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New Space (Arms) Race Watch

NATO doing something....not clear what exactly from this:

NATO names space as an ‘operational domain,’ but without plans to weaponize it

BRUSSELS — NATO foreign ministers have for the first time formally declared space as an “operational domain.”

The announcement at a meeting in Brussels on Wednesday means space will now be regarded as equally important for NATO alongside air, land, sea and cyberspace. The move illustrates the growing significance of space for the alliance.

“This can allow NATO planners to make requests for allies to provide capabilities and services, such as hours of satellite communications,” NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg told reporters.

“Space is part of our daily life here on Earth. It can be used for peaceful purposes. But it can also be used aggressively. Satellites can be jammed, hacked or weaponized. Anti-satellite weapons could cripple communications and other services our societies rely on, such as air travel, weather forecast or banking,” he said. “Space is also essential to the alliance’s deterrence and defense, including the ability to navigate, gather intelligence and to detect missile launches.”

It is estimated that about 2,000 satellites currently orbit Earth, with half owned by NATO member countries.

Ministers agreed that space is “essential” to NATO’s deterrence and defense, from its ability to navigate and track forces, to satellite communications and detecting missile launches.

The agreement comes ahead of next month’s NATO leadership meeting in London, England, and it places space firmly on to the agenda when NATO military commanders plan or review the alliance’s posture and activities.

NATO insists it has “no intention” to put weapons in space or develop its own space-based capabilities. Stoltenberg on Wednesday specifically said NATO has no plans to “weaponize space.”


“Our approach will remain defensive and fully in line with international law. NATO has no intention to put weapons in space. But we need to ensure our missions and operations have the right support,” he said.

“But,” he added, “we have to relate to the fact that space is becoming more and more important for our military operations and missions. This is to do with the vulnerability and resilience of our civilian societies because space is so important for navigation, communications and for many other things.”

NATO’s largest ally, the United States, recently stood up a Space Command.

Speaking at a news briefing on Tuesday, Stoltenberg had refused to be drawn into a discussion about the relationship between U.S. Space Command and NATO’s possible future space-based early-warning capabilities. “I will not go into the specifics of how we are going to communicate with national space commands and national space capabilities," he said. “What NATO will do will be defensive, and we will not deploy weapons in space.”
 
Someone at Freedom has read the Tory manifesto and spotted this:


"We will adapt to new threats, investing more in cybersecurity and setting up the UK’s first Space Command.
p53
"

From Freedom: "we can expect to hear a great deal about the military expansion into space. This is the next level for countries interested in global dominance and the Tories want to ensure that the UK is right there, contributing as much as it can. While the Tories will cut benefits for people and funding for life saving research once again we can see where their priorities lie."
 
Someone at Freedom has read the Tory manifesto and spotted this:


"We will adapt to new threats, investing more in cybersecurity and setting up the UK’s first Space Command.
p53
"

From Freedom: "we can expect to hear a great deal about the military expansion into space. This is the next level for countries interested in global dominance and the Tories want to ensure that the UK is right there, contributing as much as it can. While the Tories will cut benefits for people and funding for life saving research once again we can see where their priorities lie."
excuse the Copy & Paste but more on the coming UK SPACE COMMAND
First time ive heard the term "counterspace"


UK Conservative Party Election Pledge: We’ll Set Up a UK Space Command
https://spacewatch.global/2019/11/u...ection-pledge-well-set-up-a-uk-space-command/


The British Conservative Party has released its manifesto, as part of its campaign for the 12 December 2019 British General Election, and has pledged that if re-elected it will create a UK Space Command.

In its manifesto, the Conservative Party, led by current Prime Minister Boris Johnson, pledged: “We will adapt to new threats, investing more in cybersecurity and setting up the UK’s first Space Command.”

If the Conservative Party is re-elected on 12 December, it will mean that the UK will follow France as the second European country to create a dedicated command structure for military space activities. In the summer of 2019, the French Defence Minister, Florence Parly, announced the creation of a Space Command within the French Air Force and revealed that the new entity would have a counterspace mission, albeit a limited one.

The Conservative Party pledge also comes as the United States – Britain’s closest ally – has rejuvenated its joint Space Command and is in the process of creating a Space Force.

This trend toward creating dedicated military space command structures in a growing number of militaries is being driven, according to advocates, by Chinese, Russian, North Korean, and Iranian development of anti-satellite (ASAT) and other counterspace capabilities that could offset Western military superiority by targeting and potentially destroying satellites in a conflict.

