Entirely unashamed anti car propaganda, and the more the better.

[mojo pixy]

I note that everyone arguing for banning cars on here lives in London or some other big city.

When people who currently live and work in small towns and villages across the country and own cars are campaigning for their abolition, I will take notice.

I live in a town of ~25000 people in a rural county. I have a child but I don't have a car, he rides with me and we take the train with the bikes when necessary. I cycle to work in a village just outside town, which takes about 20 mins there and 15 back (back is mainly downhill). I'm one of two who cycle to work, one other is starting to talk about doing it. The rest drive a similar distance but a few of them have started to complain about the cost of fuel, so there may be more joining us soon.

Downsides, yes - he goes to cubs and some of their activities are impossible to get to without a car, because the leaders work on the assumption everyone has a car. It's an uphill battle all the way.

Upsides, many. We're both pretty fit and healthy, he's learning independence and resilience, and when he's old enough I'll encourage him to get a driving licence because it's a good thing to have and driving is a useful skill for life

What's my point? Just that your assumption is wrong. I'd be glad to see 90% of cars gone tomorrow, my son feels about the same. I'm making my own tiny contribution to that aim by modelling a way of living, yes even outside a city, that doesn't rely on having a car, and doing my best to pass it on.

/2p

 

[platinumsage]

It's no surprise that people without a car are happy to see them banned. What I suggested however is that I'd like to hear from people who currently own a car outside a city and would like them banned. Where are the campaigners saying "I currently drive 28 minutes to work, and later drive 17 minutes to pick up my child and take them to after-school juggling lessons at the village hall, then drive 19 minutes home. However I'd much rather get rid of my car, tell the child to just do extra-curricular soccer at school, and get the 60 minute shuttle bus to work"?

 

[maomao]

I didn’t say “genuinely rural”. In fact I’ll define it as anyone living outside the top twenty UK cities by population, which is something like 60 million people.

A large number of those people will live in those places simply because for the last few decades we've encouraged people (with state subsidy) to think it's okay to commute hundreds of miles a week. The genuinely rural poor are likely to favour improved public transport.

 

[stethoscope]

It's no surprise that people without a car are happy to see them banned. What I suggested however is that I'd like to hear from people who currently own a car outside a city and would like them banned. Where are the campaigners saying "I currently drive 28 minutes to work, and later drive 17 minutes to pick up my child and take them to after-school juggling lessons at the village hall, then drive 19 minutes home. However I'd much rather get rid of my car, tell the child to just do extra-curricular soccer at school, and get the 60 minute shuttle bus to work"?

My dad would say the same thing, as a driver and whom had to ferry me around, work on a industrial estate for years. FFS.

 

[teuchter]

It's no surprise that people without a car are happy to see them banned. What I suggested however is that I'd like to hear from people who currently own a car outside a city and would like them banned. Where are the campaigners saying "I currently drive 28 minutes to work, and later drive 17 minutes to pick up my child and take them to after-school juggling lessons at the village hall, then drive 19 minutes home. However I'd much rather get rid of my car, tell the child to just do extra-curricular soccer at school, and get the 60 minute shuttle bus to work"?

See how many times you can get the word "banned" into each post.

 

[platinumsage]

My dad would say the same thing, as a driver and whom had to ferry me around, work on a industrial estate for years. FFS.

Well I haven't heard any sort of groundswell among car drivers for car abolition, especially when the realities of doubling commute time or reducing employment opportunities are considered.

 

[maomao]

It's no surprise that people without a car are happy to see them banned. What I suggested however is that I'd like to hear from people who currently own a car outside a city and would like them banned.

So you want to hear from people who benefit from the current system and whose lifestyles the rest of us subsidise, and you're going to ignore contributions from two posters who meet your previously described criteria. Right.

 

[mojo pixy]

It's no surprise that people without a car are happy to see them banned. What I suggested however is that I'd like to hear from people who currently own a car outside a city and would like them banned.

I used to have one ffs and I felt the same then, that's why I ultimately got rid. Be the change you want to see, or some shit.

Nvm .. no true driver.....

