UK photographers: the law and your rights: discussion

[what]

I haven't been for a while but last time I was in cyberdog that had a pretty big sign at the entrance and loads more around the shop saying no photos. This I believe is to do with the copyright more than the H&S as in the past they have had a lot of people try to rip off their designs. Didn't they have quite a spat with the market and a trader who was selling T shirts very similar to their flashing programmable LED T Shirts a few years ago?

 

[stephen hardy]

My gripe isn't with the not taking photographs part. I would have been more than happy not to do so if asked politely. The thing that got my back up was being aggresive forced to delete them as though I was some kind of criminal.

I really never expected something like that to happen in the uk, espeically in a shop whom I imagine aim to appeal to the more liberal types of clientele and brand themselves as anti-establishment types.

That said not sure why they're getting so hung up on taking photos either. Do they also expect people not to wear their clothes in public too?! (although to be fair I can't imagine many people have the balls to do so looking at the state of some of the stuff they sell)

 

[stephen hardy]

Just spoke with the store manager. She was very apologetic and confirmed it wasn't store policy to force people to delete pictures. Seems like it was just a lone store assistant acting like a dick.

 

[fractionMan]

Though I can see Cyberdog being touchy about people snapping designs to send pix to rip-off plants in China, their remedy is against the importer, not the photographer.

I haven't been for a while but last time I was in cyberdog that had a pretty big sign at the entrance and loads more around the shop saying no photos. This I believe is to do with the copyright more than the H&S as in the past they have had a lot of people try to rip off their designs. Didn't they have quite a spat with the market and a trader who was selling T shirts very similar to their flashing programmable LED T Shirts a few years ago?

This is mental reasoning. If I wanted to do that, I'd invest in a fucking t-shirt and take photos/send it over. As if banning photography is going to stop people copying their shitty fucking designs, that are also on their shitty fucking website anyway.

 

[Pickman's model]

This is mental reasoning.

all reasoning is mental: think about it.

 

[editor]

Just spoke with the store manager. She was very apologetic and confirmed it wasn't store policy to force people to delete pictures. Seems like it was just a lone store assistant acting like a dick.

Good for you for taking this up with them.

 

[fractionMan]

all reasoning is mental: think about it.

 

[skyscraper101]

There are not enough facepalms

A BBC photographer was stopped by police on suspicion of being a terrorist as he took pictures outside Tate Modern.
Jeff Overs, 48, was photographing sunset over St Paul's Cathedral when a policewoman, with a community support officer, told him she was "stopping people who were taking photographs, as a counter-terrorism measure" and demanded his name, address and date of birth...

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/bbc-man-in-terror-quiz-for-photographing-st-pauls-sunset-6714008.html

 

[Pickman's model]

There are not enough facepalms



http://www.standard.co.uk/news/bbc-man-in-terror-quiz-for-photographing-st-pauls-sunset-6714008.html

just to check: you do know that's from 2009?

 

[weltweit]

Must protect St Pauls!

 

[skyscraper101]

She'd have been told to piss right off if that was me.

 

[Cbx63]

Hi Just thought I’d share a little incident that happened yesterday in North Wales near the Ponderosa Cafe on the Horse shoe pass Llangollen. It’s very popular with bikers so I thought I would ride down there and try and take some action shots of the bikes coming round the corners.I purposely left my white ex-police bike in the car park and walked down to the bend, stood on a corner where i was visible from quite a distance from both directions so as not to cause alarm. Boy was i wrong after the only the 5 mins i was challenge by a bloke who rode past turned round and came back , demanding me to show him I.D and saying that i wasn’t allowed to take photos of him or his bike. Of course i politely said yes i am and wouldn’t show him any I.D, so he sat on his bike trying to block my view. When that didn’t work he decided to get of his bike and try to confiscate my camera which of course wasn’t going to happen so he swung a punch at me, needless to say the police was called but he'd scarped by the time I’d finished on the phone and i missed the shot of number plate while scrambling back up the banking.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

That's the first time I've heard of somebody who _wasn't_ a copper demanding to see ID for taking a photo. Perhaps he was off duty.

 

[weltweit]

.... after the only the 5 mins i was challenge by a bloke who rode past turned round and came back , demanding me to show him I.D and saying that i wasn’t allowed to take photos of him or his bike. ....

Perhaps he was lacking something. Something like insurance or a valid drivers licence

 

[weltweit]

Unlawful arrest UK, Farnborough airshow 2012.

 

[RoyReed]

Police Threaten Press Photographer

Disgraceful behaviour by a plain clothed Police officer (one assumes a detective, who says he’s in charge of the crime scene, who then clearly threatens the photographer quoted above, by saying “I’ll be touching you in a Police car back to Ilford Police Station”) and a Police sergeant against a press photographer doing his job and covering a story from an un-cordoned public footway...

 

[socialist]

Can anyone tell me if the police have a right to sieze your memory card or camera while taking photos at the scene of a crime (attempted murder) in a public place (a street) with victim, police, ambulances etc present? SD card was taken by the police and reason given for seizure was there "might be evidence" in the photos. Just wondered if I had to hand it over. I might have been willing to take the SD card to the local nick after copying the contents, but the memory card (or both camera and card) were demanded there and then. A link to an authoritative source would be handy so I can print something off in case the situation comes up again.

 

[Pickman's model]

Police and criminal evidence act

 

[socialist]

Police and criminal evidence act

​

So the police can sieze a memory card (or camera) in that sort of situation? I just found a comment from ACPO to officers that says "Once an image has been recorded, the police have no power to delete or confiscate it without a court order."​

 

[laptop]

​

​

So the police can sieze a memory card (or camera) in that sort of situation? I just found a comment from ACPO to officers that says "Once an image has been recorded, the police have no power to delete or confiscate it without a court order."​

Absolutely not. They need a court order, and ACPO are right (oddly enough).

