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Maidstone United v Dulwich Hamlet, Tuesday 15th March

Really poor. No idea going forward. Could not string 2 passes together. In fact stringing 1 pass together was beyond us most of the game. Could have been anything between 1 and 5 v 0. Another poor error for the 2nd. Lot of players way off form and there seems little idea of how to put together a forward move . Apart from that ....
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Really poor. No idea going forward. Could not string 2 passes together. In fact stringing 1 pass together was beyond us most of the game. Could have been anything between 1 and 5 v 0. Another poor error for the 2nd. Lot of players way off form and there seems little idea of how to put together a forward move . Apart from that ....
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Unfortunately this is becoming the norm. Past few performances have really been piss-poor against teams that are crap.
 
Unfortunately this is becoming the norm. Past few performances have really been piss-poor against teams that are crap.
Maidstone are far from crap though. They were fitter, faster and hungrier than us. We were masters of our own demise at times too.

Gavin out. He signs, coaches and picks that rabble. We don't appear to be coached at all, relying on moments of individual craft and have no strategy that's discernable. We are top heavy with wee wingers: I understand Allassani was playing for all the difference it made but he looked no fitter than me. When Levee went off we totally lost the midfield.

We are safe from going down but look a shadow of the free scoring, exciting side we saw in the autumn.

Highlight of the evening was the chicken balti pie and chips.
 
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If Gavin goes. Who do u want to come in. Gavin will do for me. Where. Do u think we can get to without him We r punching at the moment Must admit need a better line going forward Danny and McQueen r our top forwards.
 
9 games to go and then decisions have to be made. Regular supporters not going to home games because the whole match day experience is poor. Now those same supporters can’t be arsed to go to away games because the football is so bad. It’s been pathetic for more than a a couple of seasons now. Changes have to be made
 
If Gavin goes. Who do u want to come in. Gavin will do for me. Where. Do u think we can get to without him We r punching at the moment Must admit need a better line going forward Danny and McQueen r our top forwards.
Succession planning is a job for the board. I don't know all the likely candidates but I would like to think they do. You look at that Maidstone team tonight, that's the sort of performance we should aspire to. They played good attacking football and have gone top I think as a result.

I don't go to Hamlet thinking "I want to see us in the Championship in five years" - but I do want to see a team that's at least vaguely organised and coached. We are consistently inconsistent over the period we've been in NLS. He's had three years at this level and we are not improving.
 
If Gavin goes. Who do u want to come in. Gavin will do for me. Where. Do u think we can get to without him We r punching at the moment Must admit need a better line going forward Danny and McQueen r our top forwards.

I'm willing to wager there's any number of managers out there chomping at the bit to have a go at running us. Large crowds, media profile etc etc.

9 games to go and then decisions have to be made. Regular supporters not going to home games because the whole match day experience is poor. Now those same supporters can’t be arsed to go to away games because the football is so bad. It’s been pathetic for more than a a couple of seasons now. Changes have to be made

It's a huge deal for me to leave the flat at the moment. Nights like tonight make me question the wisdom of doing so again.
 
9 games to go and then decisions have to be made. Regular supporters not going to home games because the whole match day experience is poor. Now those same supporters can’t be arsed to go to away games because the football is so bad. It’s been pathetic for more than a a couple of seasons now. Changes have to be made
I can only speak for myself but sometimes it really feels like the fun has been sucked out of following Hamlet, and that's not just because they're so uninspiring on the pitch. :(
 
Gav’s been there for 13 years. His win percentage in the NLS is 31.6%. Not great. The issue is there is vey little accountability. Gav is more than just the 1st team manager and I am guessing his sphere of influence runs deep. I would suspect he has had offers from other clubs but moving would mean giving up quite a bit of control. It will be Gav’s decision to leave when he feels the time is right regardless of results on the pitch. The board have had bigger issues to address than performances on the pitch over the last 5 years. Therefore the quality of football has been allowed to slide.
 
