

This should complicate his security arrangements nicely.

first thing he'll do is defile the oval office washroom with a massive crap.

 

[bimble]

Interesting "post-mortem" piece in the Washington Post...includes this quote from Cathy Kramer on her identitarian findings for her book The politics of resentment...

​

Good piece of research that, showing that there was no simple link between rising unemployment or falling wages and which places went over to Trump:

"Trump overperformed Romney in counties where the unemployment rate fell the most between 2012 and now. .. it wasn't some recent decline in employment that affected how these counties voted. (The same is true of changes in median income.)"

 

[butchersapron]

That last thing can probably be at least partially explained by the contours of that fall in unemployment then:

Over 95 percent of jobs created during the recovery have gone to workers with at least some college education, while those with a high school diploma or less are being left behind. America’s Divided Recovery: College Haves and Have-Nots reveals that those with at least some college education have captured 11.5 million of the 11.6 million jobs created during the recovery. While jobs are back, they are not the same jobs lost during the recession. The Great Recession decimated low-skill blue-collar and clerical jobs, whereas the recovery added primarily high-skill managerial and professional jobs.

There really does seem to be a concerted attempt by some (not ness this piece mind) to decouple economics from politics here and to argue purely on cultural or ideological grounds alone in a grotesque inverted parody/playing out of their own characterisation of everyone else putting everything ever down to class.

 

[brogdale]

Good piece of research that, showing that there was no simple link between rising unemployment or falling wages and which places went over to Trump:

"Trump overperformed Romney in counties where the unemployment rate fell the most between 2012 and now. .. it wasn't some recent decline in employment that affected how these counties voted. (The same is true of changes in median income.)"

Yes, and for me, this part stood out...

The economic woes people communicated to me … were interlaced with their sense of who they are, who is a part of their community, what their values are, who works hard in society, who is deserving of reward and public support, and how power is distributed in the world.

As with 'Leave's nostalgic appeal to a more powerful, 'independent' past, the Trumpublicans tapped into a resentment of loss, and hope for a return to, days when the US was/will be the undisputed carrier state of capital.

 

[bimble]

I wonder how many of those new jobs, the ones that have almost all gone to people with college degrees, have also gone to women, replacing jobs that were previously mostly men's .

 

[brogdale]

That last thing can probably be at least partially explained by the contours of that fall in unemployment then:



There really does seem to be a concerted attempt by some (not ness this piece mind) to decouple economics from politics here and to argue purely on cultural or ideological grounds alone in a grotesque inverted parody/playing out of their own characterisation of everyone else putting everything ever down to class.

I don't read it entirely in those terms. I think the more subtle research is uncovering the complex overlap between the identarian mix and perceptions of the geo-political/economic power of the nation. Perhaps unwittingly, many Trump supporters appear to be reacting with a sort of grief for the era when the US was confident of its role as the undisputed hegemon. Not decoupling, but synthesizing?