The Covid Inquiry

[steveo87]

Johnson and Cummings on Hancock.

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Just as an aside, because my mother in law does it - YOU DO NOT NEED TO ABRIVIATE ON WHATSAPP, IT WILL CORRECT IT FOR YOU!!!


sorr, carry on.

 

[Petcha]

I happened to have a very minor job sitting in the background at the heart of the whole situation during lockdown and the language he was using in those messages was at the higher end of the spectrum but yeh, everyone swears like a trooper in downing st. it's just the way it is. i dont know if that's a good or a bad thing. or if it's always been that way, i only got my job right at the start of covid but i assume it always has been.

 

[magneze]

I think that guy who said he couldn't attend due to illness has the right idea. No one's going down for this so why face a few hours of onerous questioning? Just call in sick.

Fucking scum bags. People died. I'll probably go on a list for saying this but they need a good kicking. It's the only language they understand.

Did he claim to have Covid?

 

[Kid_Eternity]

I can't believe I'm saying this but I'm actually believing a lot of what Cummings is saying. About how fucking chaotic Boris and his decision making was.

Cummings tends to have the right insight (about government workings) but the wrong execution and prescription...

 

[elbows]

 

[elbows]

 

[elbows]

Hancock is thought to be the phone owner in this one:

 

[Ming]

Did he claim to have Covid?

Wouldn't surprise me and he'd likely be trolling. 'Let the bodies pile high' as dear old Boris said. They have nothing but contempt for the idiots who vote for them and I get why that is.

 

[elbows]

 

[Ming]

He is absent from his main job for medical reasons for a limited period. He will be back, and then he will also give evidence to this inquiry (so long as he doesnt end up seriously ill or dead).

To be honest i'm in the flaming pitchfork mob end of things with tory cunts over this (and pretty much everything else but particularly Covid due to the y'know...predictable/avoidable deaths). I bet the dog ate his homework also.

 

[elbows]

To be honest i'm in the flaming pitchfork mob end of things with tory cunts over this (and pretty much everything else but particularly Covid due to the y'know...predictable/avoidable deaths). I bet the dog ate his homework also.

Are we talking about Simon Case?

He is a civil servant. Loads of his whatsapp messages are highly critical of how shit Johnson etc were. The details of his current medical issue hadnt been revealed last time I checked.

 

[elbows]

Even in mid March when the original plan was going into the bin, we still see stuff like this providing a justification for delaying timing (although events very soon after swept away this stance)

So far its been Whitty who has got the blame for some of the 'fatigue' and 'need to balance covid harms with other harms' excuses for not acting sooner.

 

[Petcha]

He's got a very good point about how fucking shit the civil service is to be fair. He doesn't suffer fools, I get that. He should never have washed up in the public sector then. Because it's 90% fools waiting for their pensions.

I think if his language wasn't so deranged people might have actually taken some of his points more seriously.

 

[elbows]

More Johnson shit from earlier that I didnt get a chance to post at the time, but that they brought back up ont he screen much later by mistake so I grabbed it:

 

[elbows]

He's got a very good point about how fucking shit the civil service is to be fair. He doesn't suffer fools, I get that. He should never have washed up in the public sector then. Because it's 90% fools waiting for their pensions.

I think if his language wasn't so deranged people might have actually taken some of his points more seriously.

Even without Cummings, the flaws in the civil service, in the original longstanding pandemic plans in this country, in specific individuals and in other parts of government have been well exposed so far in modules 1 and 2 of this inquiry. Some of the very worst and most slippery witnesses have been certain senior civil servants so far, although there have also been one or two whose evidence was much less slippery and bloated. There are a few good ones on display. The cabinet office and the civil contingencies stuff was fucking dreadful.

Some of Cummings blunt whatsapps etc have been useful. I've commented in the past that in some ways I am actually like him, but with quite the opposite politics in a large number of key areas, and different attitudes towards other people I work and interact with at times too. My language is a fucking disgrace according to the standards of people I dont fucking respect in the first place. Better to have bad language but the right priorities than the other way around.

We could tell from the outside, in realtime, that the government machine was a farce when the pandemic hit, that the establishment had shit priorities, etc etc, and inquiry evidence so far has revealed the same picture from the inside too.

 

[elbows]

They tried to grill the cunt Cummings over Barnard Castle today but as usual he will only apologise for how badly it was handled later, not for the original behaviour.

 

[Petcha]

Even without Cummings, the flaws in the civil service, in the original longstanding pandemic plans in this country, in specific individuals and in other parts of government have been well exposed so far in modules 1 and 2 of this inquiry. Some of the very worst and most slippery witnesses have been certain senior civil servants so far, although there have also been one or two whose evidence was much less slippery and bloated. There are a few good ones on display. The cabinet office and the civil contingencies stuff was fucking dreadful.

Some of Cummings blunt whatsapps etc have been useful. I've commented in the past that in some ways I am actually like him, but with quite the opposite politics in a large number of key areas, and different attitudes towards other people I work and interact with at times too. My language is a fucking disgrace according to the standards of people I dont fucking respect in the first place. Better to have bad language but the right priorities than the other way around.

We could tell from the outside, in realtime, that the government machine was a farce when the pandemic hit, that the establishment had shit priorities, etc etc, and inquiry evidence so far has revealed the same picture from the inside too.

It would terrify me if my employer ever looked at some of the Teams exchanges I've had with colleagues. We swear. A fucking lot. He seems to have a form of Tourette's like I do in some ways. The more inappropriate the place to swear is, the more I do it. He would appear to be the same. I'm amazed he didn't tell that KC to go fuck himself when he kept telling him to speak more slowly

 

[BusLanes]

I can't believe I'm saying this but I'm actually believing a lot of what Cummings is saying. About how fucking chaotic Boris and his decision making was.

