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Coronavirus in the UK - news, lockdown and discussion

Brainaddict said:
More seriously, that does suck, because you need to assume it is covid with that result. I assume LFTs were negative too. Quite weird.
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As it is my symptoms started Wednesday, so I'd be ok for Xmas day...not that I'm that arsed anyway because I've not got anything arranged.

I don't need to go to work and not planned to see anyone until Friday when my son gets home. Gonna do another LFT but I'm fucked if I'm going to the testing station again.
 
elbows said:
I consider his response inevitable given two factors: His personality and the fact he has been having to deal with a never ending stream of utter bullshit and rancid politics for nearly two years.

I mention his personality because I recall an appearance before a committee soon after the first wave, when some of the expert advisors had started to positioning themselves defensively, even if that meant throwing each other under the bus. He got arsey about a question and called it incredibly facile or words to that effect.

I wont try to catalogue all the bullshit he has had to deal with, but I'm not surprised he gives such questions shorter shrift now than he may have been capable of at the start. Some questions that could charitably have been called fair near the start of the pandemic are really not once we've experienced a number of deadly waves. And the people repeatedly pushing such lines, and the politics behind such stuff, are a disgusting pandemic disgrace.

I've always been rude but even I was capable of explaining stuff with slightly less vitriol at the start of the pandemic than I am now. The pandemic scum have been told the answers to these things plenty of times before, but they carry on regardless. They arent interested in the truth, they ignore the fact we cannot find some way to magically bypass these issues and pretend the pandemic is over when it isnt. Fuck them and their deadly agendas. The likes of Whitty still welcome the opportunity to give an answer to a different sort of audience beyond the core scum who push such lies, bur clearly feel that they can still do that effectively by pointing out what idiotic bullshit politics is involved, rather than giving the benefit of the doubt to those who really dont deserve it. Other approaches may be required to reach some people, but someone else with infinite patience can try that, there is a place for those who will shame and call-out the hideous agendas and inversions of reality. To my eyes Whitty is more effective when he is blunt.
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Ok, I get what you mean. I don't know anything about this particular MP other than seeing them ask the question there, and the way they asked it suggested to me that they were perhaps representing their constituents, as MPs are supposed to, but I may well be missing some context.

I still think that you and I can afford to lose patience with people who haven't learned what seems obvious, but I don't think Whitty can, purely because it's counterproductive. In his job, he needs infinite patience in manner, I think. I thought the main part of his answer did effectively point out and counter the bullshit, bluntly. It was possible to do it without sneering, and he almost did. (But of course he is human.)
 
Whitty did a series of lectures at Gresham college (on Youtube) and he had to re-record one on "Food and Drink Borne Diseases" because of audience interruption ...
 
Well the tweet that I made use of to share that clip here was rude about the MP, but it isnt clear to me whether Whitty himself was meaning to direct his vitriol at the MP as opposed to those who lurk further behind that question. I havent checked the pandemic track record of that MP, but I probably will because that will offer clues.

Whitty needs more patience than me to do his job, but there are limits. And specialities, very much including medical specialities, can easily be a breeding ground for several forms of arrogance. But again I am biased because I'm not even a specialist but was well aware that my style of posting and content of my thoughts left me wide open to accusations of being pompous and arrogant. I decided not to care about that in this pandemic, because I couldnt find a way to make my personality and the pandemic detail and opinions I wanted to express work without also coming across as an aggressive arse at times. So I just have to accept that I wont win popularity contests and that some people wont be receptive to my messages because they dont like the messenger or the style of message delivery. But some of those peoples real problem is actually with the substance, and no matter how polite I was they'd still think I was an arse because they dont accept the pandemic realities as I see them.
 
beesonthewhatnow said:
Round here it looks like “official” parties/gigs etc have gone, but everyone is still heading to the pub, “just in case we can’t soon”. It’s fucking madness, again.
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If there's one thing you should have learned by now, it's that many people struggle to easily weight up the risks posed to them individually and to the people around them by the pandemic, and that some of their assessments of the risks will be quite different from yours. The people to blame for the infections resulting from people going to the pub are the people who are letting the pubs stay open, not the (rapidly dwindling number of) people who're choosing to get the last pint for three months in this weekend.
 
