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The Islamic state

I'm not joking about this , but saying as this site is in the middle of the desert , if the civilians have been evacuated it'd be the perfect spot for the Syrians to lob in a load of gas and chemicals if they have any still knocking about . I really wouldn't give a monkeys . Definitely a lesser evil . I'm sure it'd wash off later .
 
Casually Red said:
I'm not joking about this , but saying as this site is in the middle of the desert , if the civilians have been evacuated it'd be the perfect spot for the Syrians to lob in a load of gas and chemicals if they have any still knocking about . I really wouldn't give a monkeys . Definitely a lesser evil . I'm sure it'd wash off later .
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I acknowledge that I am transgressing on what I have posted earlier but, to be crystal clear, are you advocating the use of chemical weapons?
 
For information Palmyra is in the middle of a desert. It is an oasis, literally.

It took us hours of driving to get to the place

"Lobbing in a load" of highly toxic chemicals would not wash off later because it is a desert.

There is no precipitation there.

At midday the temperature was close to 50 degrees celsius.
 
Diamond said:
BBC reporting that they have taken Palmyra.

It's obviously a bit obscene to wring one's hands over the destruction of ancient ruins more than the everyday brutality that IS meets out to living people but this to me is a real test of how totalitarian IS is.

Palmyra is the most spectacular site that I have visited by quite some distance. It is amazingly beautiful and also enormous. More importantly, it is not Islamic.

IS would probably have to spend days or weeks to do away with it all.

It'll be interesting to see how they proceed.

There is also a Mamluk castle, which is equally spectacular, that overlooks Palmyra - if IS go to town on the ancient ruins, it will be interesting to see how they treat that.
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They have the time and the munitions to destroy the place, let them crack on, while they are doing that they aren't killing the vulnerable and innocent, and perhaps in the process they will present a window of opportunity for the coalition to kill a significant number of them?
I just hope I won't be reading that, they weren't targeted due to a fear of destroying a few ancient stones!
 


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Apparently that areas got both gas fields and weapons depots , so it's a big score for them . Cash and weapons in abundance . Plus the massive publicity that will come with their destruction of the sites and museums .
 
J Ed said:
The real tragedy of the Syrian Civil War
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Artaxerxes said:
Its the damage over time that saddens me with this, think how much revenue and reason to visit the Middle East is lost for each ruin that is destroyed, alongside just a tangible bit of history and a link with the past you can actually see and know that people once lived there.

The human loss is horrible, the cultural loss does somehow make it worse though, its tearing away a little bit of the areas soul.

I would have loved to visit the Middle East as well, probably not going to happen now.
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It is intertwined and you bang on to highlight the importance of these sites, tourism breaks down barriers and prejudice. If these sites are obliterated then no tourism and a collapse economically. I too would have loved to visit these places.
Never going to happen in my life time.
 
Casually Red said:
I'm not joking about this , but saying as this site is in the middle of the desert , if the civilians have been evacuated it'd be the perfect spot for the Syrians to lob in a load of gas and chemicals if they have any still knocking about . I really wouldn't give a monkeys . Definitely a lesser evil . I'm sure it'd wash off later .
Click to expand...

Maybe thats the plan?
 
@AliTahmizian: Two days ago eyewitness saw 6 buses leaving #Palmyra prison after Homs governor visited. They think most impt political prisoners evacuated

@AliTahmizian: #Palmyra source tells me there was no civilians evacuated, only high ranking officers and collaborators. Hundreds of soldiers left behind.
 
TomUS said:
A proposal: NATO kick Turkey out for supporting ISIS. Then kick America out for supporting Saudi for supporting ISIS. Wouldn't be much left of NATO though.
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except the modern and scary militaries of france, britain and germany. Might not be up to taking on the Red Terror alone (that doesn't exist anymore) but they've deffo wasted enough of peoples taxes on equipment and personnel who could deliver the message. I wish they wouldn't spend all that money gearing for a war they'll never have to fight but lets not pretend Nato would be a toothless dog without the US and Turkey
 
Batboy said:
It is intertwined and you bang on to highlight the importance of these sites, tourism breaks down barriers and prejudice. If these sites are obliterated then no tourism and a collapse economically. I too would have loved to visit these places.
Never going to happen in my life time.
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It's not just the places immediately involved in the current war either. It's getting hard to visit any of the Dar al-Islam. Most of the Arab world is off-limits to Westerners now, as are Iran, the Caucasus, Afghanistan, Somalia and large parts of Pakistan. Even the coast of Kenya is getting dodgy. A cynic would say this was part of the plan.
 