Oh makes sense.

Cummings is cursed with some insight about stuff but he is also cursed with the inability to fix any of the things he sometimes accurately identifies. Instead he often makes it worse.

So, just like a lot of people.

 

[Elpenor]

Cummings (from the information released, a lot of which is from, erm, Cummings) does genuinely seem to have grasped what covid meant from a practical and political perspective before anyone else in government in spring 2020 and does seem to have shouted and shouted at the competing factions within government to make decisions and develop and stick to a strategy.

I do think he understands things eg impact on systems, communications, the big picture etc from the information released and can sense his frustration at the idiots in government. I do wonder though if - in his eyes anyway - can anyone ever measure up to his own enormous genius and level of insight. I almost feel sorry for him reading his frustration with Johnson et al but then again he did choose to work for the government.

So I guess he’s still a cunt, but on this issue perhaps a right cunt.

 

[Ming]

Are we talking about Simon Case?

He is a civil servant. Loads of his whatsapp messages are highly critical of how shit Johnson etc were. The details of his current medical issue hadnt been revealed last time I checked.

That guy yeah. Looks like he doesn't like these pesky inquiries.

‘Horrifying behaviour’: What we learnt at Simon Case’s PACAC appearance

The cabinet secretary is grilled over the Partygate scandal, sets out the process for disciplining those involved and discusses how much of his tim...

www.civilserviceworld.com

 

[elbows]

Cummings (from the information released, a lot of which is from, erm, Cummings) does genuinely seem to have grasped what covid meant from a practical and political perspective before anyone else in government in spring 2020 and does seem to have shouted and shouted at the competing factions within government to make decisions and develop and stick to a strategy.

There were actually a handful of people who grasped it around the same date that he did, but he is by far the best known and the most obviously powerful.

For example, I would place one of yesterdays witnesses in that camp, Imran Shafi who was former private secretary to the PM for public services.

Roughly speaking, the penny dropped for some right at the end of February, and then a core group became increasingly alarmed with every passing day beyond that point, culmulating in the death of the original plan by the 13th-16th March 2020. NHS graphs showing the extent that they would be overwhelmed, which came at the start of that week and that I posted about yesterday, also helped set that timing and Cummings was not the only one who noticed those, though he certainly did shout about their implications.

Where Cummings could have got well ahead of that curve is if he had more thoroughly explored something he kept asking about from a much earlier stage - he kept asking to see certain plans from the likes of the department for health and social care, and no deep plans were forthcoming. But he missed that opportunity to change the game earlier.

Whether it be certain experts of SAGE or various people who werent totally clueless in government, pretty much none of them got far ahead of the curve that ordinary members of the public could also have travelled on without any insider info. With events in Italy being the most obvious emergency warning indicator of both how bad things could get, and a means to bust past the idea that hospitals being swamped and governments bringing in lockdowns were not part of European reality (if European exceptionalism wasnt a thing then the likes of Iran could have served the same alarm function as Italy, but earlier).

 

[Ming]

There were actually a handful of people who grasped it around the same date that he did, but he is by far the best known and the most obviously powerful.

For example, I would place one of yesterdays witnesses in that camp, Imran Shafi who was former private secretary to the PM for public services.

Roughly speaking, the penny dropped for some right at the end of February, and then a core group became increasingly alarmed with every passing day beyond that point, culmulating in the death of the original plan by the 13th-16th March 2020. NHS graphs showing the extent that they would be overwhelmed, which came at the start of that week and that I posted about yesterday, also helped set that timing and Cummings was not the only one who noticed those, though he certainly did shout about their implications.

Where Cummings could have got well ahead of that curve is if he had more thoroughly explored something he kept asking about from a much earlier stage - he kept asking to see certain plans from the likes of the department for health and social care, and no deep plans were forthcoming. But he missed that opportunity to change the game earlier.

Whether it be certain experts of SAGE or various people who werent totally clueless in government, pretty much none of them got far ahead of the curve that ordinary members of the public could also have travelled on without any insider info. With events in Italy being the most obvious emergency warning indicator of both how bad things could get, and a means to bust past the idea that hospitals being swamped and governments bringing in lockdowns were not part of European reality (if European exceptionalism wasnt a thing then the likes of Iran could have served the same alarm function as Italy, but earlier).'s

What do you think about Cummings refusing to clearly answer the question about the Barnard castle trip he took to 'check his vision'? On his wife's birthday. Or Lee Cain's memory lapses when asked about anything that reflected badly on himself (perfect recall for everything else)?

No actual accountability or negative consequences for these wankers. It's a minor irritation.

 

[farmerbarleymow]

It would terrify me if my employer ever looked at some of the Teams exchanges I've had with colleagues. We swear. A fucking lot.

It's all logged so one day they might.

 

[elbows]

This is what this moment in the story gets reduced to when the likes of Chris Mason get their hands on it:

'Stiletto row' official to appear at Covid inquiry

Chris Mason looks ahead to former top civil servant Helen McNamara's testimony at the Covid inquiry.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[ruffneck23]

 

[elbows]

I've only been able to watch a portion of it today so far (Helen McNamara).

The nature of Hancocks lying has come up. It sounds like the lies he was telling to cabinet etc were along the lines of repeatedly making reassuring claims about plans and operational capabilities that everyone discovered quickly or at least within weeks were just not true.

And there was this:

 

[elbows]

In my mind I see Alan Partridge taking that batsman's stance.

 

[pesh]

In my mind i saw someone wrapping a cricket bat round his head.

 

[elbows]

 

[elbows]