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Brixton Liveable Neighbourhood and LTN schemes - improvements for pedestrians and cyclists

Gramsci said:
As Im on the roads all day and know a lot of people who work on the roads providing a service for other people thought Id post what I have been hearing from the horses mouth so to speak,
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Gramsci , you are probably showing too much empathy on this thread. I have seen posts here mostly by the backrow that are almost Victorian in their attitude to the grubby working classes, plumbers and ‘gong farmers for example which is one reason why I find myself here less and less.
 
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One Lambeth now trying to raise at least £30,000 for legal action.

It looks like they have so far spent about £6500, with about £2000 crowdfunded and £4000 from "private donations".

URGENT LAMBETH LEGAL ACTION FUNDRAISING

https://www.gofundme.com/f/OneLambeth

Today we are submitting our pre-action letter to the Council notifying them that we are going to take legal action against them in the form of Statutory Review against ALL Lambeth Low Traffic Neighbourhoods (LTNs).

Statutory Review is the normal means by which to challenge traffic orders and unfortunately is not amenable to Legal Aid.

Our current Crowdfund has reached £2180 but is due to finish this evening.

We have so far paid £5340 for legal advice and £1200 for the pre-action letter funded by private donations and the urgent Paypal fundraising.

WE NEED TO URGENTLY RAISE £30,000 (and up to £50,000) to pay for legal expenses:

  • Barrister Advice on Councils’ response to our pre-action letter (they have 14 days to reply) and application to the Court for Statutory Review of all Lambeth LTNs – £2000-£3000
  • Court fees – up to £30,000
  • Potential costs of paying the council’s legal fees if we lose - capped at £5000 per client under the Aarhus Convention (but risk of up to £50,000 if capping not granted by the courts)

PLEASE SHARE THIS FUNDRAISING PAGE FAR AND WIDE:

  • On local Facebook groups
  • On local resident WhatsApp groups
  • On Twitter
  • Please speak to and write to local businesses large and small and ask them to support us

We have written to our councillors and Council transport planners, they have dismissed us.

We have written to our MPs, they have ignored us.

We have written to the Department of Transport and Grant Shapps, they have done nothing.

We have protested outside the Town Hall, the Council locked the doors.

We have presented delegations to a Council meeting; they refused to take us seriously.

Our petitions have gathered thousands of signatures, but the Council are not interested.

Council elections are not until 2022, by which time the will have made the LTNs permanent. Therefore the most direct course of action to reverse the LTNs is to take legal action against Lambeth Council.

We MUST challenge them in the courts

We MUST stand up for our communities and vulnerable neighbours

We MUST protect our local businesses

We MUST fight for our democracy

We MUST remind them that THEY serve US.

We WILL stand together and rise up against Lambeth! OneLambeth
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Pickman's model said:
i am asking you what you consider the differences between the two to be. do you not understand simple questions?
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I think it's unclear, as both are imprecise definitions and indeed either one could potentially be considered a subset of the other.

In an attempt to prevent the discussion on this thread from being further disrupted by your enquiries, I will respond to further queries on the "thread for actual pedants".
 
teuchter said:
I think it's unclear, as both are imprecise definitions and indeed either one could potentially be considered a subset of the other.

In an attempt to prevent the discussion on this thread from being further disrupted by your enquiries, I will respond to further queries on the "thread for actual pedants".
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perhaps you need to pay better attention to what 1L are saying as they don't seem to differentiate between crowdfunding and private donations

they say their current crowdfund has raised around £2k. it's perfectly possible the private donations they mention are the private donations they have received through earlier crowdfunding. they seem to have used paypal in extremis but appear to prefer gofundme to pp.
 
Pickman's model said:
perhaps you need to pay better attention to what 1L are saying as they don't seem to differentiate between crowdfunding and private donations

they say their current crowdfund has raised around £2k. it's perfectly possible the private donations they mention are the private donations they have received through earlier crowdfunding. they seem to have used paypal in extremis but appear to prefer gofundme to pp.
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Many things are perfectly possible. If you seek clarification on their ambiguous wording you need to pester them rather than me.
 
teuchter said:
One Lambeth now trying to raise at least £30,000 for legal action.

