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Anti-Japanese sentiment in Asia

Jay Park

Quasi-Hobo
Banned
Does anyone have anything to say regarding the resentment (and in a lot of cases plain and simple racism) by people in Asia toward the Japanese, due to some of the crimes committed during their imperial occupation of China, Korea etc at the earlier part of last century. I remember reading some stuff about how the Chinese economic reformer Deng Xiaoping and his advisers (at the time he was chief executive of the communist party) highlighted Japanese atrocities and brought them back into media and effectively pushed these acts into the collective thought as a means to encourage and perpetuate Chinese nationalism. I also know that certain groups, such as those Korean ladies who we're used as comfort women still camp outside the Japanese embassy in Seoul every Sunday demanding an apology and reparations, though neither of which seem to be forthcoming. Some very inhumane and grotesque acts we're carried out by the imperial Japanese armed forces, civilians having their tongues cut out in Hong Kong being just one example. But can anyone throw some light on how much, or how little Japan has made an effort to atone for these crimes. I'm often made to feel like a Japanese war crime apologist when trying to objectively discuss such matters.
 
But can anyone throw some light on how much, or how little Japan has made an effort to atone for these crimes. I'm often made to feel like a Japanese war crime apologist when trying to objectively discuss such matters.

Hi man. Look, the last time I replied to one of your posts, I was taking the piss a bit . . . so what follows is a genuine response to your genuine question.

My understanding is that official Japan has made little or no real attempt to atone or even acknowledge the crimes of the wartime Japanese government.

As for being made to feel like an atrocity apologist - if you're not making excuses for atrocities, then you have nothing to worry about on that score.
 
Much more anti Chinese sentiment in Asia. There have been various pogroms against the Chinese in Indonesia but can't think of any against the Japanese.

Japanese occupiers with anti colonialist Indonesians including Sukarno and Hatta:

 
98 was a terrible year for ethnically Chinese Indonesians, and they generally shoulder the blame for what are some pretty serious economic inequalities over there in Neo liberal heaven/haven. Indonesian Chinese being a burgeoning and successful business class and getting some of the top positions within Indonesian society. But this idea that Japan have never admitted what happened nor said sorry is not true. It is true that their history textbooks aren't really concerned with portraying an accurate picture of what went on over at Kanchanaburi (the death railway that Alec Guinness built) and other hideous goings on.
 
98 was a terrible year for ethnically Chinese Indonesians, and they generally shoulder the blame for what are some pretty serious economic inequalities over there in Neo liberal heaven/haven. Indonesian Chinese being a burgeoning and successful business class and getting some of the top positions within Indonesian society. But this idea that Japan have never admitted what happened nor said sorry is not true. It is true that their history textbooks aren't really concerned with portraying an accurate picture of what went on over at Kanchanaburi (the death railway that Alec Guinness built) and other hideous goings on.

Stop right there my young friend. . . if you identify a single ethnic group with the defects of an entire system, you're on the fast track to the scaping of goats.

Also, compared to the genuine settling of historical accounts that Germany engaged in after the war, Japan has performed very poorly.

I think the survivors of the Burma railway were quite derisive of the Guiness film.
 
Much more anti Chinese sentiment in Asia. There have been various pogroms against the Chinese in Indonesia but can't think of any against the Japanese.

Japanese occupiers with anti colonialist Indonesians including Sukarno and Hatta:



You are right though, despite having invaded Indonesia and then leaving the back door open for the Dutch to return after they left, there doesn't seem to be much of a collective resentment toward the Japanese.
 
Stop right there my young friend. . . if you identify a single ethnic group with the defects of an entire system, you're on the fast track to the scaping of goats.

Also, compared to the genuine settling of historical accounts that Germany engaged in after the war, Japan has performed very poorly.

I think the survivors of the Burma railway were quite derisive of the Guiness film.

Idris2002 - they are in many ways scape goated by a large number of 'pribumi' (aboriginal or native Indonesians) and some pretty horrible things have occurred as a result.
 
From what people tell me Asia much like Europe can come with reasons to hate their neighbours. Japan being one of the most powerful is feared to some extent. So Americas Idea of Japan's self defence force taking a larger part in the defence of Asia from China or whoever is probably a non starter.
 
