Donald Trump, the road that might not lead to the White House!

[Johnny Canuck3]

We like to think that the world is slowly getting better.

But if one reads much history, it's hard not to come away with the impression that what's been going on, is a mishmash of greed, stupidity, and crazy fuckups, punctuated by short periods of sensibility.

 

[phildwyer]

He's going to win. Get used to that idea.

No way. That is completely impossible.

Then again, I've been wrong about every election, without exception, since 1983.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

No way. That is completely impossible.

Is it though? As JC said, it just feels inevitable.

 

[phildwyer]

Is it though? As JC said, it just feels inevitable.

It seems impossible to me. But since I am always wrong about elections, that is pretty cold comfort.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

It seems impossible to me. But since I am always wrong about elections, that is pretty cold comfort.

Ever since the day he announced his candidacy, everyone has been saying that everything he's subsequently done, was impossible.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

It seems impossible to me. But since I am always wrong about elections, that is pretty cold comfort.

I just think he'll bring out people who've never voted or troubled an opinion poll before, in droves.

Plus there will be huge numbers of people lying to the polling companies. Those who don't really want to admit to it until they get to the voting booth. It happened here last year...

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Ever since the day he announced his candidacy, everyone has been saying that everything he's subsequently done, was impossible.

Yep. And once he's in the Whitehouse people will say he couldn't possibly press the big red button. It's all rather surreal in the most terrifying way imaginable.

 

[phildwyer]

I just think he'll bring out people who've never voted or troubled an opinion poll before, in droves.

Plus there will be huge numbers of people lying to the polling companies. Those who don't really want to admit to it until they get to the voting booth. It happened here last year...

The real problem is that Hillary is just as bad. She supported her husband's ending of welfare, mass incarceration and ready resort to force. He foreign policy has been a moral disaster and a practical disgrace, and she openly gloats about murdering heads of state.

The only differences between her and Trump are stylistic. People recognize that and don't bother voting for her. I'm not going to vote myself, but if I was forced to do so I'd vote for Trump. Hillary has shown what she's capable of already.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Yep. And once he's in the Whitehouse people will say he couldn't possibly press the big red button. It's all rather surreal in the most terrifying way imaginable.

That's my concern. The US govt has a system of checks and balances, but the President can do some things unilaterally, and seek approval later - I believe.

I believe one of them to be the power to go to war, and seek Congressional approval after the fact.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

The real problem is that Hillary is just as bad. She supported her husband's ending of welfare, mass incarceration and ready resort to force. He foreign policy has been a moral disaster and a practical disgrace, and she openly gloats about murdering heads of state.

The only differences between her and Trump are stylistic. People recognize that and don't bother voting for her. I'm not going to vote myself, but if I was forced to do so I'd vote for Trump. Hillary has shown what she's capable of already.

Hillary is just a standard-issue politician. That's bad in and of itself.

She has lots of faults; but her faults pale in comparison to Trump's.

 

[phildwyer]

That's my concern. The US govt has a system of checks and balances, but the President can do some things unilaterally, and seek approval later - I believe.

I believe one of them to be the power to go to war, and seek Congressional approval after the fact.

You're wrong according to the constitution. But Presidents since Clinton have simply ignored the constitution.

 

[phildwyer]

Hillary is just a standard-issue politician.

Can't agree with that. I never heard a standard-issue politician say "we came, we saw, he died" after engineering the murder of a head of state. That's sociopathic.

And what about three strikes and you're out? What about ending welfare? Those are not standard-issue policies, they're insanely destructive and blatantly racist.

Trump might do things that are just as bad, but at least he hasn't done them yet. That's how I look at it.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

And what about three strikes and you're out? What about ending welfare?

I wasn't aware that Hillary was responsible for the three strikes rule. I thought it had been around for quite some time now.

Similarly, I wasn't aware that welfare had been ended, and that Hillary was responsible.

 

[phildwyer]

I wasn't aware that Hillary was responsible for the three strikes rule. I thought it had been around for quite some time now.

Similarly, I wasn't aware that welfare had been ended, and that Hillary was responsible.

Bill was responsible, and Hillary was right behind him. Even today she's quick to resort to vile "tough on crime" rhetoric.

Just consider what that kind of rhetoric and policy have done to the USA. The Clintons have basically wasted an entire generation.

And her foreign policy amply proves she shouldn't be allowed within a million miles of the nuclear trigger.

Trump says he's going to do terrible things; Hillary has already done them. It's not much of a choice, but it's a clear choice.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Bill was responsible, and Hillary was right behind him. .

I don't know what that means. Bill was the elected President. Hillary didn't hold any public office during his presidency - apart from a one-month overlap in 2001.

Trying to paint Hillary with what Bill did is a trick right out of the Trump camp.

Is Laura Bush somehow responsible for the Iraq war?