Mr.Bishie said:
@AliTahmizian: Two days ago eyewitness saw 6 buses leaving #Palmyra prison after Homs governor visited. They think most impt political prisoners evacuated

@AliTahmizian: #Palmyra source tells me there was no civilians evacuated, only high ranking officers and collaborators. Hundreds of soldiers left behind.
Click to expand...
this will end badly :(
 
Diamond said:
For information Palmyra is in the middle of a desert. It is an oasis, literally.

It took us hours of driving to get to the place

"Lobbing in a load" of highly toxic chemicals would not wash off later because it is a desert.

There is no precipitation there.

At midday the temperature was close to 50 degrees celsius.
Click to expand...

Non persistent agent then which will rapidly break down in the heat:D Lots of different chemical agents bound to be something ideal for this.
 
phildwyer said:
It's not just the places immediately involved in the current war either. It's getting hard to visit any of the Dar al-Islam. Most of the Arab world is off-limits to Westerners now, as are Iran, the Caucasus, Afghanistan, Somalia and large parts of Pakistan. Even the coast of Kenya is getting dodgy. A cynic would say this was part of the plan.
Click to expand...
Why is Iran off limits to Westerners? The US State Dept has a "travel warning" but it's for Iranian-Americans. I visited there in the mid-late 90s & I don't think Western relations with Iran are much worse today....well except for the nuke thing.
 
Batboy said:
It is intertwined and you bang on to highlight the importance of these sites, tourism breaks down barriers and prejudice. If these sites are obliterated then no tourism and a collapse economically. I too would have loved to visit these places.
Never going to happen in my life time.
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It's not just about tourism though , Syrians themselves are intensely proud of this site . It symbolises the origins of an advanced and culturally diverse civilisation in their nation from the time of antiquity . It's at Syrians heart . It's Syria itself which is being destroyed , not just " some old stones" as someone else called them . Out of ignorance .

In all honesty though I see very little difference between this lot and the others . Before they started intermittently feuding IS was engaging in the very same type of atrocities directly alongside the other AQ factions and the so called "FSA " moderates , who even released a moderate video of a moderate engaging in moderate cannibalism for the camera . Something even IS have yet to do .

Villages were being slaughtered regardless of age, sex or gender , horrific rapes , beheadings all over the place , women and kids hauled off in the back of trucks with many never seen again . Children were executed, raped and executed, often in the most grisly fashion, all sorts of horrific stuff and it was ALL the factions up to their necks in it . Often together .
The western media was glossing over these atrocities for a long time until the evidence was everywhere . The BBC sickeningly decided to interview the moderate cannibal and do their best to put a human face on him, and let him tell his side . A feckin sob story for a cannibal .

Many thousands of these moderates have continually defected to IS , and are still doing so . They never had any problems with these atrocities as they were engaged in them themselves from the very outset . Regardless of what their more pr savvy leadership state for westen consumption, with a bought and paid for western pr firm at their elbow .

It strikes me that the essential difference is IS commit the atrocity as a deliberate public spectacle , while their various sidekicks weren't just as media savvy . And were often just indulging themselves . Apart from the moderate cannibal who had the hang of wanting the world to see what he was at .
 
TomUS said:
Why is Iran off limits to Westerners? The US State Dept has a "travel warning" but it's for Iranian-Americans. I visited there in the mid-late 90s & I don't think Western relations with Iran are much worse today....well except for the nuke thing.
Click to expand...
i will look on the auld holiday websites & report back.
 
TomUS said:
Why is Iran off limits to Westerners? The US State Dept has a "travel warning" but it's for Iranian-Americans. I visited there in the mid-late 90s & I don't think Western relations with Iran are much worse today....well except for the nuke thing.
Click to expand...

It's pretty hard to get a visa, impossible if you're in certain professions.

How was it btw?
 
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