98 was a terrible year for ethnically Chinese Indonesians, and they generally shoulder the blame for what are some pretty serious economic inequalities over there in Neo liberal heaven/haven. Indonesian Chinese being a burgeoning and successful business class and getting some of the top positions within Indonesian society. But this idea that Japan have never admitted what happened nor said sorry is not true. It is true that their history textbooks aren't really concerned with portraying an accurate picture of what went on over at Kanchanaburi (the death railway that Alec Guinness built) and other hideous goings on.

I would strongly disagree that the Chinese were to blame for what happened to them in Indonesia. It's a legacy of Dutch colonial apartheid (first Whites, second "Foreign Aliens", third "Indos and lastly the indigenous population) and then later Suharto's national fascist regime. Their relegation to the business sector of life has much in parallel to that of the Jews in Europe. Anti-Chinese hatred has a legacy of hundreds of years sadly.

As for the Japanese remember many fought alongside the British and Dutch to re-establish the colonial regime after their surrender in 1945, others to their credit joined the independence movement and contributed to its eventual success.
 
I would strongly disagree that the Chinese were to blame for what happened to them in Indonesia. It's a legacy of Dutch colonial apartheid (first Whites, second "Foreign Aliens", third "Indos and lastly the indigenous population) and then later Suharto's national fascist regime. Their relegation to the business sector of life has much in parallel to that of the Jews in Europe. Anti-Chinese hatred has a legacy of hundreds of years sadly.

As for the Japanese remember many fought alongside the British and Dutch to re-establish the colonial regime after their surrender in 1945, others to their credit joined the independence movement and contributed to its eventual success.

I would also strongly disagree that the Chinese were to blame for what happened to them in Indonesia. wholeheartedly and without question, though I try to avoid cliches 'like the plague'.

As I remember the Japanese refused Sukarno his declaration of independence as they we're waiting for the British and Dutch to arrive and re-establish colonial control. You got any numbers for Japanese soldiers joining the independence movement after their nations surrender to the US?
 
I would also disagree with calling them Chinese, just as we would not call am ethnically Pakistani Brit a 'Pakistani'.
 
I believe ethnicity is no longer on ID documents and there is no obligation to abandon chinese names any more . However religion and marital status remain on ID cards for all Indonesians which encourages prejudice and bigotry. According to this about 2,000 Japanese fought with the independence movement although I would have thought many more:



And another:

 
From what people tell me Asia much like Europe can come with reasons to hate their neighbours. Japan being one of the most powerful is feared to some extent. So Americas Idea of Japan's self defence force taking a larger part in the defence of Asia from China or whoever is probably a non starter.

if you have the time old boy, maybe you could give us some idea of how long Japan has been strengthening and/or expanding its navy and air force.
 
I believe ethnicity is no longer on ID documents and there is no obligation to abandon chinese names any more . However religion and marital status remain on ID cards for all Indonesians which encourages prejudice and bigotry. According to this about 2,000 Japanese fought with the independence movement although I would have thought many more:



And another:



I can't see those pics as i'm being blocked by the golden shield project in China. Not sure about ethnicity being on ID cards either but being a Christian is often the giveaway for being ethnically Chinese/Batak/Manado. As is looking Chinese, well documented they tend not to marry outside of ethnically Chinese circles. Maybe another reason they are victims of prejudice.
 
if you have the time old boy, maybe you could give us some idea of how long Japan has been strengthening and/or expanding its navy and air force.

From the 80's onwards it's Navy is probably second only to the US navy in Asia and Its Air force is looking to buy new Jets either Eurofighter or f35.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Self-Defense_Forces

Fortunately they have no desire to throw their weight around ,and, also seem to have no idea that they ever did which annoys a lot of people.
 
Stop right there my young friend. . . if you identify a single ethnic group with the defects of an entire system, you're on the fast track to the scaping of goats.

Also, compared to the genuine settling of historical accounts that Germany engaged in after the war, Japan has performed very poorly.

I think the survivors of the Burma railway were quite derisive of the Guiness film.

maybe you can offer a comparison between German attempts at atonement for the sins of the National Socialists and how the Japanese have dealt with their imperial savagery?
 
