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Professionals send Brixton property prices surging by 15%

Manter said:
I think that is East London, and out of date. White flight is typically white people moving away to get away from a new, usually poor, minority community that scares/threatens them (such as happened in Bradford, parts of leeds & birmingham etc) that then results in loss of established businesses, boarded up shops, more immigration of the same community, ghettoisation, collapse in property values, less economic opportunity, soaring crime etc etc- it is the ultimate result of fucked up immigration policies. It may have applied to windrush brixton, but really not now- as I say, I think he is talking about a different time, in a different part of london, and using hyperbole
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Well, I think the situation in the North is more because of the collapse of the manufacturing industries, which is probably at the centre of everything you mention above.
 
Winot said:
Not sure how new or different this is - I rented in West Hampstead when I first got to London (1993). When my gf was making the move in 1994 the rents had gone up to the extent that she couldn't afford to live there.

We ended up in Brixton as a result ;)
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First they came for West Hampstead and I did not speak out etc...;)

Was West Hampstead a deprived area previous to '93? I have no idea as I was kid then! :D

It seems that the gentrification and the prices of rents has gone up considerably in any well connected places within zone 2, except in recent years they have dared to come South!!! :mad: :mad:

See also the price of renting in Oval/Vauxhall since the gays moved in and made it trendy.
 
zenie said:
Was West Hampstead a deprived area previous to '93? I have no idea as I was kid then! :D
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Not at all, but it was affordable (it's a bit of a misnomer really as the Finchley Rd separates it from Hampstead - really it's Cricklewood/Kilburn).
 
Winot said:
Not at all, but it was affordable (it's a bit of a misnomer really as the Finchley Rd separates it from Hampstead - really it's Cricklewood/Kilburn).
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Yeah, try telling people in W'Hamps that they're actually living in Cricklewood! :D There'd be murder.
 
Winot said:
Not sure how new or different this is - I rented in West Hampstead when I first got to London (1993). When my gf was making the move in 1994 the rents had gone up to the extent that she couldn't afford to live there.

We ended up in Brixton as a result ;)
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When I bought my first place in Brixton proper in '98 (I'd been off Landor Road prior to that) I bought it from an exceedingly posh bloke who wore a three piece pin stripe suit and a bowler hat every day. He moved to Hampstead because he was getting married (for the fifth time) to a German lady who would not live in Brixton.
 
MillwallShoes said:
Interesting, thread, thought i'd sign up.

What people are moaning about is the housing market - simple market forces. What's happened in Brixton is just how the housing market works. Some areas become desirable, others become less so.

How many people on this forum are born and raised Brixton?

Anyway, the middle classes will do what the white working classes did (very few white working class left in inner london). They will move out to the suburbs. For all their love of its edgyness, Berkshire and Surrey will become suddenly attractive to them when their kids are of secondary school age.

People knocking Penge on here...

Education, extortionate house prices, deprivation, crime, the fear of letting teenage kids out at night, poor housing, transient yuppies, are all reasons why I would rather live in Penge - a town that has a good a mix of people, affordable housing, where the schools have a good mix of people, a town that has not changed much for years (just like how you wish Brixton hadn't changed for years) - than Brixton.
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At the end of the day it's still "Penge, arsehole of south London" though, isn't it? :)

AS for the heygate, i know many people who grew up in South East London, on council estates, throughout the eighties and nineties and they couldn't wait to get out to Kent and Essex. Were literally queuing up to get out. People who used to be known as "cockneys". Whilst living in crime ridden hell holes, they had yuppies all around them using the local housing stock and housing market as some sort of edgy play thing.
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The problem being that prices are now such that even commuter-belt and beyond are unaffordable to people on the "average wage" or less. If a one bedroom flat is an absolute minimum of £150,000, then unless you get a mortgage broker who's prepared to give you 3 x salary or more without a 10-20% deposit, you're looking at needing to earn £60,000 or more, or more than twice the average wage.

If you look closely at london, it's just a transient mess...
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It's a capital city. It's kind of their purpose to be constantly in flux socially. I think that the point people are trying to make is that of course there's always been a movement from the inner to the outer city, and back again, of the monied classes. What's happening now though, doesn't appear to be for the familiar reasons of previous waves - necessity, transport infrastructure, access to existing culture - in Brixton's case the current wave of "gentrification" (perhaps from the early 2000s-on) through property purchase is about buying access to a local culture because of its' "genuineness", as if people are moving here to purchase a sense of validity and belonging (generally at the cost of the people who've created and nurtured that local culture).