For critics, the growing emphasis on military space commands and capability in response to the threats posed by China, Russia, North Korea, and Iran will only make the prospect of space warfare more likely in future conflicts, with catastrophic environmental consequences in Earth orbit, as well dire strategic effects given that for a number of countries satellites play a critical role in nuclear command and control and early warning.

The UK Space Command pledge by the Conservative Party would, if they are re-elected, be the latest space initiative from the British government over the past several years, bolstering UK military space capability and strategic importance, though the manifesto pledge does not mention whether such a command would take on any counterspace missions or roles.

In addition to a number of organisational, allied, and funding initiatives over the past few years, the British government is also developing a synthetic aperture radar (SAR) satellite reconnaissance system, and has just opened up the bidding for its Skynet-6 military satellite communications programme.

The other major British political parties – Labour and the Liberal Democrats – have not mentioned military space issues in their respective manifestos.
 
US Space Force is officially signed sealed and go
"Air Force Secretary Barbara Barrett said the Space Force would comprise around 16,000 Air Force and civilian personnel.
It will be led by Air Force General Jay Raymond, who currently runs SpaceCom.
Earlier this month, Russia's President Vladimir Putin suggested US expansion in space posed a threat to Russian interests, and required a response from Russia."
 
More money for tin cans with lazers; zooming round the moon on Star Group 7, Trump's hand chosen troops.

Looking for trouble...
 
UK space command will rebadge the various people who do shit with sat comms etc into one office while everyone else makes jokes about Trekkies and tinfoil miniskirts.
the royal marines will wear purple wigs and tinfoil miniskirts in honor of space force then get very drunk naked and start a fight basically Tuesday for them
 
I suppose the question is , was the recent Russian satellite thing (weapon), Putins response from Russia to increased American space militarization.
I reckon it was . But I belive Russian and Chinese current militarisation of space is simply keeping up with the US in typical arms race fashion . Looking back over the cold war America was the main threat and Russia was more concerned with not destroying all life on the planet.
I would offer the partially informed opinion that these cold war traits are continuing into this phase.
 
I am super cereal. You must have seen Dr. Strangelove ? That was based on a true story.
 
Oh this alledged weapons test (which Russia deny.. but that's not saying anything) is
Unacceptable

according to the US .

I hope this in combination with Trump's current psychotic pre election thirst for destruction .... does not lead to some stupid retaliation .
 
I suppose the question is , was the recent Russian satellite thing (weapon), Putins response from Russia to increased American space militarization.
I reckon it was . But I belive Russian and Chinese current militarisation of space is simply keeping up with the US in typical arms race fashion . Looking back over the cold war America was the main threat and Russia was more concerned with not destroying all life on the planet.
I would offer the partially informed opinion that these cold war traits are continuing into this phase.
Oh this alledged weapons test (which Russia deny.. but that's not saying anything) is


according to the US .

I hope this in combination with Trump's current psychotic pre election thirst for destruction .... does not lead to some stupid retaliation .

So they do actually internet in North Korea.

Looks like Kim Jong-un has snuck in under the radar.
 
I suppose the question is , was the recent Russian satellite thing (weapon), Putins response from Russia to increased American space militarization.
I reckon it was . But I belive Russian and Chinese current militarisation of space is simply keeping up with the US in typical arms race fashion .
It's a multipolar world... We're past the point of asking who started it
 
Oh come on . America are the leader of the gang. Every other state seems more concerned with preserving themselves than going for the world domination strategy.

As I said, looking back at the Cold War it was America who pushed it forward . They have been leading since Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

I am not saying that Russia and China or even ... lol ... N Korea haven't got secret plans to rule the world ... who knows? But from the evidence available it looks like America is going for world domination and everyone else has a relatively non aggressive foreign policy ...... blatantly no ?
 
Oh come on . America are the leader of the gang. Every other state seems more concerned with preserving themselves than going for the world domination strategy.

As I said, looking back at the Cold War it was America who pushed it forward . They have been leading since Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

I am not saying that Russia and China or even ... lol ... N Korea haven't got secret plans to rule the world ... who knows? But from the evidence available it looks like America is going for world domination and everyone else has a relatively non aggressive foreign policy ...... blatantly no ?