Again, it is clear what the problem is. We know the team is pretty good because of their performances in the first half of the season. But now they are awful to watch on the pitch which in turn is casting a pall over the whole of the club's operation. The manager is essential to the health of the club. And I am afraid the current incumbent is dragging us down; literally and figuratively. It has been like this (give or take) since we went up.
 
The board would surely advertise, you'd probably see a few interesting left field applicants.

I suspect what happens to Aspire if Gavin leaves is crucial in the decision making. If they dis-affiliated, you would probably be looking to appoint someone with a strong academy background, to build a new academy.

That would probably rule out some obvious candidates - the links if Gary McCann - ex Hamlet, knows the level and always over achieves on his budget but I'm not aware of him having an academy background.

As such I suspect succession planning covers a wide range of potential scenarios with a few names to the forefront but a plan to advertise.
 
What managers r about please name a couple at least who have done well in our league sorry can’t see who will come in surprise me with a couple of names.
What we can only appoint a Manager who’s been successful at this level? Following that we wouldn’t have appointed Gavin in the first place. If you think no one would apply you’re wrong. Managers may even apply who currently have a job. As others have said it’s not our job to supply the names. If the board are happy with the ‘progress’ so be it. We seemingly have no belief, desire or ability in how we play bar a few individuals.
 
I can only speak for myself but sometimes it really feels like the fun has been sucked out of following Hamlet, and that's not just because they're so uninspiring on the pitch. :(
Yep I get it. 50 years plus I’ve been going. Just couldn’t be arsed the other Saturday, went to Carshalton had a chat with Peter Adeniyi and Harry Ottaway football was decent. They sold chips. Walked round the ground. Dulwich is in my blood but it’s been dire this season as an all round experience
 
I had a chat with a board club official a while back about a step five manager he was keeping an eye on. (No names as he is currently employed.) I'd be surprised if any vacancy didn't see managers well beyond the usual suspects considered.

There is of course currently no vacancy. Other managers positions may change before that does, rendering speculation about exact names pretty pointless for now. I suspect David Oldfield would have been if interest earlier this season, he's probably off the table now.
 
Without knowing the ins and outs of every other club in our league I’d guess we’re in a unique position with our Manager and his academy being so deeply entwined in the structure and recent history of the club. During the good times that’s not a problem and indeed has been a benefit with young players coming into the squad, during the less good times, it potentially becomes one - especially if that pipeline of young talent starts to dry up or gets picked off before getting near the first team, with uncertainty as to who benefits in that situation - the club, the academy, or both?

As has been mentioned you get the impression the only way Gavin Rose leaves his role is if he chooses to. And if there’s any appetite for success at the club, eventually that’s going to be a problem. It also makes you wonder what motivation there is for the Manager to succeed in those circumstances - if he’s happy with the way things are going as a whole and doesn’t feel like his position is ever under threat, maybe he’s not that bothered with the current performances and disintegration of form. He certainly doesn’t seem upset on the sidelines.

To anyone pointing to the first half of the season as to what Gavin Rose is capable of at this level, I’d argue that this is the best squad we’ve had for many a year, certainly in his time as Manager. A large portion of the credit for bringing that squad together is with him, no doubt - but slowly but surely they’re getting worse and worse, to the point of the abject recent performances. Which the Manager generally watches from the sidelines in silence, whilst opposition Managers and their teams instruct, encourage, organise. And the players seemingly play with little desire or enthusiasm. The atmosphere around the playing side of the club seems rotten. I’m certain that a lot of the frustration being expressed from fans at the moment would be lessened a bit if we could see the management or the players actually cared and were giving their all to try and get a result.

And as has been pointed out a lot of times this season alone, there seems to be a real reluctance for the Manager and his team to communicate with the fans. Where other clubs at our level are putting out interviews with their Managers immediately after games, updates during the week, confirming players coming in and out, injury updates, whatever the result or circumstance, we’re lucky to get the odd run of two or three games and a couple of minutes of interview, then back to nothing for prolonged periods. It’s beyond the point where, in the absence of any other credible explanation, the only seeming conclusion is that Gavin Rose is choosing to do that.

