Coronavirus in the UK - news, lockdown and discussion

[bluescreen]

There was plenty of that info out there. mrs mx made ours out of old t-shirts - but yes, the government weren't helpful.

I still think that a general announcement that wearing masks would protect people would have led to PPE being diverted from the NHS though, by private sector spivs out for a quick buck. And the absolute priority was protecting frontline NHS staff 18 months ago.

So I sort of understand the policy, whilst detesting the bastards for fucking up.

BIB makes me so savage. An attitude that has fucked up so much of the pandemic response - and much else generally since ever.

 

[elbows]

Yeah the concerns about supply of masks were a real concern, and its why, when the UK government finally started to recommend some of that stuff in May 2020, they used the phrase 'face coverings' instead of masks, initially told people to make them rather than buy them, and got most of the media to follow suit for a time. And then followed a period where the advice slowly evolved further, and recommendations turned into rules, albeit ones with the usual lack of enforcement, and the language used gradually changed too. I think the Scottish authorities were some weeks ahead with masks advice back then too.

Speaking of masks I may as well spell out explicitly that I am something of a pro wrestling fan, with an appreciation for good heel work on the mic and working a crowd. Which is probably one of the reasons why, on the occasions when people might find reason to accuse me of being pompous, self-important etc etc during this pandemic, I am highly likely to play up to that rather than refute it. Same with accusations that I might be a bore, I can provide supporting evidence for that criticism all day long!

 

[existentialist]

This lady talking a load of sense

ETA Susan Michie of SAGE

She said the best way to avoid stronger clampdowns coming down the line is going hard, like, yesterday, and what the gov is doing is Plan B lite, in fact weaker measures than SAGE proposed in Sept before Omicron. So much for listening to the science

Oh, they listen to the science; they just don't hear the science. It's probably drowned out by the sounds of cash registers.

 

[existentialist]

Why don’t you duck off you sanctimonious prick

You might do well to be a little less gratuitously rude to people, since you seem to be in the business of taking things personally.

 

[Yossarian]

Such criticisms about my character didnt put me off from spouting facts at the time and certainly wont now. Stop talking shit about the easily searchable timeline of events.

I got a reminder today of how crap the WHO were at the time when I looked back at a story from Feb. 3 last year - when case numbers were in single digits in the US and European countries, Ghebreyesus strongly advised against travel restrictions, saying they "can cause more harm than good by hindering info-sharing, medical supply chains and harming economies."

Coronavirus: Hong Kong hospital staff strike to demand closure of China border

Workers want the border with mainland China completely shut - but authorities insist it stays open.

www.bbc.com

 

[elbows]

I got a reminder today of how crap the WHO were at the time when I looked back at a story from Feb. 3 last year - when case numbers were in single digits in the US and European countries, Ghebreyesus strongly advised against travel restrictions, saying they "can cause more harm than good by hindering info-sharing, medical supply chains and harming economies."

Coronavirus: Hong Kong hospital staff strike to demand closure of China border

Workers want the border with mainland China completely shut - but authorities insist it stays open.

www.bbc.com

Yes I was moaning about that sort of thing from the WHO just the other day, although I do acknowledge that there are also some good historical reasons why some of that stuff is baked into the international health regulations.

It still ends up featuring depressing shit though, more signs of the neoliberal world in which the WHO operates, and what the priorities were.

Take for example these bits from the January 30th 2020 WHO statement where they got round to declaring things to be a public health emergency of international concern, having failed to agree about doing that during their previous meeting:

From a section specifically geared towards China:

Conduct exit screening at international airports and ports, with the aim of early detection of symptomatic travellers for further evaluation and treatment, while minimizing interference with international traffic.

From the section about Temporary Recommendations (a specific category described in the International Health Regulations) applicable to all countries and 'the global community':

The Committee does not recommend any travel or trade restriction based on the current information available.

Countries must inform WHO about travel measures taken, as required by the IHR. Countries are cautioned against actions that promote stigma or discrimination, in line with the principles of Article 3 of the IHR.

