Scottish Labour, bast*rds the lot of them

[gosub]

What time is work on the Morningside wall due to start?

 

[geminisnake]

Well I guess they all got their come uppance Bar Edinburgh south, sorry weeps but it was close!

 

[Pickman's model]

from geminisnake's op



is that a simple slip?

 

[geminisnake]

I think it was the only place where the unionists managed to tactically vote properly

 

[danny la rouge]

Due to boundary changes, Labour will lose its only Westminster seat in Scotland:

 

[danny la rouge]

This seems a good enough place to stick this:

Labour MP breaks ranks over Trident

He's my MP. He's only saying this now because he knows he's got a snowball's chance in hell of getting back in. He didn't turn up for the vote against renewing Trident, btw.

Boundary changes: he's gone.

 

[weepiper]

Labour-run city council accused of 'union busting' in row over financial inducements

 

[Sasaferrato]

Boundary changes: he's gone.

If the changes are actually implemented this time.

 

[weepiper]

Labour councillors defy party to lead Aberdeen with the Tories

 

[Sasaferrato]

Labour councillors defy party to lead Aberdeen with the Tories

“As a result, any Labour councillor who does not stand down from this multi-party arrangement will be in breach of Labour Party rules and may be suspended from the party."

Labour finished with half its previous Aberdeen cohort, down from 18 to nine, while the Tories surged to 11 from three.

The Labour leadership are fucking idiots. They lost half of their Councillors, yet fail to realise that being in the tent is better than being outside. OK, they would be junior partners, but as the Conservatives need the Labour votes, it is likely that Labour would get at least some of what they wish to do.

Our council ward has a Conservative councillor (Indeed, every ward has a Conservative Councillor.) And Labour held the Council, in alliance with the Conservatives, who increased their seats by six. The SNP lost two, Labour lost four.

Good news really, when I was a lad, Scotland returned a majority of Conservative MPs, and there is a good chance of half a dozen at least in this election.

The 'real' Conservatives are back, and not before time.

 

[pogofish]

Labour councillors defy party to lead Aberdeen with the Tories

Just met a local SNP staffer in the shop - He was jubilant to the point of incoherence!

Apparently there is something that could invalidate Barney's accession to Provost about to hit too.

 

[pogofish]

when I was a lad, Scotland returned a majority of Conservative MPs,

That was the Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party - a body that merged itself into the national Tories and out of existence in what, the mid 1960s and IMO, the last of their values - which were very different to modern Conservatism and reflected the Scottish political climate much better, fizzled-out with Alick Buchanan-Smith in the late 1970s.

 

[TheHoodedClaw]

Just met a local SNP staffer in the shop - He was jubilant to the point of incoherence!

The staffer has presumably forgotten that the SNP needed Tory support to pass their minority-government budgets on several occasions?

 

[redsquirrel]

Significant difference between going into a coalition with a party and occasionally getting that party to vote for some bills you put up in a minority administration. In fact no real comparison whatsoever.

 

[TheHoodedClaw]

Significant difference between going into a coalition with a party and occasionally getting that party to vote for some bills you put up in a minority administration. In fact no real comparison whatsoever.

Every single Scottish Council is NOC. How do you propose that stuff gets done, if not for coalition politics, in the local context? Dumfries and Galloway had an SNP/Tory coalition as recently as 2012.

 

[TheHoodedClaw]

Every single Scottish Council is NOC. How do you propose that stuff gets done, if not for coalition politics, in the local context? Dumfries and Galloway had an SNP/Tory coalition as recently as 2012.

I mean the local council elections and the Scottish parliament elections are actually designed to encourage coalitions. ffs.

 

[redsquirrel]

So nothing is getting done in the Scottish Parliament currently? Or in the Welsh Assembly? The Scottish LE voting system makes majorities more unlikely but minority governments/administrations are nothing new and there a number of alternatives to coalitions, such as the SNP actions in the Scottish Parliament.