 

[edcraw]

It's no surprise that people without a car are happy to see them banned. What I suggested however is that I'd like to hear from people who currently own a car outside a city and would like them banned. Where are the campaigners saying "I currently drive 28 minutes to work, and later drive 17 minutes to pick up my child and take them to after-school juggling lessons at the village hall, then drive 19 minutes home. However I'd much rather get rid of my car, tell the child to just do extra-curricular soccer at school, and get the 60 minute shuttle bus to work"?

God you’re an arse. Two great posts from people that don’t usually post here and just a shitty response telling them you don’t care about their views.

 

[platinumsage]

So you want to hear from people who benefit from the current system and whose lifestyles the rest of us subsidise and you're going to ignore contributions from two posters who meet your previously described criteria. Right.

I said I'd like to hear from car owners, which those two people aren't.

Yes, the vast majority of families outside of big cities own cars. If you want the lifestyles of a small minority of extra-city carless people to become the norm, you're going to have to work on your convincing skills by offering the car people a big fat carrot of an alternative to their current situation.

 

[mojo pixy]

God you’re an arse. Two great posts from people that don’t usually post here and just a shitty response telling them you don’t care about their views.

We've already established that platinumsage doesn't post here in good faith, so it's only to be expected

 

[mojo pixy]

I said I'd like to hear from car owners, which those two people aren't.

Mate I've been a car owner for years. I've stopped being, because I came to the conclusion that cars suck .. traffic jams, pollution, pavement parking, injury and death .. but now re. you, my reasons for that change are irrelevant because I don't have a car now. lol you're a joke.

 

[maomao]

I said I'd like to hear from car owners, which those two people aren't.

Yes, the vast majority of families outside of big cities own cars. If you want the lifestyles of a small minority of extra-city carless people to become the norm, you're going to have to work on your convincing skills by offering the car people a big fat carrot of an alternative to their current situation.

Rural dwellers commuting long distances are a minority but a disproportionately powerful and polluting one. Fuck 'em. Make employers responsible for the emissions their workforce produce and reduce the feasability of living thirty miles out of town and commuting by car every day.

 

[platinumsage]

It's clear this thread is about posters expecting that everyone else should adopt their own world-view. The "I don't see the need to take drugs so they should be banned" position. Give yourselves a pat on the back.

 

[maomao]

It's clear this thread is about posters expecting that everyone else should adopt their own world-view. The "I don't see the need to take drugs so they should be banned" position. Give yourselves a pat on the back.

Are you trying to excuse your blood-stained coke habit now?

 

[mojo pixy]

It's clear this thread is about posters expecting that everyone else should adopt their own world-view. The "I don't see the need to take drugs so they should be banned" position. Give yourselves a pat on the back.

And there it is, even if you're right you're wrong because wah!

Fucking goof.

 

[platinumsage]

Are you trying to excuse your blood-stained coke habit now?

I tried it once when I was a teenager. Shit drug.

 

[platinumsage]

And there it is, even if you're right you're wrong because wah!

No one has even answered my basic questions, let alone be "right". How do you convince 30 million car owners to adopt your lifestyle any time soon, in any reasonable way whatsoever? And the answer isn't just "more buses".

 

[mojo pixy]

No one has even answered my basic questions, let alone be "right". How do you convince 30 million car owners to adopt your lifestyle any time soon, in any reasonable way whatsoever? And the answer isn't just "more buses".

As if you care lol

 

[platinumsage]

As if you care lol

Regardless what people think of me, I would have thought that the other posters on this thread would have answered this question amongst themselves in 317 pages...

 

[mojo pixy]

Regardless what people think of me, I would have thought that the other posters on this thread would have answered this question amongst themselves in 317 pages...

There are loads of answers, try reading this thread you've shat all over ffs.

And again, it's not as if you actually care so why are you bothering? You just like the attention, at a guess.

 

[maomao]

No one has even answered my basic questions, let alone be "right". How do you convince 30 million car owners to adopt your lifestyle any time soon, in any reasonable way whatsoever? And the answer isn't just "more buses".

People have answered this lots of times, you just didn't like the answers because you see everything through an individualist consumer lense.