Under Article 43 of the IHR, States Parties implementing additional health measures that significantly interfere with international traffic (refusal of entry or departure of international travellers, baggage, cargo, containers, conveyances, goods, and the like, or their delay, for more than 24 hours) are obliged to send to WHO the public health rationale and justification within 48 hours of their implementation. WHO will review the justification and may request countries to reconsider their measures. WHO is required to share with other States Parties the information about measures and the justification received.

There is a lot of stuff in the same document that is much better, but also some things that demonstrate an obvious contradiction compared to the above, one of which I've put in bold in this quote:

Countries should place particular emphasis on reducing human infection, prevention of secondary transmission and international spread, and contributing to the international response though multisectoral communication and collaboration and active participation in increasing knowledge on the virus and the disease, as well as advancing research.

Statement on the second meeting of the International Health Regulations (2005) Emergency Committee regarding the outbreak of novel coronavirus (2019-nCoV)

Following the advice of the Emergency Committee today, WHO Director-General has declared the outbreak of novel coronavirus (2019-nCoV) a Public Health Emergency of International Concern. In China, more than 7700 cases have been confirmed, and 170 people have died. There are 82 additional cases...

www.who.int

 

[elbows]

And on a bunch of later occasions during the pandemic, I made derogatory references to this press release that the WHO put out nearly a month later, in late February 2020:

A Joint Statement on Tourism and COVID-19 - UNWTO and WHO Call for Responsibility and Coordination

As the current outbreak of the Coronavirus Disease (COVID-19) continues to develop, the World Health Organization (WHO) and the World Tourism Organization (UNWTO) are committed to working together in guiding the travel and tourism sectors’ response to COVID-19.On 30 January 2020, the...

www.who.int

A Joint Statement on Tourism and COVID-19 - UNWTO and WHO Call for Responsibility and Coordination​

​

As the current outbreak of the Coronavirus Disease (COVID-19) continues to develop, the World Health Organization (WHO) and the World Tourism Organization (UNWTO) are committed to working together in guiding the travel and tourism sectors’ response to COVID-19.

On 30 January 2020, the Director-General of the World Health Organization (WHO) declared the outbreak of COVID-19 to be a Public Health Emergency of International Concern and issued a set of Temporary Recommendations. WHO did not recommend any travel or trade restriction based on the current information available. WHO is working closely with global experts, governments and partners to rapidly expand scientific knowledge on this new virus, to track the spread and virulence of the virus, and to provide advice to countries and the global community on measures to protect health and prevent the spread of this outbreak.

The tourism sector is fully committed to putting people and their well-being first. International cooperation is vital for ensuring the sector can effectively contribute to the containment of COVID-19. UNWTO and WHO are working in close consultation and with other partners to assist States in ensuring that health measures be implemented in ways that minimize unnecessary interference with international traffic and trade.

Tourism’s response needs to be measured and consistent, proportionate to the public health threat and based on local risk assessment, involving every part of the tourism value chain – public bodies, private companies and tourists, in line with WHO’s overall guidance and recommendations.

UNWTO and WHO stand ready to work closely with all those communities and countries affected by the current health emergency, to build for a better and more resilient future. Travel restrictions going beyond these may cause unnecessary interference with international traffic, including negative repercussions on the tourism sector.

At this challenging time, UNWTO and WHO join the international community in standing in solidarity with affected countries.

Double-plus 'responsibility'. Neoliberalism good, restrictions bad. Smell the priorities. A health response that was shackled by 'value chains'.

Its fair to say attitudes evolved a tad since then, due to a rather different set of 'negative repercussions' that made themselves felt in the wake of this virus, within weeks of the above being published. So documents like that one havent aged well and rather make my point for me.

 

[Sunray]

* Digs out posh V&A mask *

ya! Been looking for that, by William Morris.