All 3 of us in my flat got the trendy london covid (inevitable once 1 caught it as it is small), so won't be leaving London for a bit. One thing I suggest: if everyone in your house has tested positive but your test shows negative: YOU ARE STILL ALMOST CERTAINLY POSITIVE! so don't e.g. catch a train out of London to "escape", cos you will be taking it with you.

Symptoms are not anything this time round for us, like more minor than a cold; I'd have been out with them, pre covid.

Tbh v glad that all 3 of us got it at once right now, means it will be done before holidays end... would be worse if we got it one at a time and it stretched out.
 
rutabowa said:
All 3 of us in my flat got the trendy london covid (inevitable once 1 caught it as it is small), so won't be leaving London for a bit. One thing I suggest: if everyone in your house has tested positive but your test shows negative: YOU ARE STILL ALMOST CERTAINLY POSITIVE! so don't e.g. catch a train out of London to "escape", cos you will be taking it with you.

Symptoms are not anything this time round for us, like more minor than a cold; I'd have been out with them, pre covid.p
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Are you boostered?
I'm wondering because my kids' dad has tested negative but he looks bloody awful. Unfortunately he hadn't got his booster yet but I would have expected less symptoms this time around.
 
rutabowa said:
All 3 of us in my flat got the trendy london covid (inevitable once 1 caught it as it is small), so won't be leaving London for a bit. One thing I suggest: if everyone in your house has tested positive but your test shows negative: YOU ARE STILL ALMOST CERTAINLY POSITIVE! so don't e.g. catch a train out of London to "escape", cos you will be taking it with you.

Symptoms are not anything this time round for us, like more minor than a cold; I'd have been out with them, pre covid.
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isnt it the second time for you?
 
rutabowa said:
Yep. Dont have a booster yet but in any case it is nothing compared to first time (and the first time wasn't that bad for me). I've been commuting in and working with masses of people, no way I wasn't going to get it.
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yes, I remember you talking about your first round.

Thinking about it, you are the first person I know to get it twice.

Get well and look after yourselves, the 3 of you!
 
klang said:
yes, I remember you talking about your first round.

Thinking about it, you are the first person I know to get it twice.

Get well and look after yourselves, the 3 of you!
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Thanks! Feel fine tbh. Everyone I know who is getting it a 2nd time is getting it mild, that won't be true for everyone I guess but amongst people I know
 
Triggle shit continues to emphasise the idea that strict measures will only delay the inevitable, eg various stuff in this article: Omicron: Will tougher measures stop the spread of Omicron?

I wasnt surprised to see quotes from Paul Hunter, who has become a favourite source for these sort of dismal excuses and picture painting from the Delta wave onwards - not quite the same sort of drooling shithead as Dingwall and Heneghan, he is a milder and more superficially reasonable sounding variant. They arent 100% full of shit, some of what they say is very likely a real part of the picture these days, but an agenda and a particular 'sense of balance' is still in play.

This is contradicted by SAGE modelling group documents, where they even put the word prevented in bold:

www.gov.uk

SPI-M-O: Consensus statement on COVID-19, 15 December 2021

www.gov.uk www.gov.uk

14. Reducing the total number of infections and delaying any wave in the very short term would allow more time for the accelerated booster roll out to take effect. This would also allow many hospitalisations to be prevented as a result, not just delayed.
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editor said:
I haven't spoken to another human for over a week. I live alone. I'm triple jabbed. I will definitely be going to be a pub when my self isolation is over. I don't think that means there's anything wrong with me.
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oh absoloutly. i'll have had 4 days of kids, living alone, come christmas eve. i will go out, but nothign crazy. it's that balance of well being vs risk. isolation can be toxic.
 
elbows said:
Triggle shit continues to emphasise the idea that strict measures will only delay the inevitable, eg various stuff in this article: Omicron: Will tougher measures stop the spread of Omicron?

