Starbucks coming to Brixton

[Johnny Canuck3]

You are just trolling here aren't you?.

No I'm not trolling here. The way you people go on about it, one would be mislead into thinking that something important is happeining.

Something important would be a proposal to tear down two blocks of Brixton adjacent to the tube station, in order to build an Ikea. That would be worth a fuss.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

http://www.workforce.com/section/02/feature/23/52/96/



I know that's old but am pretty sure they won something similar last year in the UK when their branches had demo's outside them. Found that a bit odd.

Especially when wikipedia is telling us something different.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

am angry that so many people love to go there

Why in heaven's name do you care at all if others like to go there?

Bizarre.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Starbucks is a multinational brand that has the resources to pay through the nose to get a foothold in an area. Its got nothing to do with them running a better business.

Its an unequal playing field between big brands and the little guy. Federation Coffee- could they afford the rental on the high street?

But the coffee tastes shit. Would you pay even a dollar for a cup of coffee that tastes like shit?

Also, according to an article cited by the Ed, starbucks isn't doing well in Scotland. So maybe like the scots, people in Brixton will be able to make up their own minds, even in the face of all that sophisticated advertising from Starbucks.

 

[miss minnie]

No I'm not trolling here. The way you people go on about it, one would be mislead into thinking that something important is happeining.

Something important would be a proposal to tear down two blocks of Brixton adjacent to the tube station, in order to build an Ikea. That would be worth a fuss.

You seem to be the only one misled.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Starbucks is seen by a lot of Brits as a place they avoid as it represents the US.

Finally, someone with the stones to tell the truth. It's not about coffee, or service, or employees.

 

[editor]

Finally, someone with the stones to tell the truth. It's not about coffee, or service, or employees.

No, it's the coffee. Its shit.

Starbucks is bottom of high street coffee test

Starbucks sells coffee that is poor quality and over-priced, according to a survey of cafés.
The biggest player in Britain's £900m-a-year coffee shop industry offers blander drinks than its competitors Costa Coffee and Caffè Nero and is costlier than most rivals, testers for the consumer group Which? reported.

Which? sent a team to visit 45 coffee shops. Giles Hilton, a tester who works for the coffee and tea shop chain Whittard of Chelsea, went undercover at central London branches of Starbucks, Costa and Caffè Nero, where he ordered a cappuccino and an Americano.

He praised the Costa and Caffè Nero cappuccinos but judged Starbucks' cappuccino to be too frothy and its Americano too watery, which resulted in a "faint coffee taste".

He branded the drinks "satisfactory" and "poor" respectively, awarding Starbucks a score of 1.5 out of five. Costa Coffee, the chain owned by the leisure giant Whitbread, was rated three out of five as a result of a "weak" Americano
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...bottom-of-high-street-coffee-test-773150.html

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

No, it's the coffee. Its shit.

I totally agree that the coffee is shit. I'm also not too keen on Hyundais, but I wouldn't raise an eyebrow if another dealership opened up in my city, and people went in and bought them.

 

[Sesquipedalian]

Why in heaven's name do you care at all if others like to go there?

Bizarre.

They (Urbanites),
Think they are being cool and radical,
In opposing Starfucks.

 

[editor]

I totally agree that the coffee is shit. I'm also not too keen on Hyundais, but I wouldn't raise an eyebrow if another dealership opened up in my city, and people went in and bought them.

Perhaps you just don't care as much about what happens to your town as some of the people here, or have such strong feelings about what goes on in your High Street.

Some of us like having small, independent businesses, and will react when we see something that literally threatens their existence.

I've already pointed you to links that shows how Starbucks have a track recoed of closing down rivals by unfair competition, so I'll do my bit to positively promote indie alternatives through urban75 and on these boards.

 

[tarannau]

They (Urbanites),
Think they are being cool and radical,
In opposing Starfucks.

you think it's cool
to write in bad verse and rhyme.
but it just makes you look like a tool
all the fucking time

Anyway I can't get too fussed about Starbucks. Anyway daft and demotivated enough to choose their duff coffee and overpriced pastries was arguably never likely to look that much further afield. I suspect that the existing businesses have strong enough loyalty to retain their share, as regrettable as it to have Starbucks in such a prime spot.

 

[Sesquipedalian]

you think it's cool
to write in bad verse and rhyme.
but it just makes you look like a tool
all the fucking time

Anyway I can't get too fussed about Starbucks. Anyway daft and demotivated enough to choose their duff coffee and overpriced pastries was arguably never likely to look that much further afield. I suspect that the existing businesses have strong enough loyalty to retain their share, as regrettable as it to have Starbucks in such a prime spot.

