Game of thrones season 8 [contains spoilers]

[keybored]

It would be the worst deus ex machina in the history of entertainment if he comes back from that.

 

[Lord Camomile]

Do we know 100% that Rhaegal was killed?

I mean, he got an arrow to the heart, one through the neck and then fell into the ocean fully submerged. I take the point that we didn't see a lifeless body, but pretty sure he's a goner...

(If I'm thinking of the right dragon, I never understood how everyone tells them apart; I know one of them is/was bigger, but never worked out who that was)

 

[bemused]

Do we know 100% that Rhaegal was killed?

It looked pretty convincing, arrow in the neck and all. If he pulled through that would be great, all I really want to see is CGI dragons - the rest is a bit meh

 

[Crispy]

I mean, he got an arrow to the heart, one through the neck and then fell into the ocean fully submerged. I take the point that we didn't see a lifeless body, but pretty sure he's a goner...

(If I'm thinking of the right dragon, I never understood how everyone tells them apart; I know one of them is/was bigger, but never worked out who that was)

Drogon big black
Rhaegal medium reddish
Vyserion medium greenish

 

[Lord Camomile]

Drogon big black
Rhaegal medium reddish
Vyserion medium greenish

As referenced above, I'm not always paying the most attention, but they always sort of look generally the same colour to me

 

[quimcunx]

I'm still a bit in the dark about the whole Targeryen/Baratheon stuff and chronology.

Aerys was the mad king
He had three children - Rheaghar/Viserys/Danaerys. So Danaerys is a much much younger sister to Rheaghar.
Jaime killed the mad king
Rheaghar was the heir.
Robert Baratheon contested the throne. why?
Rheaghar married Lyanna Stark in secret (why?)
Robert Baratheon fancied Lyanna Stark. Was she promised to him?
Where did he think Lyanna was when she gave birth?
Lyanna stark gave birth and died in hiding
Rheaghar married Ellaria Martell
they had two children Clegane killed them, in whose name?
At what point did the Lannisters come into the picture?

 

[Cloo]

Some people have pointed out that it sucks a bit that Jon has, OK, got supporters by being Stark-connected, Northern and a bloke but hasn’t necessarily done that much himself and he’s being treated as a better bet for a ruler of the Seven Kingdoms than Dany, who has bought the Dothraki onside, brought back dragons, freed a nation-state of slaves and taken it over and freed a slave army. She’s kind of got a more impressive track record, but the series doesn’t seem to be treating this viewpoint critically – like boils down to two ‘crazy’ women vying for power who ought to give it to the sensible, more relatable man.

 

[Lord Camomile]

quimcunx
Robert Baratheon contested the throne. why? - Because he could? It was Robert's Rebellion, so I think it was a bit "alright, enough of you bastard-mad Targeryans". Although I think there may have been some other stuff.
Rheaghar married Lyanna Stark in secret (why?) - Luuuuuuuuurve. (Also, he was promised to... Elia Martel, I think, hence the "in secret" bit)
Robert Baratheon fancied Lyanna Stark. Was she promised to him? Don't think so; classic case of marriage of convenience (Cersei) v marriage of love (although I think Lyanna didn't feel the same; see above)

 

[Lord Camomile]

Some people have pointed out that it sucks a bit that Jon has, OK, got supporters by being Stark-connected, Northern and a bloke but hasn’t necessarily done that much himself and he’s being treated as a better bet for a ruler of the Seven Kingdoms than Dany, who has bought the Dothraki onside, brought back dragons, freed a nation-state of slaves and taken it over and freed a slave army. She’s kind of got a more impressive track record, but the series doesn’t seem to be treating this viewpoint critically – like boils down to two ‘crazy’ women vying for power who ought to give it to the sensible, more relatable man.

He united the wildlings and the North? Not saying that trumps what Dany did, but I think it maybe goes on his record.

Sansa also basically won (him) the Battle of the Bastards, too.

 

[Plumdaff]

I hope the final episode does that thing where they show a montage of character photos with brief descriptions of what happens to them in the future. For cheese value

With the music from Bake Off...

 

[donkyboy]

Some people have pointed out that it sucks a bit that Jon has, OK, got supporters by being Stark-connected, Northern and a bloke but hasn’t necessarily done that much himself and he’s being treated as a better bet for a ruler of the Seven Kingdoms than Dany, who has bought the Dothraki onside, brought back dragons, freed a nation-state of slaves and taken it over and freed a slave army. She’s kind of got a more impressive track record, but the series doesn’t seem to be treating this viewpoint critically – like boils down to two ‘crazy’ women vying for power who ought to give it to the sensible, more relatable man.

Danny has every right to be peeved off with all this. She lost practically most of her army saving the North.