To those that point to the vast majority of success that Gavin Rose has had during his time at the club, leading us to our best level ever, and his loyalty to the club over the years particularly during the period where we were homeless, that absolutely should not be forgotten. But there comes a point where the present needs to be assessed without the affection for the past colouring that view. Whether we’re at that point now is in the opinion of the individual - but if it’s not now, I think it’s worth asking yourself where that tipping point would be, and what should be done when it’s reached.

I get that the Board have a lot of other things to deal with at the moment, but there’s a part of me that thinks that’s a way to swerve the issue and wait to see if things get better or dissipate over the summer. You also wonder if they’re happy with the current situation, with the crowds of day trippers justifying things in their minds. Accountability seems a little stretched there as well, though, as seen with the whole Crouch / gambling issue remaining unaddressed despite assurances it would be.

And on that count, it doesn't help that if anyone has the temerity to question what the Board are doing, the challenge back is often to ask if you could do better then why not do it yourself or similar, which again shuts down accountability. We can be both exceedingly grateful for everything people who put their time into the club do, and ask questions of them at the same time - if those things can’t co-exist, there’s real danger that the club only ever looks inward, and that’s never a good thing.

As I say, everyone can make up their own minds on where the club is and if it’s a good situation or not - but I think it’s hard to deny that at this point there are questions that should be being asked of the Manager and the Board - and there seems to be little desire from the club to listen to them, let alone provide answers.
 
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I believe Gav's contract is up at the end of the season? I'd suggest - and stress suggest, I don't know - the Board are giving him until the end of the season and will review then.

Gav has over achieved against budget this year. The budget was slashed for two consecutive seasons due to Covid. (Ben has put that into the public domain. As a minor shareholder I know the %'s which I don't think are public. Suffice to say you'd be amazed and most managers would have walked.)

Budgets for next season will be signed off soon / been done recently. I'd expect a decision to be made about whether the current incumbent is the right man to spend the new budget to be made after budget setting, with discreet feelers going out of it is decided to change.

I'm confident the fact silence is - correctly - being maintained doesn't mean the club are not reviewing. Shareholders get a pretty detailed post season review of pretty much all aspects of the club. Ben is a details man, he drives this. It would be unlike him to miss something as important as do we have the right manager.
 
I don't get a lot of the contempt for Gav on here. Yes we played like shite last night. Yes we've been terrible in a fair few games over the last few seasons. But think about where we are, and where we've come from. We got outclassed and outplayed by Maidstone last night who played as well as some football league clubs I've seen this season. A few years ago we'd be playing a much poorer opposition and we'd have won. It takes a few years to adapt to a higher division; some of the football we played in the first half of this season was fantastic and I think we're on the right track, despite the wheels coming off a bit recently. I wouldn't be upset if he left when his contract was up and we got someone else in, but I certainly wouldn't be happy about it either.

I've plottted our progression through the league's since he took over in 2009. If any other club had been on the same trajectory we had and stuck with the same manager throughout he'd be lauded.



Gavs history.png
(note 19/20 & 20/21 are positions before the season was cut short, 21/22 is current position)
 
I believe Gav's contract is up at the end of the season? I'd suggest - and stress suggest, I don't know - the Board are giving him until the end of the season and will review then.

Gav has over achieved against budget this year. The budget was slashed for two consecutive seasons due to Covid. (Ben has put that into the public domain. As a minor shareholder I know the %'s which I don't think are public. Suffice to say you'd be amazed and most managers would have walked.)

Budgets for next season will be signed off soon / been done recently. I'd expect a decision to be made about whether the current incumbent is the right man to spend the new budget to be made after budget setting, with discreet feelers going out of it is decided to change.

