G20: Getting to the truth- the death of Ian Tomlinson RIP

[Garek]

BBC website is going with how frightened he was....*rolls eyes* at state apparatus.

The BBC are a disgrace. Either I am getting older and wiser or they are getting worse. But either way the shit they seem to come out with is appalling.


More from the inquest,

Asked whether Tomlinson posed a threat, Harwood replied: "Not to me, no."

Asked whether he posed a threat to anyone else, Harwood replied: "No, I don't believe he did, no."

 

[DaveCinzano]

I suspect Mr Ryder will shred Harwood on his go.

 

[ymu]

So, is this inquest going to be allowed to bring a verdict of unlawful killing? And if it does, where would that leave the CPS in terms of prosecuting Harwood for manslaughter due to violent thuggery?

 

[Paulie Tandoori]

So, is this inquest going to be allowed to bring a verdict of unlawful killing? And if it does, where would that leave the CPS in terms of prosecuting Harwood for manslaughter due to violent thuggery?

i'm certain that i heard someone say recently that further charages weren't ruled out but i can't remember who or where this was...

 

[Barking_Mad]

So, is this inquest going to be allowed to bring a verdict of unlawful killing? And if it does, where would that leave the CPS in terms of prosecuting Harwood for manslaughter due to violent thuggery?

I believe it could bring about a change to not prosecute him (not sure on what charge)

 

[butchersapron]

The coroner has:

• Told the jury to ignore the fact that the director of public prosecutions (DPP) chose not to bring criminal proceedings against the officer. "That was not a final decision, but a provisional decision," he said. "He may review that decision after the inquest."

 

[ymu]

Cheers all.

 

[Barking_Mad]

Harwood could see the guy posed no threat and he has now admitted as much. Moving him on could have been done in a number of ways, but there was simply no need to push him with so much force from behind whilst he was slowly walking in the opposite direction.

If Tomlinson was really 'in the way' then pushing him in the back and then leaving him sprawled on the floor several yards further on is completely at odds with Harwood's supposed intentions.

All this time on and im still amazed that nobody in a uniform showed the slightest bit of concern or even went to help him to his feet. It says much about their view of the general public on that day, along with this kind of language,

Harwood said the order to "clear the lines" would normally mean to move into and clear an indicated street "so that it is sterile of any protesters".

The suggestion being by Harwood (who is probably repeating the words of superior officers) that the streets somehow needed cleansing of human beings - sterilising, if you will. The thing is words shape thoughts and thoughts can directly lead to specific actions.

 

[Barking_Mad]

Guardian too going with

Ian Tomlinson inquest hears police officer 'feared for his life'

as a headline. And not as i would suggest

"Police officer says 'Tomlinson posed no threat to anyone'"

It's either poor journalism or a purposeful attempt to mislead.

 

[Barking_Mad]

Eh?

Ryder begins by telling Harwood he now has a "real opportunity" to help the Tomlinson family.

He said everyone had seen the video, and that Tomlinson had his back to the officer. "I don't agree," Harwood interjected.

 

[DaveCinzano]

Going the mentally ill/physically incapacitated route - waiting for him to blame it all on heat stroke from tucking his jacket in and wearing a balaclava.

 

[Barking_Mad]

...

Ryder has pressed Harwood to admit that the force used was "unreasonable, unnecessary and excessive".

Harwood disagreed with this suggestion, but added:

If it is the case that I have been in any way a cause of Mr Tomlinson's death I am sorry.

 

[Barking_Mad]

...

Harwood has told Ryder he believes that if an officer "believes force is reasonable, it is reasonable".

Ryder stated:

The only person who determines reasonableness is you? Is that your understanding of reasonable? You are under oath, PC Harwood, and you have been a police officer [for many years] – are you really telling us that if you think that if an action is reasonable, then it is reasonable?

 

[ymu]

Can. Worms. Everywhere.

 

[Garek]

Now this I did not know,

Harwood accepts that he asked for a considerable amount of material about Tomlinson before answering more questions, including details about his "lifestyle", previous movements at the protests and any possible previous offending.