I thought it was a much more recent thing. Was any pretext offered for this re-armament (dunno what you call it) or can we attribute it to any specific factors. For how long has the PLA been the worlds largest standing army?
 
I can't see those pics as i'm being blocked by the golden shield project in China. Not sure about ethnicity being on ID cards either but being a Christian is often the giveaway for being ethnically Chinese/Batak/Manado. As is looking Chinese, well documented they tend not to marry outside of ethnically Chinese circles. Maybe another reason they are victims of prejudice.

If you wish to understand the politics and history of the awakening of Indonesian Independence try reading the "The Buru Quartet" by Pramoedya:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buru_Quartet

Very positive in regards the Chinese Indonesians.
 
From the 80's onwards it's Navy is probably second only to the US navy in Asia and Its Air force is looking to buy new Jets either Eurofighter or f35.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Self-Defense_Forces

Fortunately they have no desire to throw their weight around ,and, also seem to have no idea that they ever did which annoys a lot of people.

I thought it was a much more recent thing. Was any pretext offered for this re-armament (dunno what you call it) or can we attribute it to any specific factors. For how long has the PLA been the worlds largest standing army? Surely the Japanese are not that naive about this period of their history, it's not like China and Tibet/Tienanmen where they have absolutely no sources at all and people are often detained for any kind of dissidence related to discussing such matters..........
 
maybe you can offer a comparison between German attempts at atonement for the sins of the National Socialists and how the Japanese have dealt with their imperial savagery?

De nazification was tried in Germany which failed as anyone who was more important than a care taker had links with the Nazi party. You were either an active party member or signed up for an easy life ,but,the crimes were addressed and no excuse for Nazism is ever made in Germany.
Japan didn't do this for lots of reasons. Though their society has changed fundamentally no one wants to know about the crimes of world war two.
 
De nazification was tried in Germany which failed as anyone who was more important than a care taker had links with the Nazi party. You were either an active party member or signed up for an easy life ,but,the crimes were addressed and no excuse for Nazism is ever made in Germany.
Japan didn't do this for lots of reasons. Though their society has changed fundamentally no one wants to know about the crimes of world war two.

I'm interested what your opinion is on this psychological block that Japan and Japanese society has put on all of this. I can think of how we in the West are often stereotyped and caricatured by East/South East Asians (Pickmans) as being direct, fond of discussing problems and 'thrashing' out solutions during passionate and melodramatic confrontations. But seriously though, Japanese and Korean children are taught never to bother others, wherever and whomever they be. And we're all aware of their culture of 'face' and saving of. I do wonder though, as much as my limited intellect allows me to, how harmful this failure to deal with a difficult past could be, for a multitude of reasons.
 
The japanese version of ww2 goes something like this we got bombed then nuked and occupied and are now pacifists have had a powerful self defence force since the 60's that until recently couldnt step foot outside japan sent a small force to iraq which did nothing at all.
Every so often a right wing political type says something utterly outrageous then act all offended when called on it abe the pm visited the shrine where war criminals souls were added the same shrine the japanese royal family have nothing to do with:rolleyes:
 
The japanese version of ww2 goes something like this we got bombed then nuked and occupied and are now pacifists have had a powerful self defence force since the 60's that until recently couldnt step foot outside japan sent a small force to iraq which did nothing at all.
Every so often a right wing political type says something utterly outrageous then act all offended when called on it abe the pm visited the shrine where war criminals souls were added the same shrine the japanese royal family have nothing to do with:rolleyes:

am I right in thinking that along with 1000 or so war criminals there are, among other nationalities Philippine war dead in that shrine?
 
I thought it was a much more recent thing. Was any pretext offered for this re-armament (dunno what you call it) or can we attribute it to any specific factors. For how long has the PLA been the worlds largest standing army? Surely the Japanese are not that naive about this period of their history, it's not like China and Tibet/Tienanmen where they have absolutely no sources at all and people are often detained for any kind of dissidence related to discussing such matters..........

It has been quietly going on since the 80's though as older ships and planes are replaced the replacements are just so much more capable. Much like everyone else's. The US has been urging the Japanese to step up and share more of the burden which has prompted debates about what Japan should do.
I think Japan has a cultural blind spot about the war. Stuff happened some of it bad and then we got nuked seems to be their narrative.
 
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