Chromebooks - latest news and discussion

[free spirit]

What irreplaceable products have they dropped for you so far?

well, they dropped sketchup, which is pretty much the heart of our business - fair enough they sold it rather than closing it, but a lot of the advantage it had was the integration with other google products, particularly google earth and streetview, which has to be a lot less guaranteed into the future now google ain't involved.

They also completely changed google docs overnight a while back into google drive, which caused significant difficulties until we sussed it out, and still has ballsed up the previous shared file structure we had in place.

Then there's just silly changes they seem to make sometimes, such as the one that buggered up some carefully worked out commissioning sheets using tables etc that means we can no longer fit it all on one side of A4. I've still no idea what they did, just suddenly all the formatting was buggered up on all our documents with tables in them.

and silly stuff like slightly altering the colour palette, so that spreadsheets we've had running for ages end up with slightly different shades being used - minor niggle, but demonstrates their liking of fiddling with bits of it because they can.

It's absolutely amazing software to allow multiple users to edit the same document at the same time from anywhere in the world, and blows microsoft out of the water on that score, but all the fiddling they do in the background does still make me nervous as I know they can and have buggered up the formatting of all our documents on a whim.

 

[slainte]

The direct above post can be exactly applied to the Microsoft Office suite particularly if you include Visio ...sorry but it does

 

[Lazy Llama]

The direct above post can be exactly applied to the Microsoft Office suite particularly if you include Visio ...sorry but it does

With the exception that you don't HAVE to upgrade Visio/Office immediately that a new version is released.

 

[editor]

well, they dropped sketchup, which is pretty much the heart of our business - fair enough they sold it rather than closing it, but a lot of the advantage it had was the integration with other google products, particularly google earth and streetview, which has to be a lot less guaranteed into the future now google ain't involved.

They also completely changed google docs overnight a while back into google drive, which caused significant difficulties until we sussed it out, and still has ballsed up the previous shared file structure we had in place.

Then there's just silly changes they seem to make sometimes, such as the one that buggered up some carefully worked out commissioning sheets using tables etc that means we can no longer fit it all on one side of A4. I've still no idea what they did, just suddenly all the formatting was buggered up on all our documents with tables in them.

and silly stuff like slightly altering the colour palette, so that spreadsheets we've had running for ages end up with slightly different shades being used - minor niggle, but demonstrates their liking of fiddling with bits of it because they can.

It's absolutely amazing software to allow multiple users to edit the same document at the same time from anywhere in the world, and blows microsoft out of the water on that score, but all the fiddling they do in the background does still make me nervous as I know they can and have buggered up the formatting of all our documents on a whim.

I'm struggling hard to think of any (paid) software that I regularly use that hasn't had its annoyances when it's been 'upgraded' to newer versions. I still find the newer versions of Word more frustrating than the the earlier ones.

 

[editor]

With the exception that you don't HAVE to upgrade Visio/Office immediately that a new version is released.

But then you haven't shelled out a King's ransom for the software. You pays yer money etc....

 

[slainte]

Well if you work with say Visio im afraid you do have to (ie pay and upgrade) for if others whom send you visio documents DONT save the format to an earlier version...you cannot open it only view (with a 3rd party viewer or visio viewer embedded in a browser ) so you are FORCED to upgrade...oh... or you can if not too complicated view in google drawings and save off ......or use lucidchart for example..which are google cloud and chrome store based products bypassing paying out a lot of money for example viso professional 2013 is over 700 pounds..thats a lot of money..

 

[Lazy Llama]

You appear to have missed/ignored the word "immediately" in my post.
Maybe I should have highlighted it.

 

[slainte]

However you still really need the functions of Visio for embedded and layered diagrams so when a version comes out after a few months you have to shell out and they move functions around or off then re-apply again in a later version ...very very frustrating.

 

[Lazy Llama]

I don't think anyone is holding up Microsoft's Office suite as a paragon of consistency.

If they are, I'll track them down and force .pptx files up their nose.

Just that in an organisation, what version of software people are using (and any problems in newly released versions) can be controlled to some extent. If you hand upgrading of your apps to someone else, as well as the advantage of always having the latest version you have to live with whatever fuck-ups they make with no way of reverting.

Just look at the howls of protest every time one of the world's most commonly used cloud-based app gets updated - "hate Facebook change" - about 410,000,000 results!

 

[slainte]

All good comments but far from ...chromebooks ..still for most people ie at home etc. with the right printer its perfectly adaquate..

 

[editor]

I don't think anyone is holding up Microsoft's Office suite as a paragon of consistency.