 

[phildwyer]

I don't know what that means.

It means that she often expressed support for his policies and continues to do so.

Never forget this. Trump at his worst never comes close to this.

 

[campanula]

Laura Bush is not running for pres - dimwit.

and all that crapulous talk of twofers.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

It means that she often expressed support for his policies and continues to do so.

Hillary expressed support for the three strikes rule when she was First Lady?

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Good thing we have Google to fall back on.

Where Bill Clinton and Hillary Clinton agree on Social / domestic issues

• Both pro-death penalty
• Both strongly pro-choice
• Both strongly pro-affirmative action
• Both strongly pro-ObamaCare
• Both strongly pro-environment
• Both strongly pro-gun control
• Both strongly pro-voting rights

Where they disagree: Bill Clinton Hillary Clinton
Three Strikes: Tough on crime Limit mandatory sentencing
Gay marriage: Supports some gay rights Strongly supports
School prayer: No official school prayer No religious instruction
School choice : Supports charters for all No private nor parochial choice
Legalize marijuana : Keep war on drugs Open to legalization

Hillary Clinton on Crime

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Trump might do things that are just as bad, but at least he hasn't done them yet. That's how I look at it.

I guess you don't go by the old saying 'Better the devil you know'?

 

[phildwyer]

Hillary expressed support for the three strikes rule when she was First Lady?

Yep.

Here's Hillary Clinton In 1994 Talking Up Tough-On-Crime Legislation

 

[phildwyer]

I guess you don't go by the old saying 'Better the devil you know'?

Trump is an insecure jerk. Hillary is a dangerous psychopath. I know which I'd prefer to have running the country.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Yep.

Here's Hillary Clinton In 1994 Talking Up Tough-On-Crime Legislation

Apparently she did.

I maintain that she continues to be a standard flip-flopping politician, and she's a terrible choice for President; but she's not as bad as the narcissistic, race-baiting, shallow Donald Trump.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Trump is an insecure jerk. Hillary is a dangerous psychopath. I know which I'd prefer to have running the country.

How do you get from tough on crime support, to dangerous psychopathy?

 

[phildwyer]

I maintain that she continues to be a standard flip-flopping politician

Ain't nothing standard about this:

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

I don't agree with it, but I take your point: you believe that Donald Trump is a better choice for President than Hillary Clinton.

The man who is going to build a wall, and make the Mexican government pay for it.
The man who believes that a judge born in the US to Mexican immigrant parents, is inherently biased.
The man who believes that President Obama is a Muslim Kenyan, not an American.

The man who is going to ..... Make America Great Again.

 

[phildwyer]

How do you get from tough on crime support, to dangerous psychopathy?

Anyone who would propose or support the "three strikes" law is either evil or deluded.

The Republicans, generally speaking, are deluded. They believe that such measures reduce crime. However absurd that belief may be, many people hold it sincerely.

The Clintons never believed that. They supported it because Dick Morris's "triangulation" strategy told them it would get them elected.

Anyone who would support "three strikes" because of personal ambition, as opposed to misguided principle, is indeed a psychopath. Such people evince a depraved indifference for the welfare of others, and do not think twice about harming an entire nation in the furtherance of their personal ambition.

 

[Treacle Toes]

I don't agree with it, but I take your point: you believe that Donald Trump is a better choice for President than Hillary Clinton.

The man who is going to build a wall, and make the Mexican government pay for it.
The man who believes that a judge born in the US to Mexican immigrant parents, is inherently biased.
The man who believes that President Obama is a Muslim Kenyan, not an American.

The man who is going to ..... Make America Great Again.

Why stop there...a man who actively encourages violence against those who don't agree with him...a man with bigoted and damn right oppressive opinions with regard access to abortion, a man who has been openly misogynist, a man who uses the tragedies that others face as a platform to further peddle his own warped sense of authority, a man who has been accused of illegal sexual activity with a minor...the list could be endless...

 

[coley]

Why stop there...a man who actively encourages violence against those who don't agree with him...a man with bigoted and damn right oppressive opinions with regard access to abortion, a man who has been openly misogynist, a man who uses the tragedies that others face as a platform to further peddle his own warped sense of authority, a man who has been accused of illegal sexual activity with a minor...the list could be endless...

No doubt if Trump wins it there will be a massive clear out of liberal minded officials at every level,
A preemptive coup

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

As an afterthought - I don't know whether or not you're eligible to vote in the US election, but there's something else to consider.

The next president will be choosing at least one - and possibly as many as three - Supreme Court Justices. That's arguably the most important thing at stake in this election.

Whatever one might think about Hillary - from my perspective, it will be much preferable if the judges are appointed by Democrats.

With Trump and his Republicans, the choice(s) could end up making Scalia seem like a raging Libertarian.
phildwyer