Are we getting 'sexualities' confused with mindsets?

[Reno]

I think it's healthy that people who don't want a traditional, heteronormative relationship, are finding relationship models which suit them. To give these identifying names, makes it easier for likeminded partners to find each other. I don't agree that most of them are sexualities even if they can be combined with wherever one is on the sexuality spectrum. They are an alternative to a relationship model which in the Western world comes out of Christianity. Monogamy isn't a sexuality either and not more "natural" than polygamy or anything else on that list, they all are choices.

 

[Edie]

Good luck to our young people making sense of the world and how to live.

 

[mauvais]

I'm being grumpy today but I think it's a load of shit and I think it probably is harmful.

"Attraction fades after initially meeting someone" is a lot of things. It's normal, for one. It implies and reinforces a shallow/superficial outlook. It's a presumed outcome with no reflective element and it's emotionally lazy - no 'why am I like this?' or 'what is it I'm really looking for?' or 'what would be a more insightful way to make assessments about people?' or 'what can I do with this identified pattern?' - just that that is what you are and must be, like Santino said. It suggests immutability of behaviour regardless of context.

It's politically toxic because, as well as classic idpol consequences, the trajectory is likely towards equivalence with other identities or characteristics that exist for reasons of discrimination.

And fundamentally this is like a spreadsheet formula for a person - perhaps how you would program a character in a videogame. It tries to turn a whole load complex factors producing something on a continuous spectrum (or set of them) into a weird factional label.

 

[freakydave]

If your sexuality involves deriving pleasure without others' consent then you should indeed recognise that and try to get some help to find a more healthy way to attain fulfillment.

Well some people also like to be the victim and they are attracted to people who treat them badly

 

[Little Piranha]

Well some people also like to be the victim and they are attracted to people who treat them badly

I don't think most people who find themselves being repeatedly treated badly in relationships are doing it because they 'like it'. It is often a combination of low self esteem and vulnerability. And as S*I pointed out, if someone is cheating they have by definition betrayed an understanding.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I agree with Reno that these aren't sexualities, and that they involve choices to a greater or lesser degree. I don't think sexuality really involves much choice, if any.

As for that list, I would think most people will be many of those things at different times in their lives or wrt different people. It does seem odd to try to essentialise things like that, but hey we do like our systems. Probably harmless, if a little mystifying.

 

[freakydave]

I don't think most people who find themselves being repeatedly treated badly in relationships are doing it because they 'like it'. It is often a combination of low self esteem and vulnerability. And as S*I pointed out, if someone is cheating they have by definition betrayed an understanding.

Yes but this is why those categories are stupid

It's the same thing. What about someone who only watches porn and doesn't even try to have sexual relationships, that isn't a sexual preference, that's a situation.

 

[freakydave]

Yeah I saw someone saying the other day, ‘Demi’ just means you had a pretty healthy upbringing. There is resentment in some quarters at the appropriation of the whole language of being different by people who are just not.

Sorry I didn't see this and that is what I hate. Everyone wants to be oppressed and special, it's all twisted. When I was a teenager it was the early 90s and all you had to do was be depressed and play guitar to be interesting.

 

[Clair De Lune]

I see it a bit like those personality or relationship quizzes you'd get in teen magazines when I was younger...we like to be categorised and find others like ourselves. Like oooh I'm a libra and so I like this and my colour is blue and my gemstone is amethyst and my season is autumn.

 

[planetgeli]

I see it a bit like those personality or relationship quizzes you'd get in teen magazines when I was younger...we like to be categorised and find others like ourselves. Like oooh I'm a libra and so I like this and my colour is blue and my gemstone is amethyst and my season is autumn.

And here's my flag...

 

[bellaozzydog]

My only issue with this is it stokes daily mail outrage headlines and gives all the miserable gammon shitheads another “lefties/progressives/woke/millennial” bullshit brain hernia

do what the fuck you want, call yourself what you want but any further than the currently recognised categories that fuckwits can barely even manage to comprehend just keep it to yourself and your instagram
We are all special individual human beings no need to over egg the categories of humanity into a dungeons and dragons/furries/sci-fi pastiche

98% of the population have no idea what you are going on about

Having said that, 15 years down the line you’ll all be unhappily divorced with children who you don’t understand, a wopping mortgage and a life you hate so may as well make the most of it while you can

used to be you dyed your hair purple, pierced something and wanked someone off that your parent would struggle with.

Same shit different generation

 

[Pickman's model]

I see it a bit like those personality or relationship quizzes you'd get in teen magazines when I was younger...we like to be categorised and find others like ourselves. Like oooh I'm a libra and so I like this and my colour is blue and my gemstone is amethyst and my season is autumn.

The libra stone isn't amethyst but it should be

 

[Pickman's model]

Sorry I didn't see this and that is what I hate. Everyone wants to be oppressed and special, it's all twisted. When I was a teenager it was the early 90s and all you had to do was be depressed and play guitar to be interesting.

It's like that every decade

 

[nogojones]

What's with all the flags that go with them? I also can't help seeing Fray and thinking of steak and kidney pies, which is quite appropriate given it's description: attraction fades after initially tasting one.

piesexual

 

[WouldBe]

We're going to need a bigger banner when LGBTQ+ isn't adequate enough.