However, to say Jon hasn't done much is silly considering he helped (in part) win the war of the bastards, won over the Wildlings and was instrumental in getting everyone to realise the danger posed by the white walkers.

 

[Buddy Bradley]

the hound will kill gregor
Jaime will kill cersi
sensa will kill dany
Arya will die at someone's hand while wearing littlefinger's face.
jon will refuse the throne.
sensa and tyrion will share the throne, the ultimate power couple.

I think at least some audience expectations will be completely wrong. Maybe the Mountain kills the Hound. I like the idea of Arya getting on the wrong end of a sword because she's wearing someone else's face though.

 

[quimcunx]

the mountain will kill the hound and arya will kill the mountain in revenge!

Can we just not have any more of them die please. Hang out in Winterfell having a nice time. Cersi and Dany can fight it out amongst themselves at KL.

 

[ferrelhadley]

I'm still a bit in the dark about the whole Targeryen/Baratheon stuff and chronology.

Aerys was the mad king
He had three children - Rheaghar/Viserys/Danaerys. So Danaerys is a much much younger sister to Rheaghar.
Rheaghar married Ellaria Martell
they had two children Clegane killed them, in whose name? They were named Aegon and Rhaenys
Clegane killed them on orders of Tywin (that is a bit later)
Robert Baratheon fancied Lyanna Stark. Was she promised to him?
To cement the North with the Baratheons, perhaps a plot was in the offing.
Rheaghar married Lyanna Stark in secret (why?)
A couple of years after the marriage, the maesters said Ellaria could not have any more children but Rhaegar was obsessed with a prophecy and thought he needed a third child, the marriage was secret to try to prevent the realm from breaking apart.
Robert Baratheon contested the throne. why?
Neds brother and father were killed and Aeyrs ordered Robert and Ned killed, they raised their houses plus that off the Vale who was their guardian. Ned was given Catlyn who had been promised to his now dead brother to cement the Riverlands with the alliance.
Jaime killed the mad king
He was about the burn the whole city after Tywin sacked it.
Rheaghar was the heir.
Where did he think Lyanna was when she gave birth?
Lyanna stark gave birth and died in hiding
Lyanna was in hiding to protect her child from the war. She gave birth and died after Rhaegar and his other children. Ned pretended the boy Aegon was his bastard Jon Snow.
At what point did the Lannisters come into the picture?
After Rhaegar was killed at the battle of the Trident Tywin marched his army to Kings Landing. Aerys thought he had finally answered his summons and let him in, at this point he allowed his troops to sack the city, during this Aerys tried to burn the city and Jaime killed him. Later Tywin ordered Clegane to murder the children.

 

[Crispy]

I'm still a bit in the dark about the whole Targeryen/Baratheon stuff and chronology.

Aerys was the mad king
He had three children - Rheaghar/Viserys/Danaerys. So Danaerys is a much much younger sister to Rheaghar.
Jaime killed the mad king
Rheaghar was the heir.
all correct so far, although jaime didn't kill the MK till the very end
Robert Baratheon contested the throne. why?
Because Rheaghar captured and raped Lyanna Stark (or so he thought). This was the intitating incident for the rebellion. There was then a bunch of back and forth murders/tortures between the king and the starks/baratheons before it kicked off in earnest.
Rheaghar married Lyanna Stark in secret (why?)
because he was already married to Ellaria Martell, but didn't love her
Robert Baratheon fancied Lyanna Stark. Was she promised to him?
Yes.
Where did he think Lyanna was when she gave birth?
He never knew about her child
Lyanna stark gave birth and died in hiding
Rheaghar married Ellaria Martell
this had already happened previously
they had two children Clegane killed them, in whose name?
Robert's. He had to make sure all of Aerys' heirs were dead. PS: Robert killed Rhaegar himself, in the deciding battle of the war.
At what point did the Lannisters come into the picture?
The Lannisters stayed out of the war until the very end. Their fresh army got the jump on everyone else in the final sack of KL. Robert's marriage to Cersei was the political price of this last-minute "alliance". Really, Tywin forced everyone's hand by being the first on the scene.

EDIT: ferrelhadley is probably more accurate here, although I think it's appropriate that you get slightly different accounts depending on who you ask. Nobody in-world has complete information.

 

[quimcunx]

Well those three answers clear everything up, thank you.

 

[ferrelhadley]

Because Rheaghar captured and raped Lyanna Stark (or so he thought). This was the intitating incident for the rebellion. There was then a bunch of back and forth murders/tortures between the king and the starks/baratheons before it kicked off in earnest.

Rheagar and Lyanna eloped, then Brandon went to Aeyrs to demand her return, he was imprisoned, his father Rickard went to beg for his son, he was burned alive to entertain Aerys while Brandon was chocked. Aerys then ordered the new head of house Stark, Eddard killed together with Robert, they were under the care of Jon Arryn.
It was at this point the rebellion was raised.
Aeyrs was murdering his way through the great houses.
Roberts sob story about it being for his love was a drunken old fool re-imagining a power play for survival as a romantic gesture.