 

[cupid_stunt]

I think bro-in-law is now sorted for quarantine accommodation on his return, somehow arranged from rural Malawi. He's out there, sadly, to say goodbye to an amazing guy who is the head of a school BIL and wife have a charity to fund out there. They met him on their honeymoon, painting a wall at their hotel to help earn some money so he could help teaching kids at the school he worked at because the finance manager had fucked off with all their funds, so they returned home determined to help him fund it and it's now thriving. I had the privilege of meeting the guy once and he really was a great bloke who cared so much - heartbreakingly he's dying of cancer, so BIL wanted to go see him one last time. I think he'll consider it worth it, even with the quarantine.

Did he get back to the UK by 4 am this morning, or has he had to pay out for a government-approved hotel quarantine facility?

 

[Glitter]

I’m in Spain and coming home tomorrow. Do I need a PCR or is it just the day2 lateral flow I bought?

 

[cupid_stunt]

I’m in Spain and coming home tomorrow. Do I need a PCR or is it just the day2 lateral flow I bought?

You should be OK tomorrow, they are bringing in a PCR test for all individuals arriving in the UK from abroad on day two, with self-isolation until a negative test is reported, but it seems not until later in the week, same with masks, I heard someone mention they need a vote in the Commons first.

At a Downing Street news conference on Saturday, the prime minister said Mr Javid would outline the tightening up of the mask rules. He did not indicate when the PCR testing requirements would begin, with the Department for Health saying only that it was among measures to be "introduced from next week".

Covid: Travel and mask rules tightened over Omicron variant

New measures to slow Omicron's spread in England before Christmas are unveiled by Boris Johnson.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[_Russ_]

Did he get back to the UK by 4 am this morning, or has he had to pay out for a government-approved hotel quarantine facility?

I thought it was 4am Tuesday morning?

 

[cupid_stunt]

I thought it was 4am Tuesday morning?

From 4am on Sunday, non-UK and non-Irish residents who have been in Malawi, Mozambique, Zambia and Angola in the previous 10 days will be refused entry into England, officials said. This does not apply to those who have stayed airside and only transited through any of these countries while changing flights.

UK and Irish residents arriving from 4am on Sunday must isolate in a government-approved facility for 10 days. During their stay, they will be required to take a PCR test on day two and day eight.

UK travel red list to include Malawi, Mozambique, Zambia and Angola

From 4am on Sunday, UK and Irish residents returning to England must isolate in an approved facility for 10 days

www.theguardian.com

 

[teqniq]

Absolute fucking clown:

 

[Glitter]

You should be OK tomorrow, they are bringing in a PCR test for all individuals arriving in the UK from abroad on day two, with self-isolation until a negative test is reported, but it seems not until later in the week, same with masks, I heard someone mention they need a vote in the Commons first.

Covid: Travel and mask rules tightened over Omicron variant

New measures to slow Omicron's spread in England before Christmas are unveiled by Boris Johnson.

www.bbc.co.uk

Hmm I’m seeing conflicting things.

As usual the guidance is clear as mud.

 

[kabbes]

My ethnographic research embedded into the higher tiers of capital (aka having a job that forces me into contact with rich people) reveals that there is a massively strong ideological opposition to home working.

You (generic you) might think that’s to do with owning office buildings or shares in Pret or some other principle based on money-generation. It’s not, though. These people own everything anyway, their assets can ride over a speed bump of social change like they’re in a HumVee. It’s to do with power. They like being able to look down from the top and seeing all the people they own. They like wandering down from a big office and feeling the thrum of the machinery that keeps them being important.

 

[Steel Icarus]

Hmm I’m seeing conflicting things.

As usual the guidance is clear as mud.

Any of these wankstains said what day "next week" is for masks, by the way?

 

[cupid_stunt]

Any of these wankstains said what day "next week" is for masks, by the way?

Javid has said from Tuesday.

 

[Kevbad the Bad]

Javid has said from Tuesday.

Thursday it is then

 

[StoneRoad]

Sod waiting - that's what cocked it up last time ! ...

Back to masks in shops etc aka crowded indoor spaces, despite being more than two weeks after my booster.
And I'm doing as much as I can with WFH rather than in the workshop ...