 

[Thora]

It's just a young person thing, we're not meant to understand

 

[danny la rouge]

piesexual

That’s me. From now on, I identify as piesexual.

 

[Sweet FA]

Over the last few years, I've watched this play out with my daughter and her friends (now 15). At one point, everyone was something. Importantly I think, they were all something different to each other but it was their thing as a group. At one point I asked her why they all needed to have a label and got roll-eyed to fuck. I just didn't understand apparently. Which was true tbf.

I thought it was pretty cool really. I cannot imagine someone at school when I was 13 even saying they were gay. I like that they can talk about it. Christ, being a long haired metal kid and liking a mod band like Secret Affair was enough to get a kicking, let alone discussing sexuality.

It also gave massive scope for dadgags when my niece declared herself 'pan' at the age of 12. All it took to cause a omigoooooood daaaad was for me to look lasciviously at a saucepan.

 

[Clair De Lune]

And here's my flag...

The flag thing is weird as fuck isn't it? like flags generally are a weird and outdated/throw back thing I cant believe humans still practice...but now we've all got to have a flag!

 

[xenon]

It's not all kids though, judging by OKCupid. Poly seems quite vogue.

It's just greedy IMO.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

.but now we've all got to have a flag!

 

[Cloo]

I'm being grumpy today but I think it's a load of shit and I think it probably is harmful.

"Attraction fades after initially meeting someone" is a lot of things. It's normal, for one. It implies and reinforces a shallow/superficial outlook. It's a presumed outcome with no reflective element and it's emotionally lazy - no 'why am I like this?' or 'what is it I'm really looking for?' or 'what would be a more insightful way to make assessments about people?' or 'what can I do with this identified pattern?' - just that that is what you are and must be, like Santino said. It suggests immutability of behaviour regardless of context.

It's politically toxic because, as well as classic idpol consequences, the trajectory is likely towards equivalence with other identities or characteristics that exist for reasons of discrimination.

And fundamentally this is like a spreadsheet formula for a person - perhaps how you would program a character in a videogame. It tries to turn a whole load complex factors producing something on a continuous spectrum (or set of them) into a weird factional label.

I guess there is a risk you could use it as an excuse for treating people shittily - 'Sorry, I know you want a long term relationship but my sexuality is to lose interest in people after initial attraction', 'Sorry, my sexuality is to get all the attention and have the other person do all the work while not making any of the effort myself'

 

[killer b]

It also gave massive scope for dadgags when my niece declared herself 'pan' at the age of 12.

She's a late developer huh. My daughter declared herself 'pan' within weeks of starting high school.

 

[Clair De Lune]

I don't want a flag, I want a new Orleans style band to follow me round announcing my sexuality.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

I guess there is a risk you could use it as an excuse for treating people shittily - 'Sorry, I know you want a long term relationship but my sexuality is to lose interest in people after initial attraction',

but on the other hand, if you're honest and upfront about it (and even wear the flag if you feel so inclined) is that better or worse than having that approach to relationships but not being upfront about it?

 

[xenon]

Sorry I didn't see this and that is what I hate. Everyone wants to be oppressed and special, it's all twisted. When I was a teenager it was the early 90s and all you had to do was be depressed and play guitar to be interesting.

It's never worked for me. Well, not often...

Anyway, It's a bit D&D character sheet, for relationship preferences.

Serious point though, I think the tickbox approach to relationship forming, seaking, this codifying stuff, essentialism as someone said, can potentially tend too, isn't great. An expression of another facit of an atomised individualist culture. Maybe... But probably mostly harmless and WTFDIK.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

and of course the flag thing could be considered discriminatory against people who are colour-blind

like the old hanky code only more so

 

[Reno]

The flag thing is weird as fuck isn't it? like flags generally are a weird and outdated/throw back thing I cant believe humans still practice...but now we've all got to have a flag!

A long as the LGBT+ flag still pisses off the right (wrong!) people it's needed, especially at a time when trans and homophobia is on the rise again in many countries. There is no need for all these other flags though because the rainbow is supposed to symbolise inclusivity of all sexual minorities.

Putin ridicules US embassy for flying LGBT+ pride flag

Russian president’s comments follow referendum defining marriage as between a man and a woman

www.independent.co.uk

 

[Cloo]

but on the other hand, if you're honest and upfront about it (and even wear the flag if you feel so inclined) is that better or worse than having that approach to relationships but not being upfront about it?

TBF, the second example I made up there is basically called 'Being a narcissist'. Won't get many admitting to that one.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

There is no need for all these other flags though because the rainbow is supposed to symbolise inclusivity of all sexual minorities.

it may be 'supposed to' but surely these other flags etc only happen because there are people out there who do not feel included under the rainbow flag?

there are pockets of intolerance within the LGBT+ 'community' (the 'straight acting' / anti 'camp' mindset, racism, bi-phobia and transphobia are the most noticeable, but i've also seen it towards gay men who - in the view of whoever it is - have too much / too little sex, or who do / don't indulge in particular sorts of sexual activity...)

there are people out there who argue that there is no need for the rainbow either, but we're getting close to the "all lives matter" school of thought there...