Use the Ignore function,
You uptight,bullying,
Rancid cunt.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Perhaps you just don't care as much about what happens to your town as some of the people here,.

I care very much about what happens in my town. I just happen to believe that people should save their energy to fight things that really matter. One store amongst hundreds on your high street is a non issue being turned into something other as a result of hysteria, not due to any real threat to the complexion of Brixton.

As I said, if they were levelling a block to put up an Ikea, that would change the complexion. A coffee shop of one or two thousand square feet, is nothing.

 

[miss minnie]

Finally, someone with the stones to tell the truth. It's not about coffee, or service, or employees.

Not my truth. The service and employees are fine. They even have a particularly nice muffin that I like. I even like Americans. But Starbucks coffee is shit and there are loads of other types of shop that we could use instead of another coffee shop.

You seem to be very keen to lump all of us into a small tidy pile that you can sneer at. It may surprise you to know that we aren't all joined at the hip, opinions can vary between posters even those who live in Brixton.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Some of us like having small, independent businesses, and will react when we see something that literally threatens their existence.

I've already pointed you to links that shows how Starbucks have a track recoed of closing down rivals by unfair competition, so I'll do my bit to positively promote indie alternatives through urban75 and on these boards.

I like small independent businesses as well, which is why I patronize them here instead of Starbucks, all issue of coffee quality aside.

As for links, there are also links showing that the scottish weren't fooled, and anecdotal evidence of small shops surviving in spite of the existence of a starbucks.

I've given anecdotal evidence of the proliferation of starbucks here, with an accompanying growth in other coffee business for other establishments, caused when the starbucks causes a growth in the coffee customer base.

All of that is ignored. People seem to prefer the boogeyman story to actual facts that indicate that small business can survive and even thrive with the advent of a starbucks in the neighborhood.

This preference for the boogeyman, is why I call what is happening there, hysteria.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

You seem to be very keen to lump all of us into a small tidy pile that you can sneer at. It may surprise you to know that we aren't all joined at the hip, opinions can vary between posters even those who live in Brixton.

I'm just talking to the small group who are posting gloom and doom stories about what will happen when the starbucks invades the neighborhood.

The only sneering that seems to go on, is when various people in your area, see someone with a starbucks cup in hand.

 

[miss minnie]

I care very much about what happens in my town. I just happen to believe that people should save their energy to fight things that really matter. One store amongst hundreds on your high street

Dozens. Its quite a small high street.

is a non issue being turned into something other as a result of hysteria, not due to any real threat to the complexion of Brixton.

I'm not seeing anything I call hysteria. I'm seeing opinions being aired. Not all the same opinions either.

 

[miss minnie]

I'm just talking to the small group who are posting gloom and doom stories about what will happen when the starbucks invades the neighborhood.

The only sneering that seems to go on, is when various people in your area, see someone with a starbucks cup in hand.

No you are not. Stop lying. You took things I said and twisted them for your own sneering purposes.

 

[Andrew Hertford]

Coffee businesses, or other businesses?

Other cafes lost trade. But the main point is that they blatantly ignored planning rules which other busineses wouldn't and couldn't ignore. They broke the law and knew they could get away with it because they knew the local authority couldn't afford to keep fighting them. That's what they do, that's how they run their business.

S.bucks themselves hardly bother trying to justify what they do so why do you?

 

[Sesquipedalian]

I'm just talking to the small group who are posting gloom and doom stories about what will happen when the starbucks invades the neighborhood.

The only sneering that seems to go on, is when various people in your area, see someone with a starbucks cup in hand.

They think they are,
The voice of Brixton.

And they are sneering.
They always sneer.
Because they truly believe,
They are superior.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Other cafes lost trade. But the main point is that they blatantly ignored planning rules which other busineses wouldn't and couldn't ignore. They broke the law and knew they could get away with it because they knew the local authority couldn't afford to keep fighting them. That's what they do, that's how they run their business.

So, Starbucks broke the law and the local authority allowed it to happen?

That's the sort of accusation that neither Starbucks nor your local authority would take lightly.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

No you are not. Stop lying. You took things I said and twisted them for your own sneering purposes.

An American working in our office made the mistake of going to Starbucks instead of the regular coffee place for the morning coffee order. He was sooo shocked at the looks of disgust from nearly everyone in the office

.............

 

[miss minnie]

.............

He was sooo shocked at the looks of disgust from nearly everyone in the office.

