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There's no way of knowing who did it until the police catch somebody in the act. The piece linked above is a bit odd... the tip of comes from an unnamed local resident, whose quotes sound like they were lifted from a press release.
 
aye, i know people too and im not saying it never happens at all :) but im just a bit sceptical about the veracity of some of them!
 
revlon said:
spiked = Antifascistophobes!

EDL: a wet dream for purposeless lefties
http://www.spiked-online.com/index.php/site/article/10208/
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A similar tone to that ghastly O Neill piece in the torygraph, written by someone who is either a deliberate apologist or who has done very little research. I might have said it before on this thread, one thing worse than middle class lefties is the middle class reactionaries that slag them off.
 
taffboy gwyrdd said:
A similar tone to that ghastly O Neill piece in the torygraph, written by someone who is either a deliberate apologist or who has done very little research. I might have said it before on this thread, one thing worse than middle class lefties is the middle class reactionaries that slag them off.
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you don't recognise yourself in the last paragraph then?
 
Thing is, that article lands a good number of justified punches on the liberal left and the further left and their relation to the edl (whilst clumsily missing the opp to point out the commonalities in their ugh a baseball cap approach) but reverts to the same sort of thing by assuming a) this is what w/c politics should look like therefore the edl represent w/c politics and by extension the w/c - and b) it does that by looking at formal declarations of the 'leadership'.
 
revlon said:
you don't recognise yourself in the last paragraph then?
Click to expand...

Really doesn't matter. I'm certainly not going to apologise for my politics or my class. Although some would cite me as middle class for my background I happen not to own the means of production in any regard.
And IME the most common type of person to sneer at the middle class left is the middle class right, implying not just self hatred on a class basis but also a nauseating presumption that the middle class really ought to be conservative or reactionary, which is plainly bollocks.
 
butchersapron said:
Thing is, that article lands a good number of justified punches on the liberal left and the further left and their relation to the edl (whilst clumsily missing the opp to point out the commonalities in their ugh a baseball cap approach) but reverts to the same sort of thing by assuming a) this is what w/c politics should look like therefore the edl represent w/c politics and by extension the w/c - and b) it does that by looking at formal declarations of the 'leadership'.
Click to expand...

The punches on the liberal left and further left are pretty standard fare. relying on the "leadership" declarations is plain lazy. The prime functions of this piece and O Neills efforts are a) preening. b) filling space.
 
It's a good last line (it necessarily means taking down spiked and their m/c networks too btw)

The greatest threat to these liberties comes not from radical Islam, but the odious triad of smug observers, censorious left-wing groups and interfering politicians, who in equal measure both despise the EDL and are dearly thankful for its existence as it gives them a sense of purpose. Challenging these elitist views is something that would be worth taking to the streets for.
Click to expand...
 
taffboy gwyrdd said:
The punches on the liberal left and further left are pretty standard fare. relying on the "leadership" declarations is plain lazy. The prime functions of this piece and O Neills efforts are a) preening. b) filling space.
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They may be standard fare (they're not though). What does that change? Are they wrong? Right? What?
 
butchersapron said:
They may be standard fare (they're not though). What does that change? Are they wrong? Right? What?
Click to expand...

What does it change? Nothing. Reactionary bloke writes self regarding reactionary piece. Some middle class left wingers are smug. I dont think that will be making the front pages, people of all classes and opinions can be smug. What does it change? Nothing. The idea that the "left" are somehow pleased that the EDL exist because it gives us some kind of raison d'etre is far fetched and made up. There are plenty of other raison d'etre. I can see how UAF/SWP might use it as a recruitment tool though, but again if it wasn't this issue it would be something else. The piece as a whole is no better written than many a post on here but quite a lot less qualified. The writer accuses people of being smug but ought to have the decency to recognise that there is a moat in his eye.
 
sp!ked/ex-RCP et al are fucking appalling. landing some justified punches on the liberals and cultural elements of the rest of the 'left' doesn't justify their total absence of material analysis. the fact he relies upon leadership quotes is more than just a coincidence. for the sp!ked lot everything revolves around abstract debates, 'ideas'. there's no pragmatic experience of the actual existing realities. hence why they end up taking their 'year zero' analysis of the left. when 'liberal enlightenment' values are under threat the best thing to do is to rush back and start spouting John Stuart Mill, apparently, completely forgetting about any theoretical developments of the late 19th/early 20th centuries. totally in their own little dreamworld of abstraction.

at the very best, a very limited amount to learn there.
 