...and everyone is largely either on the bottom or on the top - with the gap growing all the time. I have grown fonder and fonder of the suburbs. People talk about "culture" - they can be fuck all real culture without community, and real communities are getting less and less in inner london.
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"Fewer and fewer", you barbarian!
And you're welcome to the 'burbs. Dead as fuck.
 
MillwallShoes said:
it's almost a conservative type of thinking to expect one small town in london to remain the same, with the same "locals", the same property prices. not going to happen, is it.
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No-one has asked for it to stay the same, they've expressed the desire not to have the area ripped away from them with quite the rapidity it is being ripped away at. We're not morons. We're perfectly aware that money talks, but that doesn't mean we're going to be meek and quiet about our communities being destroyed.
 
MillwallShoes said:
where did i say about heygate specifically. i know plenty of people from okr, walworth, peckham, new cross, who moved because they didn't like the area anymore, and because of house prices.

see, it's that wretched hosuing market again. but it's the way it works. it's simple economics and shouting and screaming about cup cakes and single speed bikes is missing hte point. areas change.

and it was a form of white flight when the mass white working class deserted innner london for the home counties. if i can't call it white flight, then god help us
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Like Millwall FC, you seem to get things arse about face.
The "white flight" to the suburbs you talk about, both post-war waves, were for the same reason. Not desertion, but because under regional government funding schemes, a lot of the small to medium manufacturing business that frequented inner London railway arches were enticed onto industrial estates in the arse-end of Surrey, Herts etc. Workers followed their jobs - usually with a one-off moving payment funded by the same development agency that encouraged the employer to move.
It wasn't "white flight", it was business flight that stripped a section of the white working classes from the inner cities.
 
ViolentPanda said:
What's happening now though, doesn't appear to be for the familiar reasons of previous waves - necessity, transport infrastructure, access to existing culture - in Brixton's case the current wave of "gentrification" (perhaps from the early 2000s-on) through property purchase is about buying access to a local culture because of its' "genuineness", as if people are moving here to purchase a sense of validity and belonging (generally at the cost of the people who've created and nurtured that local culture).
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Do you have any evidence for this?
 
RaverDrew said:
I've seen it in my lifetime, the demographics of estates in South London changing hugely and rapidly at times. It's not always a case of people or families fleeing from minorities, there's often other economic reasons, but I've lost count of the amount of friends and families, some of which have lived in the same area for generations, shifted and relocated further and further out of London.

It's not just "white flight" either, bme communities are being forced out too nowadays, there's plenty who have left Brixton to places like Thornton Heath.
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Thing is drew, when I was a schoolkid in the '70s, most demographic change on estates was slow and voluntary - people moving with their job, because their family had outgrown the house, or because they'd "gone up in the world" and put a deposit down on a house of their own - people-centred, if you will.
Now, most of it is at the whim of "the markets" and the requirement of local authorities to let what stock they still have on a needs basis - market-centred, if you will.
 
ViolentPanda said:
Beyond the fact that developments are being sold on such terms, and anecdotage? No, sorry, I don't have statistical breakdowns of purchaser preference!
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I'm not surprised that you don't have evidence - discerning other people's motives is a tricky thing to do. That being the case, I think you need to be careful when speculating - saying that

people are moving here to purchase a sense of validity and belonging (generally at the cost of the people who've created and nurtured that local culture)
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is a pretty divisive thing to say.
 
Winot said:
I'm not surprised that you don't have evidence - discerning other people's motives is a tricky thing to do. That being the case, I think you need to be careful when speculating - saying that



is a pretty divisive thing to say.
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divisive maybe. But who do people want to move to and/or live in Brixton?
 
Winot said:
I'm not surprised that you don't have evidence - discerning other people's motives is a tricky thing to do. That being the case, I think you need to be careful when speculating - saying that



is a pretty divisive thing to say.
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In case I hurt someones' feelings or even their (shock! horror!) house price?

It hasn't occurred to you that it''s meant to be divisive, to reflect how I have felt watching Brixton being sold by the pound for the last 10-15 years?
 
Well, for the record, I moved here because a)It was cheap, b)Urban75 (and the people therein), and c)The market. I've stayed for b) and c)
 
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