You left out the smiley. It was a humorous incident. As you forced me to explain in a later post which you did not quote.

 

[editor]

I like small independent businesses as well, which is why I patronize them here instead of Starbucks, all issue of coffee quality aside.

As for links, there are also links showing that the scottish weren't fooled, and anecdotal evidence of small shops surviving in spite of the existence of a starbucks.

I've given anecdotal evidence of the proliferation of starbucks here, with an accompanying growth in other coffee business for other establishments, caused when the starbucks causes a growth in the coffee customer base.

All of that is ignored. People seem to prefer the boogeyman story to actual facts that indicate that small business can survive and even thrive with the advent of a starbucks in the neighborhood.

This preference for the boogeyman, is why I call what is happening there, hysteria.

So are you saying that Starbucks hasn't engaged in saturation policies in the past and used their corporate clout to close down rival independent stores in areas?

That's not a "boogeyman story". It's hard evidenced fact.

 

[editor]

So, Starbucks broke the law and the local authority allowed it to happen?

That's the sort of accusation that neither Starbucks nor your local authority would take lightly.

Starbucks breaking the law is rather well documented actually.

Perhaps you were too busy defending Starbucks to notice the link I'd provided earlier on this matter?

Opening without planning permission

Starbucks has been accused by local authorities of opening several stores in the United Kingdom in retail premises, without the planning permission for a change of use to a restaurant. Starbucks has argued that "Under current planning law, there is no official classification of coffee shops. Starbucks therefore encounters the difficult scenario whereby local authorities interpret the guidance in different ways. In some instances, coffee shops operate under A1 permission, some as mixed use A1/A3 and some as A3".[118]
In May 2008, a branch of Starbucks was completed on St. James's Street in Kemptown, Brighton, England, despite having been refused permission by the local planning authority, Brighton and Hove City Council, who claimed there were too many coffee shops already present on the street.[119][120] Starbucks appealed the decision by claiming it was a retail store selling bags of coffee, mugs and sandwiches, gaining a six month extension,[121] but the council ordered Starbucks to remove all tables and chairs from the premises by 20 February 2009, to comply with planning regulations for a retail shop.[122] 2500 residents have signed a petition against the store, and public inquiry is due to be held on 10 June 2009.[123]
A Starbucks in Hertford won its appeal in April 2009 after being open for over a year without planning permission.[124] Two stores in Edinburgh,[125] one in Manchester,[126] one in Cardiff,[127] one in Pinner, Harrow,[118] and one in Blackheath, Lewisham[128][129] were also opened without planning permission.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Perhaps you were too busy defending Starbucks to notice the link I'd provided earlier on this matter?

I'm not defending starbucks at all. I don't like the place. The only 'word' post on my blog is a rant about starbucks cups.

If I'm defending anything, it's the right of people of various tastes, to have the thing they prefer. I won't drink the crap, but others seem to like it.

And I maintain that the appearance of one starbucks in your community is not a harbinger of some sort of creeping doom, and to say that it is, is non-fact-based hysteria.

 

[Andrew Hertford]

So, Starbucks broke the law and the local authority allowed it to happen?

That's the sort of accusation that neither Starbucks nor your local authority would take lightly.

It's not an accusation it's what they do and there's no secret about it. Try doing the same thing as a small business and see how far you get.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Starbucks breaking the law is rather well documented actually.

I've read your quote carefully. I can't find the instances of lawbreaking that you're referring to.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

It's not an accusation it's what they do and there's no secret about it. .

It appears to be the popular but uninformed interpretation of what's going on, by people unfamiliar with the standard practices of businesses of all sorts, when it comes to zoning applications, variances etc.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

We had a similar mini-controversy when Starbucks said it was going to open an outlet on Commercial Drive. Commercial Drive is a lot of things. It's ground zero for the italian coffee houses. It's the center for a lot of alternative lifestlye type things, eg, a pitched battle between the owner of Joes, a coffee place, and the lesbian community who liked to hang there. Joe booted out two women for making out - he's a conservative Portuguese guy. The lesbians camped outside the store and boycotted it for months. It was a cause celebre.

Eventually, everybody kissed and made up. and lesbians can once again be seen drinking coffee in Joes. They make good coffee there, too.


So into this milieu, Starbucks wanted to go. The reaction was sort of like you people's. Howls of outrage. To make a long story short, the Starbucks opened, some people go there, and many many more continue to go to the italian and portuguese places. Lesbians continue to go to Joes. Nothing changed much at all.