If they are, I'll track them down and force .pptx files up their nose.

Just that in an organisation, what version of software people are using (and any problems in newly released versions) can be controlled to some extent. If you hand upgrading of your apps to someone else, as well as the advantage of always having the latest version you have to live with whatever fuck-ups they make with no way of reverting.

Just look at the howls of protest every time one of the world's most commonly used cloud-based app gets updated - "hate Facebook change" - about 410,000,000 results!

Although for some people, I'd imagine not having to manually faff about with OS updates (and then the ordeal of some programs no longer working) will prove a real attraction.

 

[UnderOpenSky]

I cant remember the last time I had to faf with an OS update other than maybe waiting a few seconds longer on shutdown for them to install.

 

[editor]

I cant remember the last time I had to faf with an OS update other than maybe waiting a few seconds longer on shutdown for them to install.

That's fantastic, but I really wouldn't assume that it's the same story for everyone else.

 

[UnderOpenSky]

Is there a special version of Windows you use that gives you all this hassle?

 

[editor]

Is there a special version of Windows you use that gives you all this hassle?

Please feel free to peruse Mac/Windows forums and see just how seamless simply everyone has found major OS upgrades. By the sounds of things, you're going to be in for a bit of a shock!

 

[UnderOpenSky]

People on tech forums having problems shocker.

 

[editor]

People on tech forums having problems shocker.

Oh come on. You know that major OS upgrades can cause real problems for a lot of less tech-savy people, and although Chrome OS won't be without its faults, it's clearly an easier process for average users:

One reason is that because Google seems to be living up to its pledge to “constantly iterate,” frequently tweaking and upgrading ChromeOS. In practice, that just means that Google downloads updates in the background, with a little “up arrow” appearing on the screen next to the system clock. With Windows or even the Mac, updating can mean a laborious process of saving, shutting down and rebooting that can take minute after endless minute. With the Chromebox, the whole process took me 21 seconds the last time - including being restored to what I was doing before I upgraded. And it felt faster than that

Ironically, the biggest thing missing from ChromeOS is actually a big positive: the lack of day-to-day management tasks is a joy and a time saver. I don’t need to constantly worry about upgrading numerous browsers, software, apps and patches. There’s no reason to believe that I’ll ever need antivirus software and the constant updates and scanning that entails. Google’s ChromeOS upgrades themselves bring new features, not compatibility concerns.

http://readwrite.com/2012/08/16/my-month-with-a-chromebox-how-i-survived-without-windows-or-mac

 

[Kid_Eternity]

You were given incorrect advice. I deal with many companies who use a complete Google infrastructure for email, docs, IM, calendars. And these are big global companies too.

The views came from global entities with tens of thousands of employees. It's clear that Google cannot at this stage be trusted.

 

[Kid_Eternity]

I cant remember the last time I had to faf with an OS update other than maybe waiting a few seconds longer on shutdown for them to install.

Indeed. Using Mac OS has been remarkably simple compared the sheer torture of Windows updating...

 

[slainte]

Really Mac OS has been simple for simple upgrading compared to windows really so Mavericks which by default does not have a boot disk requires you to hack the Darwin Kernel or use 3rd Party pre made packages to get your EFI to recognise your 3rd party harddisk if you have upgraded your harddisk like I did to a crucial memory SSD drive as frankly
a the size wasn't there for my macbook pro ie a 1TB SSD within reasonable prices.
b I have to spend over 4 hours getting it to recognise the new drive then restore from the time machine which
c wouldn't have been possible at all if I wasn't highly technically competent.

http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/385171/os-x-mavericks-wipes-data-on-western-digital-drives

http://www.macworld.com/article/2056561/how-to-make-a-bootable-mavericks-install-drive.html

https://discussions.apple.com/docs/DOC-6201

Bricking existing bootcamp partition that took another 2 days

https://discussions.apple.com/message/23471204#23471204

http://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=47&topicid=133502&page_no=2

What was that about pain free upgrades on OSX sorry...Im all ears...

Windows also..sorry moving my windows 7 64bit to windows.old loosing all my licence keys even running the sys until exe and having to re-install all programs even though it was an "upgrade"

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows-8/restore-files-upgrade-windows-old

Which didn't work correctly I might add

Sorry ...

 

[strung out]

Generally I'd agree that Windows can be a pain, and Mac OS virtually seamless, but Mavericks was a disaster and broke loads of stuff. Eventually I just had to stop using some apps until certain things were fixed.

 

[Lazy Llama]

ChromeOS upgrades for unchanged hardware will be as seamless as those for Macs with unchanged hardware - generally very seamless.