It looks like they have so far spent about £6500, with about £2000 crowdfunded and £4000 from "private donations".
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£380 raised so far. We want to stop the LTNs, ok give us £30k, suddenly not so keen. Thirty grand could be used so much more effectively in the community rather than paying for expensive lawyers and costs if you lose
 
Not a Vet said:
£380 raised so far. We want to stop the LTNs, ok give us £30k, suddenly not so keen. Thirty grand could be used so much more effectively in the community rather than paying for expensive lawyers and costs if you lose
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You think it’s going on lawyers?. All that astroturfing doesn’t pay for itself...
 
Councillor Tim Briggs again.

www.conservativehome.com

Tim Briggs: The Left are using Low Traffic Neighbourhoods to bring local businesses to a halt | Conservative Home

In an open society, people and businesses have the freedom to move around; to take advantage of opportunity.
www.conservativehome.com www.conservativehome.com

Here's the best bit

The knock-on effect of imposing more Low Traffic Neighbourhoods is circular, because people then want more Low Traffic Neighbourhoods to protect their own areas from increased traffic. Yet if a Council made every non-main road a Low Traffic Neighbourhood, food supplies in London would be disrupted, and law and order would quickly break down.
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and also

When Wandsworth cancels its LTNs, it allows people and capital to flow again. That enables wealth to carry on being created at the same rate, and for individuals and business to be connected as wealth creators, and as consumers of goods and services, at lower cost. Meanwhile Lambeth, with its gridlocked roads and struggling businesses, can only become poorer and more closed off for as long as badly-implemented LTNs are kept in place.
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I was chatting to a Poet's corner couple the other day. Husband is a huge fan of the LTN as the street is quieter. He cycled before but finds it more pleasant now. Wife says she won't use Railton Road after dark anymore by foot or bike because it feels deserted and unsafe. She is using the car more for short trips after dark.
 
Strange as I find Railton Rd is now busier with pedestrians and cyclists than it was before - even after dark and doesn’t (for me) feel less safe.

The only current threat I see is One Lambeth fb posters I can recognise driving through the gates, and tail gating me when I’m cycling.
 
I only just discovered that you can plot air pollution records here:

London Air Quality Network :: Welcome to the London Air Quality Network » Statistics Maps

London Air Quality Network :: the comprehensive source of information about air pollution in London
www.londonair.org.uk www.londonair.org.uk

There's a lot of people claiming that the LTNs have increased congestion on main roads, and that this in turn has led to a surge in air pollution levels along those main roads.

My first response to that is that we don't know the contribution of LTNs to congestion. And I'm not sure if the increase in congestion is really as stark as is claimed (it might be - I don't know).

But, there is an air monitoring site on Brixton Road (I think this is the one that famously recorded the worst in London, or Europe, or something?) and there is one at Streatham Green. Both of them on main roads where there have been reports of increasing congestion. I graphed each of them from this time last year, up until now.

Here is Brixton Road:
Screen Shot 2020-11-05 at 13.37.32.jpg

And here is Streatham Green:

Screen Shot 2020-11-05 at 13.37.44.jpg

I should be a bit cautious interpreting them because I'm not an expert in this.

But the way it looks to me, they both record an improvement through lockdown, and then a gradual increase afterwards. In both cases, it appears to be a return to something similar to the levels we saw in November last year, pre Covid and pre LTNs. I don't see any evidence of things being worse. I don't see any out-of-the ordinary spikes.

In fact, I realise I need to do some reading on the connection between congestion and air pollution. If you read One Lambeth, etc, it seems to be taken for granted that traffic jams = more pollution. Is that true, especially now with start-stop engines? A traffic jam means a very low number of vehicles passing any location per hour. Is a constant stream of very slowly moving traffic worse than a constant stream of faster traffic? In either case the road is constantly occupied by vehicles creating emissions. The obvious improvement might be to reduce the amount of road that can be filled with those vehicles, might it not?
 
Here's a three-year period for comparison.

