Scotland to establish minimum unit price for alcohol

[bimble]

Yep. I had my first experience of being in a country with prohibition recently (Bangladesh). I didn't see any alcohol at all (apart from at the airport where foreigners are allowed to buy it) but was told that there's a big problem with homebrewed rice spirit, especially in rural areas. I was there to do with a charity working with women's rights and there was plenty of domestic violence going on exacerbated by drink. But it's what humans do isn't it, ferment stuff.

 

[A380]

.... But it's what humans do isn't it, ferment stuff.

 

[ddraig]

Spar in Cardiff city centre has a breathyliser that staff are meant to use if they want to check someone before selling them booze
Dodgy imo

 

[ddraig]

Supermarkets breath test customers

 

[alan_]

View attachment 120796

when will David be back?

 

[NoXion]

Spar in Cardiff city centre has a breathyliser that staff are meant to use if they want to check someone before selling them booze
Dodgy imo

Supermarkets breath test customers

What a bunch of pointless theatre. Unless they're going to breathalyse everyone who attempts to purchase alcohol, they're still going to be making a judgement call about which people should be so tested. In which case what's the point of it?

 

[killer b]

The point is to give staff back up so they can refuse to sell booze to obviously pissed up people without it being a judgement call (and therefore open to a possibly aggressive challenge from the pissed up person)

 

[NoXion]

The point is to give staff back up so they can refuse to sell booze to obviously pissed up people without it being a judgement call (and therefore open to a possibly aggressive challenge from the pissed up person)

They still have to judge which people to breathalyse. If someone is obviously drunk enough for that call to be made, do you really think a breathalyser test is going to make a difference as to whether or not they get lairy? If anything the whole ridiculous ceremony itself might set them off.

 

[killer b]

Sorry, I can't sell alcohol to someone who's drunk

But I'm not drunk!

Can you breathe into this then?

...erm.

<wanders off to another offy>

 

[Spymaster]

I'd have thought a pissed up person would be just as likely to get fucked-off at being asked to give a breath sample as they would for being refused alcohol. It shouldn't be staff's responsibility to breath test punters ffs.

 

[bimble]

There's a small newsagents / convenience shop near me where you can't buy a single can of beer at a time, or at least that's what it was like when i tried a while ago.
I think this is a council initative to target skint drinkers ?
Seemed really weird to me can't find much online apart from stories like this
Off-licence banned from selling single cans

 

[NoXion]

Sorry, I can't sell alcohol to someone who's drunk

But I'm not drunk!

Can you breathe into this then?

...erm.

<wanders off to another offy>

Someone who just wanders off quietly when refused service wasn't likely to kick off in the first place.

Also, the fact that they can go elsewhere to get drink means the problem is simply being moved elsewhere.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

They're using the driving limit, which is very approximately two pints. Agree entirely with both points made by the social scientist in the article.

"You'll have all these Christmas dos coming up soon and if my friends and I went out in our suits and ties and want a can from the local Spar, honestly, they are not going to breathalyse us. But they are going to breathalyse the people they think fit the profile.

He said drunkenness and anti-social behaviour were being mentioned alongside rough-sleeping and begging. "But they are two, separate issues. We can't conflate the two."

Judging by what the police are saying, it appears there is a drive by them at the moment to 'clean up' Cardiff. Such drives are normally pretty unpleasant.

 

[Pickman's model]

There's a small newsagents / convenience shop near me where you can't buy a single can of beer at a time, or at least that's what it was like when i tried a while ago.
I think this is a council initative to target skint drinkers ?
Seemed really weird to me can't find much online apart from stories like this
Off-licence banned from selling single cans

it's to make sure you don't need to go back to the offie four times.

 

[planetgeli]

The breathalysers have the same limit as used for testing DUI, drinking and driving. So, two pints and you can’t buy alcohol from my shop? Get to fuck.

 

[weepiper]

I'd have thought a pissed up person would be just as likely to get fucked-off at being asked to give a breath sample as they would for being refused alcohol

It's almost as if people regarding getting fucked up as a god-given right and using being pissed as an excuse for violence is a problem which society needs to tackle in some way or something.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I'd have thought a pissed up person would be just as likely to get fucked-off at being asked to give a breath sample as they would for being refused alcohol. It shouldn't be staff's responsibility to breath test punters ffs.