Das Uberdog said:
sp!ked/ex-RCP et al are fucking appalling. landing some justified punches on the liberals and cultural elements of the rest of the 'left' doesn't justify their total absence of material analysis. the fact he relies upon leadership quotes is more than just a coincidence. for the sp!ked lot everything revolves around abstract debates, 'ideas'. there's no pragmatic experience of the actual existing realities. hence why they end up taking their 'year zero' analysis of the left. when 'liberal enlightenment' values are under threat the best thing to do is to rush back and start spouting John Stuart Mill, apparently, completely forgetting about any theoretical developments of the late 19th/early 20th centuries. totally in their own little dreamworld of abstraction.

at the very best, a very limited amount to learn there.
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can you give us some of the material analysis you say is missing? So far people here have relied on random Faebook postings, youtube clips and yes quotes from leader tommy robinson to reinfrce the edl's badness credentials.

Regardless of the authors background and political niche what has he got wrong in the answering the questions he poses
- why is this happening now?
- why is the EDL making such a big splash?
(rembering the sentence immediately following that question is: The EDL is being blown out of all proportion).
 
revlon said:
can you give us some of the material analysis you say is missing? So far people here have relied on random Faebook postings, youtube clips and yes quotes from leader tommy robinson to reinfrce the edl's badness credentials.

Regardless of the authors background and political niche what has he got wrong in the answering the questions he poses
- why is this happening now?
- why is the EDL making such a big splash?
(rembering the sentence immediately following that question is: The EDL is being blown out of all proportion).
Click to expand...

The author is right about the danger of blowing it out of proportion. The piece is not as bad as O Neills turgid torygraph crap. But overall it is still fairly lazy and cliched. The EDL are not making that big a splash. They provide a lightening rod for racists and dupes while the BNP really are not doing well at all. But they can't get beyond a certain point, not least because they lack substantial analysis, can't control the nazis and are woeful when it comes to meaningful debate. The debacle over their ties to zionist terrorism this week highlights the paucity of political savvy which will, touch wood, ensure they dont get too much further in their ambitions. Several hundred people swaggering around shouting simplistic drivel and singing badly can only get so far. I'm sure it's fun for some of the young uns and very sad that it is the first engagement with politics they are likely to have had - a big failing for the left for sure. But the movement cant go beyond that without revealing even more the far right instincts at it's heart. We still need to keep an eye on them, to counter demo in order to stop them marching. But we should primarily be building the anti cuts and anti banks movement, both of which have far more meaning and resonance with "ordinary" people than anything this semi-literate rabble will ever have to contribute.
 
taffboy gwyrdd said:
But we should primarily be building the anti cuts and anti banks movement, both of which have far more meaning and resonance with "ordinary" people than anything this semi-literate rabble will ever have to contribute.
Click to expand...

Thats hard to disagree with and even as somebody who would certainly not be included in your 'we' this makes sense on all sorts of levels, not least because many on the right are also hardly the biggest fans of bankers either at the moment. (in terms of the 'cuts' I am firmly of the school of thought which beleives that savings can, and should, be made but that it should focus primarily on making real efficency savings as opposed to actually cutting many of the services under threat)

I see the EDL as being part of this whole 'identiy politics' diversion that our political processes have been diverted down for two long and that hopefully things might actually switch back to being about what really matters as opposed to gay/ethnic rights and so on. Its been a dead end for the left and essentially they have become increasingly isolated because of it.
 
butchersapron said:
Thing is, that article lands a good number of justified punches on the liberal left and the further left and their relation to the edl (whilst clumsily missing the opp to point out the commonalities in their ugh a baseball cap approach) but reverts to the same sort of thing by assuming a) this is what w/c politics should look like therefore the edl represent w/c politics and by extension the w/c - and b) it does that by looking at formal declarations of the 'leadership'.
Click to expand...


Th EDL working class? They are reactionary little Englanders, with a tory bent
 
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