 

[Crispy]

someone's read the books, rather than cobbled things together from re-watching the tv series and reading the occasional wiki page, I see

 

[souljacker]

Some people have pointed out that it sucks a bit that Jon has, OK, got supporters by being Stark-connected, Northern and a bloke but hasn’t necessarily done that much himself and he’s being treated as a better bet for a ruler of the Seven Kingdoms than Dany, who has bought the Dothraki onside, brought back dragons, freed a nation-state of slaves and taken it over and freed a slave army. She’s kind of got a more impressive track record, but the series doesn’t seem to be treating this viewpoint critically – like boils down to two ‘crazy’ women vying for power who ought to give it to the sensible, more relatable man.

I thought the main point of it was that he was a local lad. She gets the same reception up north as I would if I rocked up in some Sheffield boozer telling everyone to take a knee.

 

[ferrelhadley]

One of the reasons the marriage was secret as it would have turned Dorne against the crown who were already fizzing at Rhaegar having taken a lover. Aeyrs having completely pissed off Tywin by making Jaime a kings guard thus unable to inherit Casterly Rock and spurning Cersei for Rhaegar meant the Lannisters and West was not willing to throw their weight behind the king when it kicked off. This left the Reach as about the only kingdom to fully commit to the crown other than Dorne, so Rhaegar had to be very careful with them. But many houses (especially in the Stormlands) backed the crown over their lords.

 

[Virtual Blue]

the hound will kill gregor
Jaime will kill cersi
sensa will kill dany
Arya will die at someone's hand while wearing littlefinger's face.
jon will refuse the throne.
sensa and tyrion will share the throne, the ultimate power couple.

Jaime will definitely kill cersi
jon kills dany and refuse throne (what happens? will he be banished from the kingdom?)
arya will kill qyburn
hound and mountain will fight and kill each other

 

[Crispy]

One of the reasons the marriage was secret as it would have turned Dorne against the crown who were already fizzing at Rhaegar having taken a lover. Aeyrs having completely pissed off Tywin by making Jaime a kings guard thus unable to inherit Casterly Rock and spurning Cersei for Rhaegar meant the Lannisters and West was not willing to throw their weight behind the king when it kicked off. This left the Reach as about the only kingdom to fully commit to the crown other than Dorne, so Rhaegar had to be very careful with them. But many houses (especially in the Stormlands) backed the crown over their lords.

This sort of political intrigue is now completely missing from the TV show.

 

[ferrelhadley]

This sort of political intrigue is now completely missing from the TV show.

If Rhaegar and Aerys clusterfucking their way out of history were the plot of the final series of the TV show, Reddit would be imploding about how unbelievable the story had become and how the TV show did not understand GRRMs master work.

 

[ferrelhadley]

Just rereading the history and it occurs to me, no sooner is Gendry an official Baratheon then he gets iceboxed by a Stark girl. Like father like son.

 

[The Octagon]

Just rereading the history and it occurs to me, no sooner is Gendry an official Baratheon then he gets iceboxed by a Stark girl. Like father like son.

So close....

 

[Cid]

I think at least some audience expectations will be completely wrong. Maybe the Mountain kills the Hound. I like the idea of Arya getting on the wrong end of a sword because she's wearing someone else's face though.

See the problem is that that outcome is 'obvious' too. Hound kills mountain 'oh, just a fan service'. Mountain kills hound 'well that was predictable, obviously they couldn't just have hound kill mountain'. Mutual mortal wounds 'cop out'. Arya revenge 'meh, everything is Arya these days'. Etc etc.

Actually tbh I stopped watching circa season 4 and never managed to get back into it.

 

[fishfinger]

 

[kalidarkone]

See the problem is that that outcome is 'obvious' too. Hound kills mountain 'oh, just a fan service'. Mountain kills hound 'well that was predictable, obviously they couldn't just have hound kill mountain'. Mutual mortal wounds 'cop out'. Arya revenge 'meh, everything is Arya these days'. Etc etc.

Actually tbh I stopped watching circa season 4 and never managed to get back into it.

I did too- managed to drag it out till halfway through season 5....then meh bored. However started it again a few weeks ago and have really enjoyed it! Even the cheesy (never ending story) dragon flying bits!

 

[kalidarkone]

Love this!

 

[CNT36]

sort of feels like we have seen the final boss fight. After the grand battle between good and evil the latter part was always going to feel like mpping up. Especially if they start giving out titles etc.

I hope the final episode does that thing where they show a montage of character photos with brief descriptions of what happens to them in the future. For cheese value

John Snow never returned home.