I'm confident the fact silence is - correctly - being maintained doesn't mean the club are not reviewing. Shareholders get a pretty detailed post season review of pretty much all aspects of the club. Ben is a details man, he drives this. It would be unlike him to miss something as important as do we have the right manager.
I get there’s certain sensitive information that needs to be kept within certain boundaries, but from the outside looking in, most other clubs find ways to communicate effectively without every supporter having to become a shareholder.

Which is not to say I don’t appreciate your insight as a shareholder, I really do - just doesn’t feel like it should be on you to fill that gap.
 
I don't get a lot of the contempt for Gav on here. Yes we played like shite last night. Yes we've been terrible in a fair few games over the last few seasons. But think about where we are, and where we've come from. We got outclassed and outplayed by Maidstone last night who played as well as some football league clubs I've seen this season. A few years ago we'd be playing a much poorer opposition and we'd have won. It takes a few years to adapt to a higher division; some of the football we played in the first half of this season was fantastic and I think we're on the right track, despite the wheels coming off a bit recently. I wouldn't be upset if he left when his contract was up and we got someone else in, but I certainly wouldn't be happy about it either.

I've plottted our progression through the league's since he took over in 2009. If any other club had been on the same trajectory we had and stuck with the same manager throughout he'd be lauded.



View attachment 314606
(note 19/20 & 20/21 are positions before the season was cut short, 21/22 is current position)
I guess it comes down to whether or not you think the deterioration in performances over the last few months is either the tip of an iceberg or an ice cube that’s going to melt and then everything will be okay.

I genuinely hope it’s the latter - just concerned it could be the former for the reasons in my overlong post.
 
We need a change. The football on the pitch feels stale, stagnant and directionless and has done for three seasons (Carlisle still rankles with me). This is feeding through to the general tone and feel of the club, which is dreadful because I know how much work people put into the club off pitch. And they deserve more, as do the fans. This club needs energy, focus and shared purpose if it's to come through the next few years successfully. The stadium build will be a difficult time. The current manager feels like nineties Brian Clough, living off past glories. Next season will be the same as this and the two that preceded it if he stays. Or worse.
 
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The Aspire thing is odd. Not sure it's a sustainable model for the club's "academy." This reply to a recent Peter Crouch tweet made me think.

 
I brought a friend to the game yesterday, his 2nd Dulwich game - the first being the Cup trip earlier on in the season away to AFC Croydon Athletic (so I'm surprised he came back) and I'm pretty sure he won't be returning. A few quotes from him which were pretty spot on but quite interesting to hear when it's someone that doesn't watch often:

'Dulwich are playing like they're fighting for relegation'
'There's yet to be 3 or more passes strung together'
'You look like you could play against u11s and not score'
'Now you've taken the big man off up top, you must be going to feet...'

It was embarrassing. The performance was embarrassing. The look on their faces was embarrassing. There is no way the majority of those players care. At the final whistle, they were faced with I'd say about 30 DHFC fans, some applauding, others not. Mills, Holland, Ming, Allassani & Kadi where the only ones to come and applaud. The home crowd we get is impressive, the idiots that we attract is not. Ironically, those numbers are nowhere to be seen on a midweek away game, but now loyal supporters are not bothering. Dulwich at home is not pleasant, both and off the pitch and I doubt I'll be returning to Champion Hill this season as I don't enjoy my time there at the moment - as by the looks of things neither do the players.

Not 1 shot on target yesterday is atrocious, we did not worry them at all and it was the exact definition of boys vs men.

On a side note, another racist comment yesterday aimed at Ming which thankfully he didn't hear. Was in the first half, he was appealing for a corner and got called a bald c*nt and then a malteser. I called him out and security acted on it quickly which was good to see. Was then told however, that this was not the first occasion that the individual had made a comment like this. Maidstone have been a decent bunch, however the odd one or two does tend to let them down.

I won't be there Saturday, good luck to anyone that is.
 
Some really good reading in this thread and food for thought.

I don't believe Rose will go and if he did choose to it would be after HIS Academy is bedded in at the new ground.

Time will tell.........
 
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