 

[TheHoodedClaw]

So nothing is getting done in the Scottish Parliament currently? Or in the Welsh Assembly? The Scottish LE voting system makes majorities more unlikely but minority governments/administrations are nothing new and there a number of alternatives to coalitions, such as the SNP actions in the Scottish Parliament.

So the coalitions are temporary ones, not particularly formal in the way the Tory/LD one was at Westminster. Surely someone with your deep insight and analytical abilities must be aware of how these voting systems are intended to work?

 

[TheHoodedClaw]

Sorry, it sticks in the craw that any hint of any other party than the SNP dealing with the Tories is squacked down by the wilfully blind zealots.

Edit: Not necessarily on here, the zealot thing

 

[redsquirrel]

The SNP aren't in any type of coalition in the SP, Labour aren't in any type of coalition in the WA - not unless you define the word coalition to mean something else.

 

[TheHoodedClaw]

The SNP aren't in any type of coalition in the SP, Labour aren't in any type of coalition in the WA - not unless you define the word coalition to mean something else.

I know nothing of the WA, but there's a loose coalition with the SNP and Greens in the SP. Loose being the point: there's no trade offs with cabinet positions and the like, unlike the recent Westminster unpleasantness.

Take my local council as an example, here's how it is constituted after the recent locals:

SNP - 8
Labour - 5
Conservative - 5

How does any measure get passed? Does any combination of that constitute a coalition, or is it rather weedy consensus that most people won't grumble about too much?

 

[redsquirrel]

And shit loads of E&W councils are NOC too, that doesn't mean you have to form a coalition. You could
- have some type of limited bargain akin to supply and demand
- deal with each issue on an individual basis
- trade off specific issues against each other
- some combination of the above.

Belgium didn't have a government for a year, didn't notice the whole state collapsing. Some things not getting passed by a LG isn't going to end the world (it might even be a good thing).

And the SNP and Greens voting the same way on a lot of issues, because they have similar politics, does not make them in coalition.

 

[TheHoodedClaw]

And shit loads of E&W councils are NOC too, that doesn't mean you have to form a coalition. You could
- have some type of limited bargain akin to supply and demand
- deal with each issue on an individual basis
- trade off specific issues against each other
- some combination of the above.

Well, yeah? That's what's happening all over. I suppose that there needs to be some concrete agreement between parties to all vote for the council leader, but apart from that?

 

[DownwardDog]

Belgium didn't have a government for a year, didn't notice the whole state collapsing.

It wasn't exactly no government as Belgium has seven levels of government and the coalition talks were only about the top level (federal) government. Also, the Leterme II administration continued on a caretaker basis until the coalition discussions concluded.

 

[Sue]

Another one requested (and rejected) in West Lothian.

Labour executive rejects Tory coalition in West Lothian

 

[danny la rouge]

Labour was in coalition with the Tories in Stirling for the duration of the last council term. I don't remember Scottish Labour suspending them.

 

[Sue]

Labour was in coalition with the Tories in Stirling for the duration of the last council term. I don't remember Scottish Labour suspending them.

General election innit. My sister lives in West Lothian and think the Labour/SMP 'relationship' there is extremely bitter. (As I suspect it is in many places.)

 

[weepiper]

Edinburgh council is currently in a stalemate because the only obvious power sharing combination is SNP/Labour, but the national party has ruled that out as Ian Murray is the only Labour MP left in Scotland and is standing on a ticket of 'only he can stop the SNP' in Edinburgh South.

 

[Sasaferrato]

That was the Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party - a body that merged itself into the national Tories and out of existence in what, the mid 1960s and IMO, the last of their values - which were very different to modern Conservatism and reflected the Scottish political climate much better, fizzled-out with Alick Buchanan-Smith in the late 1970s.

That's true, but they voted together.

 

[redsquirrel]

Edinburgh council is currently in a stalemate because the only obvious power sharing combination is SNP/Labour, but the national party has ruled that out as Ian Murray is the only Labour MP left in Scotland and is standing on a ticket of 'only he can stop the SNP' in Edinburgh South.

Fucking jokers.