See "special procedure material" in the Police and Criminal Evidence Act, and here.

 

[weltweit]

On Sunday I was photographing autumn foliage and parked near the gate of an army base to photograph a particularly nice tree, red in its autumn leaves. This morning two plain clothes policemen arrived and asked if this was my car? yes. And was I near XYZ base on the 18th? possibly says I. What were you doing? photographing trees, ok, would it be ok to see the photos? don't see why not I said and led them to my office where I showed them the photos of the tree. They seemed satisfied and duly left.

 

[mhendo]

On Sunday I was photographing autumn foliage and parked near the gate of an army base to photograph a particularly nice tree, red in its autumn leaves. This morning two plain clothes policemen arrived and asked if this was my car? yes. And was I near XYZ base on the 18th? possibly says I. What were you doing? photographing trees, ok, would it be ok to see the photos? don't see why not I said and led them to my office where I showed them the photos of the tree. They seemed satisfied and duly left.

What geniuses!

Because, of course, it would have been impossible for you to take pictures of the tree AND pictures of the army base, and then transfer the army base pictures to a different device. The fact that you took a picture of a tree is, apparently, conclusive proof that you're not a terrorist.

At least you can sleep soundly at night, knowing that these are the people looking out for your security and your rights.

 

[laptop]

What were you doing? photographing trees, ok, would it be ok to see the photos? don't see why not I said and led them to my office where I showed them the photos of the tree. They seemed satisfied and duly left.

Did you quote them a price for a nice "giclée print"?

 

[weltweit]

...
Because, of course, it would have been impossible for you to take pictures of the tree AND pictures of the army base, and then transfer the army base pictures to a different device. The fact that you took a picture of a tree is, apparently, conclusive proof that you're not a terrorist.

Don't say that, they might be reading this and they might come back

 

[weltweit]

Did you quote them a price for a nice "giclée print"?

No, unfortunately the pictures are not that great. What I was really looking for was an autumn spread of colour but when I saw the tree I thought I may as well have a bit of that while I am here.

 

[weltweit]

Incidentally, someone did mention that I got away with it because I am white and British. Others who don't share these charachteristics may not be so lucky.

 

[pogofish]

I see the police here are still viewing photographers as "suspicious":

What is Project Kraken?

Project Kraken is a national initiative set up to increase public vigilance and protect our coast and waters. It is about getting people to work together to fight criminality and terrorism to keep the maritime community safe and secure.

If you work in the maritime environment you can help police combat crime and terrorists by being alert to your surroundings and reporting suspicious behaviour. By passing on information, you can increase maritime safety, reduce criminal behaviour and disrupt terrorist activity. You will be making our harbours, ports and the Grampian coastline safer for anyone using it legitimately.

How does Project Kraken work?
By contacting our central phone number 0845 600 5700 or our email address at project.kraken@grampian.pnn.police.uk you can become part of Project Kraken. It is the focal point to report any unusual activity in the maritime environment although should you have an urgent need for Police assistance 999 should still be used.

Unusual is the key word for Project Kraken. If there is anything unusual about a person, a vessel or some cargo, then contact us. If you live, work or relax regularly in maritime areas you will recognise anything out of place and if you do we are asking that you contact us.

Project Kraken gathers the information you and others pass and uses it to prevent criminal or terrorist acts.

What to look for:

●Anyone filming or taking pictures or notes in unusual circumstances around significant buildings or locations such as bridges, including docking procedures or security methods

●Anyone loitering around maritime areas or prolonged activity in one area
●Evasive answers to common boating questions
●Deliberate attempts to avoid contact with others or to draw attention
●Inappropriate equipment and knowledge for the environment
●Placing objects into waterways near bridges or pipes at unusual times
●Vessels or fishermen entering restricted maritime areas
●Attempts to test security and response times when entering restricted areas.
●Efforts to gain employment at sensitive sites
●Inappropriate large cash payments for daily extension of marina or port mooring
●Consecutive round trips on the same ferry

Remember if you see suspicious activity:
●Do not take direct action
●Do not confront the person
●Do not reveal your suspicions
●Do record as many details as possible ●Do notify us as soon as possible

Ask yourself:
●Who did you see?
●What did you see? Be specific
●Where did you see it?
●Why is it suspicious?

What do we ask of you:
Quite simply call the central number or email us whenever you see any activity or behaviour that you feel is suspicious.

Call: 0845 600 5 700 and quote 'Project Kraken'
Email: project.kraken@grampian.pnn.police.uk

We are also asking users and residents of the Grampian Coastline to register with Project Kraken free of charge. As a registered member of Project Kraken you will receive timely information updates by email, and a quarterly newsletter providing a summary of local and national incidents and activity that might be of interest.

In addition, you will be added to an email distribution list which will be used, when appropriate, to circulate urgent information and intelligence updates. There may also be times that we contact you with a request that you assist us in ‘observing and reporting’ particular individuals, groups or vessels.

To register with Project Kraken call or email us or simply download the registration form and post it to:

Grampian Police Ports Unit
Airport Police Office
Aberdeen Airport
Dyce
Aberdeen
AB21 7DU

 

[FridgeMagnet]

God forbid anyone should want to take a picture of a bridge. No tourist would ever do that certainly.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

I like "Evasive answers to common boating questions" too.

"Is that a ketch or a sloop?"
"Er, sorry, I don't know anything about boats."
*sends email*

 

[sim667]

I like "Evasive answers to common boating questions" too.

"Is that a ketch or a sloop?"
"Er, sorry, I don't know anything about boats."
*sends email*

I know quite a lot about boats, but dont have a fucking clue what a ketch or a sloop is?