chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
It's a high %. SEND populations in private schools can be much greater than in their state neighbours (for a number of reasons), but they still have to in the top wealth brackets to afford it.
VAT on Private Schools Kicks In
- Thread starter Mr Retro
- Start date
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
That's not what I'm seeing (yet).
Silas Loom
2028
I don’t see how having a VAT registered subsidiary makes any real difference. Eton is doing well out of this because it has been splurging on buildings over the last few years, and now will be able to reclaim the VAT element from the last ten, softening future fee increases while offering ludicrous levels of resources to prospective customers. It’s not got away with that because of particularly clever accounting, it’s simply exercised the advantage of being a very rich institution to start with.
Wouldn’t expect teenage Telegraph journos to understand VAT any better than Chilango, though.
Definitely this should be a priority - certainly stop the state funding them.
The Humanists have been campaigning on this for a while but sadly there's very little traction.
State-funded faith schools
Around a third of all state-funded schools in England and Wales are schools ‘with a religious character’ – the legal term for ‘faith schools’, as they are known in England and Wales, or denominational schools, as they are known in Scotland and Northern Ireland. This number has grown in recent...
humanists.uk
Too right - the Corbynisters have made a lot more progress on this....tax fiddling while the world burns
a classic example of right wing Labour unwilling to grasp the core tax-the-rich nettle
Silas Loom
2028
Definitely this should be a priority - certainly stop the state funding them.
The Humanists have been campaigning on this for a while but sadly there's very little traction.
State-funded faith schools
Around a third of all state-funded schools in England and Wales are schools ‘with a religious character’ – the legal term for ‘faith schools’, as they are known in England and Wales, or denominational schools, as they are known in Scotland and Northern Ireland. This number has grown in recent...humanists.uk
Humanists have to fight on so many fronts: bishops in the House of Lords, assisted dying, state funded faith schools - unsurprising that their efforts are somewhat diluted.
weltweit
Well-Known Member
I didn't interrogate them much, could be it is 6th formers because there is a very good state 6th form college locally to their school.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
wrt state-funded faith schools, we've been going in the wrong direction for decades now. Blair did a lot of damage.
A third is a staggering number.
Silas Loom
2028
I blame Blunkett and Kelly, but yes, they were appointed by Blair, and it was a huge opportunity missed.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
And churches of various kinds are all over this, of course. I noticed a few years ago that the junior school I attended now has a big 'Church of Wales School' sign outside it. When I went there, we had the usual morning prayers etc, but I had no idea it was Church of Wales and I'm guessing the teachers didn't either.
Silas Loom
2028
Bridget Phillipson is a practising Roman Catholic. Why do Labour PMs shunt the religious types to the DfE?
There's at least one here in Birmingham that is popular as the named school on EHCPs and funded by parents who aren't always on very high incomes.
But it sounds like you're not talking about those that are there with an EHCP. What are those reasons?
AnnO'Neemus
Is so vanilla
I'd read about children turning up to start school after the pandemic that were still in nappies because they hadn't been toilet-trained by their parents, which is mind boggling, but apparently some parents think that's part of the role of teacher, rather than basic parenting.
There's always reports about children starting school unable to use a knife and fork as well, although personally I wonder how many of those children come from cultures where people eat with their hands, rather than coming from a household where they don't eat with a knife a fork because they get chicken nuggets and chips that they eat with their hands, iyswim.
And as for socialisation, it's sad the number of children I see when out and about, eg in a café or fast food place where the mum is tapping away and engrossed in their phone and totally ignoring their child, or their child even has a device of their own. I once spent an hour in a hospital waiting room being driven mad by Baby Shark and other stuff on repeat by a toddler in a pushchair, mum totally ignoring their child.
Not just small children either. I was in a pizza place a while back in the evening where two parents were with a boy maybe between 8-10 years old. They were at the next table to me and I could barely hear myself think because the kid had a tablet and seemed to be watching a very loud action movie. No interaction with his parents except about what to eat.
There are kids growing up now who can probably barely form a sentence or have a conversation because they've had so little practice. It's really sad.
story
Changing the facts
Any chance of a link for this please?
All I'm getting is the Heil and the Express. And Mumsnet.
Mr Retro
Beware hedgehogs
What I’ve seen in this direction is, it’s very competitive to gain entry to private secondary schools where we live. One of the bigger private schools with a primary and secondary is recruiting kids from primary only private schools now in years 2, 3 etc. and guaranteeing a place in their secondary.
A lot of parents have taken this option up. 4 in my kids class. This will probably close one of the smaller primaries near us if rumour is correct.
AnnaKarpik
Queen of all she surveys
The difference is that there is no input VAT left to claim on capital works, it has already been claimed. You can't do it twice. I can't say it any clearer than that. The supposed windfall from reclaimable VAT on capital works does not and will not exist for any private educational facility that has been able to afford a reasonably competent accountant.
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Don't shoot the messenger. Just passing on what we're being told on the ground.
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Smaller classes with more individualised attention.
More resources for interventions. Greater number of qualified staff.
Better in-school identification of needs.
Parental access to private diagnoses.
"Culture and ethos", reputation and other intangibles.
Obviously every school is different, but I've (regularly) heard/seen all of these.
Saul Goodman
It's all good, man
All this achieves is exactly what it set out to achieve, to make public schools accessible only to the correct class of people. It's nothing more than an exclusionary tax.
Ah, so, partly what I said, that some parents choose private due to SEN needs. But you're saying that identified SEN is greater than in the state sector too.
Interesting, as I think that SEN is created (to the degree it exists) by mainstream i.e. if schools were properly inclusive human scale places there would be far fewer kids with SEN. But that's not the case here as you describe it. Which makes sense too.
Silas Loom
2028
But how was the subsidiary able to charge VAT in the first place, then? Does Eton offer non-educational services?
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
They're already only accessible to the very richest. Average fees for 2024: £18,000 per year. That's the average.
Thora
Differently Ethical
Surely one of the benefits of private education is that if your child is struggling academically the school has the resources to give them extra attention?
Or is it more a case of needing private tuition to keep up as schools manage out underachievers?
Thora
Differently Ethical
Kind of lucky but also sounds like it will be underfunded and potentially risks not being financially viable. State school finances are based on 30 kids to a teacher and most schools find they need to combine year groups or risk eventual closure.
klang
klang
A merger with another school in a similar situation is discussed atm
UnderOpenSky
baseline neural therapy
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
I suspect the threshold for identification is a lot lower in (some) private schools. Again, for lots of reasons.
Mr Retro
Beware hedgehogs
To get individual help with the entrance exam process for the secondary schools in the area.