I wasnt surprised to see quotes from Paul Hunter, who has become a favourite source for these sort of dismal excuses and picture painting from the Delta wave onwards - not quite the same sort of drooling shithead as Dingwall and Heneghan, he is a milder and more superficially reasonable sounding variant. They arent 100% full of shit, some of what they say is very likely a real part of the picture these days, but an agenda and a particular 'sense of balance' is still in play.

This is contradicted by SAGE modelling group documents, where they even put the word prevented in bold:

www.gov.uk

SPI-M-O: Consensus statement on COVID-19, 15 December 2021

www.gov.uk www.gov.uk
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I know you've long since had a bone to pick with Nick Triggle, but hadn't really read what he says directly. I've been doing so in the past couple of weeks and jesus fucking christ he's a dangerous prick, isn't he :eek:
 
Aye, Mation, based on elbows comments, I take whatever triggle says with a dumper load of salt - unless I spot something that I'm aware of from another source.
 
Mation said:
I know you've long since had a bone to pick with Nick Triggle, but hadn't really read what he says directly. I've been doing so in the past couple of weeks and jesus fucking christ he's a dangerous prick, isn't he :eek:
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And his stuff this year is more nuanced than it used to be, what we see now is actually in improvement with slightly more attention paid to credibility and balance!

I go on about him so much not just to pick on him and his shit, or because of quite how bad his sales pitch was on the last day of the March 2020 plan A, but because I fear that with this stuff he is fulfilling a function of the state.

Speaking of which, the formula that has been settled on to explain and justify UK pandemic decision making, no matter how poor the decision making was, is that experts and scientists give the info to the government, and then government has to make difficult choices when balancing that stuff against other priorities. Whitty resorts to explaining this often in press conferences, whenever there are awkward questions sent his way or when a gaping chasm between the science and the government is on clear display.

I mention that now because due to the more heated political situation with the tories at the moment, there have been some signs of politicians going further beyond the cosy description of balance and tough choices. There have been more overt political attacks on the likes of Whitty. And that leads me to something Javid said today. In my opinion Javid is sometimes clumsy with his choice of language, so I suppose I have to be a little bit careful about over-interpreting some of his words. But earlier I saw reports that indicated Javid said they were 'challenging the science'. I was wondering if those words would come back to haunt him, but when I look at the detail it seems he said they needed to challenge the data and the assumptions used. Thats not quite as risky a thing to say, but I still think this shit will come back to haunt them if we have an Omicron catastrophe. The way I would describe the situation is that the picture is certainly messy and there is a wider range of uncertainty with this wave than ever before, and thats not politicians fault, nor can scientists be expected to artificially narrow down the range of possibilities. Many of the dilemmas involved suck, but in my book when there is uncertainty you have to act as though one of the worser-case scenarios will happen, and then be delighted and ease things more quickly if it turns out not to be close to that bad. But of course thats really not how the UK establishment does things, and certainly not how this tory government does them.
 
killer b said:
If there's one thing you should have learned by now, it's that many people struggle to easily weight up the risks posed to them individually and to the people around them by the pandemic, and that some of their assessments of the risks will be quite different from yours. The people to blame for the infections resulting from people going to the pub are the people who are letting the pubs stay open, not the (rapidly dwindling number of) people who're choosing to get the last pint for three months in this weekend.
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Of course those in power take the bulk of the blame. But we’re in exactly the same place we were 12 months ago and people seemingly haven’t learnt a thing. How hard is it to think “hang on a minute, this don’t work last time”…
 
beesonthewhatnow said:
Of course those in power take the bulk of the blame. But we’re in exactly the same place we were 12 months ago and people seemingly haven’t learnt a thing. How hard is it to think “hang on a minute, this don’t work last time”…
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Lots of people have done exactly that, which is why the pubs and restaurants are all panicking 'cause they've got no customers. As for those who are out - they probably aren't following the news that closely, don't think they're very high risk (they probably aren't tbf) and haven't been told not to by the government so they're having a pint. Why wouldn't they?
 
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