[I have a site visit on Tuesday, the weather might put the kybosh on that, save me having to say "no"]

 

[gentlegreen]

Last August when the government apparently got some sort of a clue regards compulsory mask-wearing, I went shopping for the first time with some trepidation ... it will be interesting to see what happens here this time as mask-wearing has only very recently become a minority activity.

 

[Steel Icarus]

Last August when the government apparently got some sort of a clue regards compulsory mask-wearing, I went shopping for the first time with some trepidation ... it will be interesting to see what happens here this time as mask-wearing has only very recently become a minority activity.

Mask wearing here became a minority activity from Freedom Day

I myself don't have to change my behaviour as I haven't stopped wearing a mask in shops or in public places at work

 

[Cloo]

Of course the 'do not comply' children are not out in full force, bravely risking.... maybe not being let into Tesco if they have someone bloshy at the door and the very vague chance of a fine. It's almost like they've picked the easiest, least costly way to show their 'bravery' against 'oppression'.

 

[_Russ_]

The mask 'rule' doesnt even apply in Pubs and restaurants whether you're sat at the table or not.
In Wales the mask 'rule' was never dropped yet its at the point where only those that want to (including staff) bother with it, none of it has been enforced since the beginning I've yet to see plod help out in any way or even be present its just left to the shop workers.

Whole country is some sick joke now and probably due to get a lot sicker...we is fucked

 

[elbows]

 

[Artaxerxes]

Literally every bit of advice I've had from my GP the last few years.

 

[two sheds]

Literally every bit of advice I've had from my GP the last few years.

And you're still here

 

[Wilf]

Absolut fucking clown:

Astonishing, appalling... again. Things like yes to masks in shops and transport but not in leisure settings... just bizarre. Maybe it's ideological, maybe it's the mythical 'balance' they are always on about, but it's also just fucking stupid. We know full well that masks work and that keeping them on in pubs and elsewhere is hardly an inconvenience... but no. It's as if the government have adopted boris johnson own level of stupidity where he wears a mask but then pulls it down or refuses to wear one in a fucking hospital. They are somehow stuck in some odd place where, along with their bigger long terms fuck ups, something stops them using common sense. There really is a sense that British politics has become configured in such a way that government won't do a thing that attracts public support - mask wearing - that has little cost and saves lives. They genuinely prefer death.

 

[8ball]

Astonishing, appalling... again. Things like yes to masks in shops and transport but not in leisure settings... just bizarre. Maybe it's ideological, maybe it's the mythical 'balance' they are always on about, but it's also just fucking stupid. We know full well that masks work and that keeping them on in pubs and elsewhere is hardly an inconvenience... but no. It's as if the government have adopted boris johnson own level of stupidity where he wears a mask but then pulls it down or refuses to wear one in a fucking hospital. They are somehow stuck in some odd place where, along with their bigger long terms fuck ups, something stops them using common sense. There really is a sense that British politics has become configured in such a way that government won't do a thing that attracts public support - mask wearing - that has little cost and saves lives. They genuinely prefer death.

I think it’s quite likely they have internal battles in the party about it and have adopted a policy of avoiding talking about it to avoid rows, leading to massive incoherence in their outward behaviour.

That Scottish historian guy on GBNews was saying just last night that there was absolutely no evidence that masks help, and some that said it was counterproductive. This was challenged slightly by a guest, but was ultimately left to stand.

 

[sparkybird]

You should be OK tomorrow, they are bringing in a PCR test for all individuals arriving in the UK from abroad on day two, with self-isolation until a negative test is reported, but it seems not until later in the week, same with masks, I heard someone mention they need a vote in the Commons first.

Covid: Travel and mask rules tightened over Omicron variant

New measures to slow Omicron's spread in England before Christmas are unveiled by Boris Johnson.

www.bbc.co.uk

Not clear on when it's being brought in, but I understand the PCR has to be done BY day two. So you could do it as soon as you get home and hopefully be released a little earlier