This stuff can very quickly become normalised as well. If part of the police's drive to Clean Up Cardiff is going to include a crackdown on offies selling to the drunk (and I'd dispute the idea that above the limit for driving is 'drunk' tbh) then those offies are likely to become very risk-averse very quickly, particularly if the individual serving is the one personally responsible for the sale.

 

[killer b]

It shouldn't be staff's responsibility to breath test punters ffs.

It's their responsibility to refuse to serve drunk people. They can be - and are - prosecuted if they do. I doubt it ever gets as far as someone actually being breathalysed tbh. It's just so they can go 'computer says nah'/

 

[killer b]

Also, the fact that they can go elsewhere to get drink means the problem is simply being moved elsewhere.

that's what happens every time someone is refused service or booted out of a pub though.

 

[Spymaster]

It's almost as if people regarding getting fucked up as a god-given right and using being pissed as an excuse for violence is a problem which society needs to tackle in some way or something.

Not sure what point you're making.

 

[NoXion]

It's their responsibility to refuse to serve drunk people. They can be - and are - prosecuted if they do. I doubt it ever gets as far as someone actually being breathalysed tbh. It's just so they can go 'computer says nah'/

Oh yeah, I'm sure drunk people are totally not going to be utterly cheesed off at being denied further drink just because a stupid little machine is involved. Not. A breathalyser might give staff firmer legal ground to stand on (even though they've always had the right to refuse service for any reason) but that's not really helpful to staff dealing with people who are unlikely to be convinced by legalism at the best of times.

that's what happens every time someone is refused service or booted out of a pub though.

Exactly. It's pointless theatre.

 

[Spymaster]

It's their responsibility to refuse to serve drunk people. They can be - and are - prosecuted if they do. I doubt it ever gets as far as someone actually being breathalysed tbh. It's just so they can go 'computer says nah'/

Well you answer your own point there. They have a legal obligation not to serve people who are obviously drunk; not to challenge ones who may or may not be and breath test them to find out.

 

[Pickman's model]

Oh yeah, I'm sure drunk people are totally not going to be utterly cheesed off at being denied further drink just because a stupid little machine is involved. Not. A breathalyser might give staff firmer legal ground to stand on (even though they've always had the right to refuse service for any reason) but that's not really helpful to staff dealing with people who are unlikely to be convinced by legalism at the best of times.



Exactly. It's pointless theatre.

the thing is it's very easy to set off the breathalyser after a few swigs of alcohol. it's a stupid thing to rely on them - take one of these things round a pub and ask people who've had a pint to blow into them. loads of them will set it off.

 

[killer b]

Well you answer your own point there. They have a legal obligation not to serve people who are obviously drunk; not to challenge ones who may or may not be and breath test them to find out.

Which they wouldn't be doing - it a tool to help them get rid of the obviously drunk ones, not so they can test anyone they want to.

 

[Pickman's model]

Which they wouldn't be doing - it a tool to help them get rid of the obviously drunk ones, not so they can test anyone they want to.

yeh. and how long do you think that will last?

 

[bimble]

I’d be terrified of refusing to take some pissed up bloke’s money if I worked in a little shop. Seems mad to lay this responsibility on staff often working alone at night.

 

[killer b]

I’d be terrified of refusing to take some pissed up bloke’s money if I worked in a little shop. Seems mad to lay this responsibility on staff often working alone at night.

but that's a responsibility they already have.

 

[NoXion]

Which they wouldn't be doing - it a tool to help them get rid of the obviously drunk ones, not so they can test anyone they want to.

If it gets to the point where the prospective customer is not taking "no" for an answer, then how does a breath test help? Your assumption that they will just go quietly at that point doesn't seem to be based on any drunk lairy people I've encountered before.

 

[Treacle Toes]

Which they wouldn't be doing - it a tool to help them get rid of the obviously drunk ones, not so they can test anyone they want to.

It would be completely unsafe for many shop workers to request people take the test, let alone refuse to sell alcohol.

 

[bimble]

but that's a responsibility they already have.

I didn't know tbh. But can imagine if it was me that i'd just 'not notice' that the customer was drunk, for reasons of self preservation.