Ryder asked: "Were you trying to dig for material to discredit Mr Tomlinson, PC Harwood?" Harwood denied this.

 

[DrRingDing]

Fucking scum.

 

[editor]

Harwood is fucked.

 

[Barking_Mad]

Now this I did not know,

Harwood accepts that he asked for a considerable amount of material about Tomlinson before answering more questions, including details about his "lifestyle", previous movements at the protests and any possible previous offending.

Ryder asked: "Were you trying to dig for material to discredit Mr Tomlinson, PC Harwood?" Harwood denied this.

As a serving officer can he legally do that?

 

[ymu]

The graffiti written on the van by the unidentified protester said: "All cops are bastards".

 

[editor]

We owe a lot to that American investment fund manager who grabbed the damning video evidence. Without that, Harwood would have got away with it.

 

[butchersapron]

I'm expecting something to come out about his previous retirement - for all of three days. There has to be something behind that. Something dodgy.

 

[shaman75]

I'm expecting something to come out about his previous retirement - for all of three days. There has to be something behind that. Something dodgy.

yeah. wtf???

retirement with the flu was it?

 

[Barking_Mad]

It's a parallel world....From Guardian court reporter...

Harwood accepted that he had "pushed" Tomlinson, but denied that he "pushed him to the floor".

Well who did then?

 

[Barking_Mad]

We owe a lot to that American investment fund manager who grabbed the damning video evidence. Without that, Harwood would have got away with it.

Ironic huh?

 

[DotCommunist]

presumably he's divorcing the action of tomlinson going down and his own push. Which is mental.

 

[Garek]

From wikipedia

Harwood faced two misconduct hearings in the late 1990s and in 2004. The first arose out of a road-rage incident while he was on sick leave with a shoulder injury, during which he reportedly tried to arrest the other driver, who complained that Harwood had used unnecessary force. Before the case was heard, Harwood retired from the Met on medical grounds and was awarded a pension. Several years later, he rejoined the Met as a civilian computer worker, then applied to join the Surrey Police as an officer. Surrey Police say he was vetted and was frank about his history. During this time in Surrey, there was a complaint about his behaviour while on duty; it was investigated and found to be unsubstantiated. After working for Surrey Police for 18 months, Harwood applied for a transfer back to the Met, and was accepted in November 2004. It is not clear how thoroughly the Met vetted him.[30]

So, he tries to arrest someone during a 'road rage incident', despite at the time being off sick, and is what seems to be quietly pensioned. Then he comes back in by the back door. Or something

 

[Barking_Mad]

presumably he's divorcing the action of tomlinson going down and his own push. Which is mental.

full exchange...

Ryder: You said you are here just to help. You also said you were here to give some sort of answers to help the Tomlinson family … When you said that, did you mean that you were going to give truthful answers?"

Harwood: Yes, sir.

Ryder: I am going to give you the opportunity now to really help us, if you would. We have all seen the video. We have all seen that, at the time you pushed Mr Tomlinson, he had his back to you. Do you agree with that?

Harwood: No, I don't agree with that.

Ryder: We have all see the video, how you push him and follow through, and we have heard from everyone else who was there as to how they perceived it. You have told us that you didn't perceive Mr Tomlinson to be a threat … If you want to help, would you like simply to admit that what you did to Mr Tomlinson was unreasonable, unnecessary and excessive?

Harwood: No.

 

[Barking_Mad]

Some of this is painful to read as he's floundering so badly.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Not looking good for there ...

 

[ViolentPanda]

I think the key thing to remember reading all this is the fact that Tomlinson had his back to them. How can someone seem defiant if they are shuffling along, head down, hands in pockets, back facing? I mean that's just ridiculous.

The set of his shoulders? The aggressive slouching posture that showed he was ready to spring into action against the pigs at any moment? Perhaps he was wearing the wrong sort of shirt?

Fuck knows what goes through the minds of these state-employed thug-cunts.