The Cold War was nearly 30 years ago. The US had its triumphalist phase in the immediate aftermath, but all the energy they've spent since then trying to impose their will in foreign affairs, and all the international goodwill they've pissed away by doing so, means that they've horribly neglected their domestic situation and increasingly upset their nominal allies. Its current trajectory means that the US is presently on its way to becoming a failed state. Not only that, but even if the US state were to stop punching itself in the face, countries like China, India et al have been have been busy playing catch-up in military and economic terms.

You're literally stuck in the past.
 
It`s the manner in which the state declines which concerns our immediate future, genius . Been keeping up with current affairs ?

+ god i hate repeating myself..... America is the only fuckers going for world domination openly.

Lets just say hypothetically someone pushes the button say within the next few months... who is your money on?
 
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Dumb thread is dumb.
Clowns who could not convert a Joule into a Watt per second pronouncing on space policy.
 
The Sunday Times has a long piece on what the Tories have in store for us in the next year. It includes:

Johnson will use the defence and security review to try to come up with a coherent foreign and security policy that toughens Britain’s stance against aggressors such as Russia and China while avoiding actual conflict with the two superpowers. The exercise will also be used by Dominic Cummings, his chief aide, to shake up the military, refocusing the security services on hi-tech platforms, including in space.
 
The Sunday Times has a long piece on what the Tories have in store for us in the next year. It includes:

Johnson will use the defence and security review to try to come up with a coherent foreign and security policy that toughens Britain’s stance against aggressors such as Russia and China while avoiding actual conflict with the two superpowers. The exercise will also be used by Dominic Cummings, his chief aide, to shake up the military, refocusing the security services on hi-tech platforms, including in space.
If the Tories really wanted a coherent foreign, security and indeed defence policy they'd step back from global ambitions, recognising that punching above the UK's weight is living beyond its means
 
If the Tories really wanted a coherent foreign, security and indeed defence policy they'd step back from global ambitions, recognising that punching above the UK's weight is living beyond its means
In a way that's what pissing about in space is. Rumbles in the press are that the army generals are against Cummings plans, as it's an effective shrinking of soldier numbers.

??
 
Dumb thread is dumb.
Clowns who could not convert a Joule into a Watt per second pronouncing on space policy.

Wow, ferrellhadley popped in to say how stupid he thinks everybody else is, how incredibly surprising.

Donald Trump is the one signing NASA's checks these days, Brainiac, space is politics - you think anyone asks him for conversions before he decides space policy?
 
Pissing about in space is very much not accepting a lesser role on the world stage
It looks like a strategic retreat to me, of sorts at least. Of course this is not disarmament. But does seem to be a step back from boots on ground.

That's just my perception, we'll see
 
It looks like a strategic retreat to me, of sorts at least. Of course this is not disarmament. But does seem to be a step back from boots on ground.

That's just my perception, we'll see
It's not a strategic retreat of any sort, if the general strategic aim of armed forces is to successfully impose one's will on one's opponents.
 
It's not a strategic retreat of any sort, if the general strategic aim of armed forces is to successfully impose one's will on one's opponents.
Yes but.

Isn't it more of a stand off situation in space? Can't immediately see how the UK could invade Iraq, say, via space arms. I guess the issue is how much is it at the expense of ground troops. If it's not at the cost of the other then I agree with you. If it's replacing significant soldier power then that's a degree of scaling back.

Cummings has iirc given his thoughts on the army elsewhere, I can't look for them right now though.

Johnson loves Roman imperialism and has a hard on for British imperialism too. I certainly don't take him for a dove.
 
Yes but.

Isn't it more of a stand off situation in space? Can't immediately see how the UK could invade Iraq, say, via space arms. I guess the issue is how much is it at the expense of ground troops. If it's not at the cost of the other then I agree with you. If it's replacing significant soldier power then that's a degree of scaling back.

Cummings has iirc given his thoughts on the army elsewhere, I can't look for them right now though.

Johnson loves Roman imperialism and has a hard on for British imperialism too. I certainly don't take him for a dove.
If you have space arms you can target satellites, you can have bombs in space which can be targeted onto any country, and some way down the line you could fire a directed energy weapon. If you fucked eg Iraq by destroying satellites vital to its communications any ground ops would go much easier. But would you need to? In many if not most cases possessing the ability to remove communications could lead to a country like Iraq bending to your will
 
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