Interestingly these reveal a regular, big summer/winter difference. I think you can still see a quite strong "lockdown effect" in the Brixton Road one (top) but not so much in the Streatham Green one.

Brixton Road data unfortunately seems to have a gap in it.

Screen Shot 2020-11-05 at 13.57.49.jpgScreen Shot 2020-11-05 at 13.57.59.jpg
 
snowy_again said:
Strange as I find Railton Rd is now busier with pedestrians and cyclists than it was before - even after dark and doesn’t (for me) feel less safe.

The only current threat I see is One Lambeth fb posters I can recognise driving through the gates, and tail gating me when I’m cycling.
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Not sure it's what I'd call strange. I agreed with her that Railton feels deserted a lot of the time but agree with you that it does not make me feel unsafe. So there is another take!

I have a friend who asks me to stand in the street and watch them walk/cycle at night past the building you live in, to make sure they reach the main road safely. I don't feel uncomfortable like that and I'm guessing you don't. But they do. Is that strange?

I didn't find cycling on Railton Road problematic before the LTN (and even less so on St Matthews Road) - yet apparently most other people were put off riding bikes altogether by the murderous traffic. So many different perceptions!



I do find the obsession of some with the One FB page is a little strange! But then I've not seen it myself so perhaps I should reserve judgment.
 
It's not really strange, it's quite common I think, a perception that on a road with no traffic on it you are more at risk of attack.

I don't think it's really something that's supported by any evidence, and also, I think you are actually more likely to be assaulted if you're a man. And pedestrians are at most risk of being hit by a car in the hours of darkness.

That doesn't really matter though; it's a perception and it affects people's behaviour and choices. How to deal with it is difficult.
 
These LTNs have been a complete disaster. Poorly implemented.

The one on Railton Road, all that's seems to have done is just cause a backlog of traffic along Coldharbour Lane.

Regularly see people just going through the no entry anyway. Really, what's the point? Is there any evidence this will reduce pollution? All I've seen is frustration for people living in Brixton!
 
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nick said:
repeated from Tulse Hill thread:
Lambeth comms arrive
Streatham Hill LTN will be enforced from 12 Nov onwards - Toll for taking a shortcut will be £130 one way

6mth ETO with consultation period started 26 Oct. You can vent or applaud here: Streatham Hill Low Traffic Neighbourhood
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They said it would start June in St Matthew's Road and on Railton. Most gates still have no cameras so enforcement is sporadic at best. Consultation period still not started apparently. Or maybe it has now and will be usual Lambeth consultation which they notify people of the day after it ends. Who knows.
 
nick said:
repeated from Tulse Hill thread:
Lambeth comms arrive
Streatham Hill LTN will be enforced from 12 Nov onwards - Toll for taking a shortcut will be £130 one way

6mth ETO with consultation period started 26 Oct. You can vent or applaud here: Streatham Hill Low Traffic Neighbourhood
Click to expand...
First few thoughts posted on One Lambeth:

this is made to make money
--obviously. Nothing else.
--I've heard some boroughs have raked in nearly 400,000 in fines already. It's basically a quicker way than upping council tax. I'm hoping they get rid of it but I think they want to make money first before they do

Anything to make money.

It’s an absolute joke!!.. Helping me to walk and cycle?...NO!! Your trying to force us to do this..I don’t want to walk or cycle..I want to be able to drive my car after all that’s what I pay ROAD tax for isn’t it? I am sick to my back teeth of this s**t show!
 
teuchter said:
First few thoughts posted on One Lambeth:

this is made to make money
--obviously. Nothing else.
--I've heard some boroughs have raked in nearly 400,000 in fines already. It's basically a quicker way than upping council tax. I'm hoping they get rid of it but I think they want to make money first before they do

Anything to make money.

It’s an absolute joke!!.. Helping me to walk and cycle?...NO!! Your trying to force us to do this..I don’t want to walk or cycle..I want to be able to drive my car after all that’s what I pay ROAD tax for isn’t it? I am sick to my back teeth of this s**t show!
Click to expand...
So fairly positive response
 
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