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treelover said:
that some anti's did and made a point of mentioning their condition speaks volumes about them, their prejudices and their priorities
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pathetic and shows they have no understanding of the far right and probably not much experience of the effects of racism.
 
SpineyNorman said:
That's been posted on the EDL news facebook. Most of the people commenting seem far more concerned about the state and colour of his teeth than the tattoo. And apparently it's 'self-righteous' to point out that it's really not his teeth people ought to have a problem with. But it's OK cos the comments on that page aren't as bad as the ones on the EDL page - so it seems antifascists judge themselves according to the standards the far right set themselves :rolleyes:
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Now it's 'self-righteous' to point out that droning on about how polish immigrants are all hard working paragons of virtue and wouldn't be 'taking the jobs' if Brits weren't so lazy is a bit, well, racist and might push people into the hands of the far right.

These people are as much my enemy as the EDL are.
 
It's actually refreshing to see SpineyNorman come up against the same sort of ignorant and proud of it stupidity on the EDL News group as I have in the past. A decent number of the people there seem to think that members of the EDL are biologically determined to be an invariably evil racist Other. It helps to explain their benign view of Islamist extremists too, many of which they obviously see as noble savage caricatures.
 
Well, it's descended into a series of not very amusing or inventive insults thrown in my direction now. One of them claiming I was running away 'with my tail between my legs', followed by another saying 'on crutches' (after I'd said I had to give up my job after a serious injury - they don't know it wasn't my legs). Then another asking me if I was going to shout at buses. When I pointed out that 'jokes' about mental illness weren't funny they called me a hypocrite because I'd called one of them a fuckwit:

He hurls insults like 'fuckwit' and 'small-minded' and 'ignoramus child' and then tries to mount his high horse when someone intimates that he may be a low-functioning human. Hypocritical arsehole.
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Low functioning human? I've only heard that from eugenicists before.
 
SpineyNorman said:
Well, it's descended into a series of not very amusing or inventive insults thrown in my direction now. One of them claiming I was running away 'with my tail between my legs', followed by another saying 'on crutches' (after I'd said I had to give up my job after a serious injury - they don't know it wasn't my legs). Then another asking me if I was going to shout at buses. When I pointed out that 'jokes' about mental illness weren't funny they called me a hypocrite because I'd called one of them a fuckwit:




Low functioning human? I've only heard that from eugenicists before.
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That's certainly not what I'd expect from an "anti-fascist".
 
SpineyNorman said:
Is it wrong that I'd happily join a united front with the EDL against these cunts? (And I'm only half joking)
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This is exactly the point, the seething class hatred shown by these idiotic lets laugh at the EDL sites is disguisting.
Anti-Fascism as a position, not as a literal translation of the term, is not about thinking rascism is icky, or that fascists are all slack jawed idiots who need to laughed at, its not sentimental anti rasism, its not liberalism.... it is or at least should be about smashing an idology that cannot co-exist with our ideology, be that communism, anarchism, socialism etc.
Its not about fighting these cunts just for the sake of it, or because they make you "embarresed to be british" or whatever else these wankers think.

edit: the lp thread dont really have anything to do with this
 
DotCommunist said:
its quite obviously class hatred expressed under the socially acceptable veneer of being anti EDL
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With this in mind, it's all the more worrying when you hear working class people object to the EDL in purely these terms, as idiots, chavs, embarassments "make me ashamed to be british" etc rather for than the genocidal hatred of muslims and racism the EDL stands for. I think that's quite a dangerous position because what happens one day when they don't behave like animals at their demo's, and conduct themselves in a half respectable way?

And I'd turn that on it's head a bit and suggest what if class hatred is the only socially acceptable type of criticism of the EDL? That applies to working class people too, just as there's a great many working and lower middle class people who have reactionary attitudes on welfare or single mothers, even though they might (or used to) claim housing benefit, might rely on sure start centres and so on. The only socially acceptable attitude even for low income working people is to scapegoat scroungers, or immigrants, or some Other, just as the only socially acceptable way to attack the EDL is for being violent chavs and hooligans? I dunno maybe I have that all wrong it's just a thought.

The difference is that we have the Tory PR machine, well monied and class conscious, with the Daily Mail and co perpetuating the reactionary attitudes to welfare and making that sort of class hatred the acceptable discourse, but here we have so-called antifascists also using the same anti-wc attacks on their shitty facebook meme page and feeding this shit. It's a sign of how apolitical some anti-fascist young 'uns are that they're oblivious to this - unless they're deliberately milking this sort of thing because they're just pure dickheads.