 

[edcraw]

There are loads of answers, try reading this thread you've shat all over ffs.

And again, it's not as if you actually care so why are you bothering? You just like the attention, at a guess.

Indeed, never actually pays attention to anyone’s posts but as shown he’s very very selective of who’s posts actually count

 

[platinumsage]

There are loads of answers, try reading this thread you've shat all over ffs.

And again, it's not as if you actually care so why are you bothering? You just like the attention, at a guess.

Why do you think I don't care about how transport, housing and employment is configured in this country?

 

[platinumsage]

People have answered this lots of times, you just didn't like the answers because you see everything through an individualist consumer lense.

I haven't seen any answer that would actually work, and if by individualist consumer lens you mean a democracy then sure.

 

[mojo pixy]

Why do you think I don't care about how transport, housing and employment is configured in this country?

Because it shines through every critical, negative, disingenous, status-quo justifying post you make. You like things just as they are and you mock anyone who says anything that risks infringing that. It's the worst kind of contribution, no substance, no originality of thought, no attempts to reconsider, no flexibility or humility. Just repeated lumpen nah that idea's stoopid.

Thats why.

 

[maomao]

I haven't seen any answer that would actually work, and if by individualist consumer lens you mean a democracy then sure.

China and Russia are pretty keen on consumerism and private car ownership these days so I'm not sure the two are connected in the way you think they are.

Fuel prices are spiralling, import chains are breaking down and the earth is hurtling past dangerous tipping points at a dizzying rate. It should be you explaining how this clearly unsustainable lifestyle can possibly be maintained.

 

[teuchter]

I haven't seen any answer that would actually work

That answers the question "please explain how you will implement this thing that you have never proposed".

 

[platinumsage]

Because it shines through every critical, negative, disingenous, status-quo justifying post you make. You like things just as they are and you mock anyone who says anything that risks infringing that. It's the worst kind of contribution, no substance, no originality of thought, no attempts to reconsider, no flexibility or humility. Just repeated lumpen nah that idea's stoopid.

If this was a thread about improving public transport, I'd be proposing and agreeing with lots of new ideas. But it's not, it's about banning private cars, and any discussion about merely improving public transport to some sort level that doesn't allow for car-elimination is a distraction. I'm trying to tease out the kind of changes that would be needed to get majority public-opinion in favour of car-elimination, but I'm not sure anyone appreciates the extent of re-ordering of our society that would be necessary for such a change, let alone what would be needed to get the population on board.

But yes, criticise me about ignoring suggestions of a few more buses or painting a few cycle lanes if you want, but those don't really address the fundamental question of this thread.

 

[mojo pixy]

If this was a thread about improving public transport, I'd be proposing and agreeing with lots of new ideas. But it's not, it's about banning private cars, and any discussion about merely improving public transport to some sort level that doesn't allow for car-elimination is a distraction. I'm trying to tease out the kind of changes that would be needed to get majority public-opinion in favour of car-elimination, but I'm not sure anyone appreciates the extent of re-ordering of our society that would be necessary for such a change, let alone what would be needed to get the population on board.

But yes, criticise me about ignoring suggestions of a few more buses or painting a few cycle lanes if you want, but those don't really address the fundamental question of this thread.

Reordering society has been happening for the last 100 years you muppet, since the motor car first became a regular sight on the roads. But somehow it's simply impossible to go back on that because people wouldn't like it?

That's just lazy thinking, and totally at odds with reality. Obviously it could take 100 years to get there, just as it's taken 100 to get here, but eventually we will if for no other reason than necessity. The costs of energy and of resources will drive slowly growing public pressure and generational cultural change .. exactly what brought us here.

Mainly, teaching and showing the kids a new way to go about things, and of course letting them create their own, cleaner and more sociable world. One day, private vehicles like cars will be an anachronism, the preserve of old, entitled loons waiting behind streams of buses and bikes fuming about their right to drive being stolen as the kids laugh "OK millenial"...

But do carry on. tbh I kind of miss Spymaster, at least he had a sense of humour

No, I don't mean that. I'm just being a dick. As y'were