They make this seamless by supporting a limited set of hardware. That's always been Apple's advantage - they don't have to support WhakiClone CPUs from Ulan Bator because they don't sell machines with those in.

Windows has to support anything someone decides to put into a PC, or at least the manufacturer has to write and maintain drivers. So if there's no working driver for your disk controller in Windows 9, you're probably not going to be upgrading.

The Chromebook is based on the same idea of a limited set of hardware. You cannot add new hardware and associated drivers that are not supported and expect it to continue working after the next upgrade.

 

[Kid_Eternity]

Generally I'd agree that Windows can be a pain, and Mac OS virtually seamless, but Mavericks was a disaster and broke loads of stuff. Eventually I just had to stop using some apps until certain things were fixed.

No disaster for me, only one app didn't work.

 

[slainte]

Good for you...on that front however there was a lot of issues for a lot of people whom did upgrade to Mavericks which is why I suspect they made it free..ie you cant really complain when its free can you per se.
I sorted out mine in the end and my bootcamp ..just waiting for Symantec to update their PGP full disk encryption for Mavericks and I should be good to go.

Anyway...apart from google docs for business and the merits and negatives of both windows and Macintosh machines there is still plenty of room for some people whom a chromebook will function as their primary machine dependant on needs(surfing browsing the odd printing and viewing you tube etc. etc. ) and plenty of room for others whom require or may want a second machine rather than spending a large amount to get a decent laptop with good keyboard over a tablet for instance.
When you add for the for home user free google apps and docs and 100 Gig cloud storage for 2 years. its not a bad deal and you cannot really say its not ...unless again there is something I am missing.

 

[free spirit]

I'm struggling hard to think of any (paid) software that I regularly use that hasn't had its annoyances when it's been 'upgraded' to newer versions. I still find the newer versions of Word more frustrating than the the earlier ones.

yeah, but you actually have to go out and install the new version, and your old files remain the same in the old format.

with docs when it updates it updates for all files, so when they tweaked the table formatting, it then automatically adjusted the formatting on every document we had saved with them, at least it did when the file was opened

 

[editor]

The Chromebook is based on the same idea of a limited set of hardware. You cannot add new hardware and associated drivers that are not supported and expect it to continue working after the next upgrade.

It takes it much further though, by virtue of almost everything going through the browser, so that the user doesn't need to need to install and update endless third party apps.

 

[souljacker]

The views came from global entities with tens of thousands of employees. It's clear that Google cannot at this stage be trusted.

I'm not sure how you can say they can't be trusted but I accept that some IT decision makers wouldn't be prepared to take on their model. I wouldn't dismiss it as a solution though. I've seen it work well in a few different places but they obviously have different needs to the companies you deal with.

 

[editor]

I'm not sure how you can say they can't be trusted but I accept that some IT decision makers wouldn't be prepared to take on their model. I wouldn't dismiss it as a solution though. I've seen it work well in a few different places but they obviously have different needs to the companies you deal with.

I wonder who these unnamed "global entities with tens of thousands of employees" are?

 

[Kid_Eternity]

Wonder all you like Mr Shill no one in their right mind can post information like that.

 

[editor]

Stepping aside from the tales of fantasy "global entities" and the worryingly unhinged hysteria about "shills," it seems that Chromebooks really are starting to make an impact in education in the US.

The Wall Street Journal directs our attention to new research from Futuresource Consulting showing that Chromebooks’ share of the K-12 market for tablets and laptops exploded from just 1% in 2012 to 19% in 2013. What’s more, Windows’s share of the same market declined from 47.5% to 28% over the same period.

What’s more, it looks like Chromebooks are invading higher education as well. TheJournal notes that “data from IDC analyst Rajani Singh that includes purchases by U.S. colleges and universities as well as K-12 schools shows a similar pattern, as well as signs of stagnation for Apple’s iPad in the education market.”

http://bgr.com/2014/01/24/chromebook-school-sales-analysis-2/

More:

For Microsoft, Chromebooks add to the already stiff competition that emerged after the iPad arrived in 2010. IDC said the software company's share of sales to schools and higher education, which hit 77% in 2010, had dwindled to 43% by the 2013 third quarter.

The iPad had grabbed 10% of that market by early 2011 and 27% in last year's third quarter. But that is a percentage point lower than the same period in 2012, and other IDC data also point to slowing share gains.

Apple's Mac computers, meantime, have seen their share of school and college purchasing fall to 15% in the first three quarters of 2013 from 17% in 2012. Chromebooks took 12% of that market by the third quarter.

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304856504579338941198812358