I'm not one for giving much of a fuck about hurting the feelings of fascists and their ilk, and working class people have every right to take the piss out of them for the way they behave, I'm all for that, but the kind of dirty class hatred is Tory anti-fascism, it's not helpful at all. I'm an anti-fascist not an anti-racist Tory or Liberal, that means understanding how capitalism generates and feeds things like fascism and reactionary nationalism at times of big crisis, and how anti-working class bigotry that's just an implicit part of everyday life structurally alienates a good chunk of the working population and this is where fascists can make headway. Sorry for having a little ayatollah trot moment but it needs to be said.
 
Delroy Booth said:
With this in mind, it's all the more worrying when you hear working class people object to the EDL in purely these terms, as idiots, chavs, embarassments "make me ashamed to be british" etc rather for than the genocidal hatred of muslims and racism the EDL stands for. I think that's quite a dangerous position because what happens one day when they don't behave like animals at their demo's, and conduct themselves in a half respectable way?

And I'd turn that on it's head a bit and suggest what if class hatred is the only socially acceptable type of criticism of the EDL? That applies to working class people too, just as there's a great many working and lower middle class people who have reactionary attitudes on welfare or single mothers, even though they might (or used to) claim housing benefit, might rely on sure start centres and so on. The only socially acceptable attitude even for low income working people is to scapegoat scroungers, or immigrants, or some Other, just as the only socially acceptable way to attack the EDL is for being violent chavs and hooligans? I dunno maybe I have that all wrong it's just a thought.

The difference is that we have the Tory PR machine, well monied and class conscious, with the Daily Mail and co perpetuating the reactionary attitudes to welfare and making that sort of class hatred the acceptable discourse, but here we have so-called antifascists also using the same anti-wc attacks on their shitty facebook meme page and feeding this shit. It's a sign of how apolitical some anti-fascist young 'uns are that they're oblivious to this - unless they're deliberately milking this sort of thing because they're just pure dickheads.

I'm not one for giving much of a fuck about hurting the feelings of fascists and their ilk, and working class people have every right to take the piss out of them for the way they behave, I'm all for that, but the kind of dirty class hatred is Tory anti-fascism, it's not helpful at all. I'm an anti-fascist not an anti-racist Tory or Liberal, that means understanding how capitalism generates and feeds things like fascism and reactionary nationalism at times of big crisis, and how anti-working class bigotry that's just an implicit part of everyday life structurally alienates a good chunk of the working population and this is where fascists can make headway. Sorry for having a little ayatollah trot moment but it needs to be said.
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I do think UAF have to take (of course they wont) some responsibilty for the de-politicising of Anti-fascism, turning it into a moral position rather than a politcal one, but its obviously deeper than that, its just a further example of a weak and irrelevant left.

jaysus my spelling is fuckin terrible.
 
It's actually impossible to have anything resembling a serious conversation with these pricks.

I'm starting a group called 'anti-EDLnews Action' - applying militant antifascist techniques to the fight against middle class elitists. Who's with me?
 
not defending anyone now right and i have picked up a few people on the sneering attitudes
but...
for example, what is wrong with laughing at the dickhead in the toilet video?
 
ddraig said:
not defending anyone now right and i have picked up a few people on the sneering attitudes
but...
for example, what is wrong with laughing at the dickhead in the toilet video?
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Nothing.

But there is something wrong with droning on about how if unemployed brits would only take a leaf out of the hard working Poles' book and stop being so lazy and feckless they wouldn't be poor.
 
Apparently national stereotypes aren't racist because race and nation aren't the same thing. Not sure what that makes the EDL, since race and faith sure as shit aren't the same thing but there you go.

I'm not looking at that thing any more, makes me too depressed and angry.
 
e2a to SN
well yeah, that is obviously shite
i thought the gripe was more with people calling them thick
 
Point this out and you're a 'sanctimonious concern troll'. And if you respond in kind after trying for hours not to be provoked by a tirade of personal insults you get told 'what do you expect when you insult us'.

And of course since the rest of them are all middle class elitists with barely conceiled class (and racial) prejudices they get to say 'everyone thinks the problem is you so it must be'.

They're now on the list. Every one of them.
 
SpineyNorman said:
Point this out and you're a 'sanctimonious concern troll'. And if you respond in kind after trying for hours not to be provoked by a tirade of personal insults you get told 'what do you expect when you insult us'.

And of course since the rest of them are all middle class elitists with barely conceiled class (and racial) prejudices they get to say 'everyone thinks the problem is you so it must be'.

They're now on the list. Every one of them.
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Why would you bother trying to argue? seems a bit masochistic. For 99% of the posters this is the extent of their "anti-fascism",
 
Best quote from the 'anti-fascists' thus far, "If I feel like setting a Chav on fire I will. Nobodies going to tell me shit."
 
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