EDC
A Slightly Less Invisible Cyber Fan These Days
Very much so.
Dulwich Hamlet v Bath City 18.02.23
- Thread starter Al Crane
- Start date
Christian Burt
Well-Known Member
Oh my days. Folk changing my famous Goals! Goals! Goals! classic material.
Both Burt and The Beastie Boys are not happy.
Both Burt and The Beastie Boys are not happy.
Moroccan Sunset
Well-Known Member
Gavin better than our new boss. Yes he did well I. December but not since. I’m worried about the future of this club.
How have you come to that conclusion? Genuine question.
Gavin went for 4 months without a league win, and yet no one said he was out of his depth, despite having a budget that is significantly (four-figures) greater than the one Barnes has now. He also picked all of those players and had them for three mornings a week.
Barnes has gone without a league win for a month and 4 days, with a budget he's had to cut, with a squad that wasn't/isn't his own, for two evenings a week, but apparently he is out of his depth. How does that work?
I honestly don't know how anyone can watch our last few performances and think that Gavin is the better manager.
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Paula_G
Flitting in & out like Tinkerbell on Meth
Moroccan Sunset
Well-Known Member
Same. An absolute sucker punch when again I thought we played pretty well.
I've said a lot on this topic, so I won't repeat myself. It's clearly gonna be a right ole scrap to the end of the season. Regardless of whether you're in the pro-Barnes camp or not, I think the best thing we can do is get behind the team as much as possible between now and 29th April.
We're not gonna change manager between now and then I wouldn't have thought, so I think we've just got to get through the next couple of months and hope for the best.
One thing I am certain of though is that if the terraces turn on the players and management team then we are as good as fucked. Division and criticism never helped any football team as far as I'm aware. Got to stick together to give ourselves the best chance of getting out of this mess.
AveryDave
Well-Known Member
The majority of the terraces don’t give a monkeys. The only thing that’ll make them turn is if they’re forced to actually watch the football instead of standing around chatting.
And regardless of timeframes, I’m pretty certain the last eight League games are the worst comparable run we’ve had over at least the last decade, including the last of Rose’s tenure.
There are obvious circumstances surrounding that, but the fact remains.
Acceptable.
thenewone2
New Member
We
2. Your saying seven months by adding the off season which is absurd
3. Have you seen the constraints that Gavin complained about on his interview? He literally said he was given a budget 1 week before the season started which we all know in non league is suicide as the players you want are all ready gone
Again this is the narrative that you spin to fit your narrative come on let’s be real have you seen barns manager record?
Do I think gavin time was done 100% do I think he should have been replaced by barns 100% NO
Maybe Mr Ben Clasper wanted a nodding head instead of a manager that wants to compete who knows.
The common denominator it seems to be is that dastardly board who care more about a beer garden, neckinger ale and sell out crowds then performances and getting places maybe it’s because you can’t have a drink outside in the league above as to why ?again who knows
1. Your factually incorrect gavin never had the team 3 mornings a week the teams never been full time since covid year
2. Your saying seven months by adding the off season which is absurd
3. Have you seen the constraints that Gavin complained about on his interview? He literally said he was given a budget 1 week before the season started which we all know in non league is suicide as the players you want are all ready gone
Again this is the narrative that you spin to fit your narrative come on let’s be real have you seen barns manager record?
Do I think gavin time was done 100% do I think he should have been replaced by barns 100% NO
Maybe Mr Ben Clasper wanted a nodding head instead of a manager that wants to compete who knows.
The common denominator it seems to be is that dastardly board who care more about a beer garden, neckinger ale and sell out crowds then performances and getting places maybe it’s because you can’t have a drink outside in the league above as to why ?again who knows
thenewone2
New Member
Funny that’s it’s now we have to stick together and support the team and manager when I have seen you and others, the board and the father of the secretary of the club (Liam) be completely contradictory I only made a account after 25 years of being a hamlet fan and I’m tired of this rubbish.
On the up note I haven’t seen you be this positive which is a good thing I guess
scousedom
Well-Known Member
Big difference between giving a manager ten years and saying “no I’ve seen enough to know how this ends” and between calling for his head after what, four months?
Particularly when you are being pragmatic and assuming that change won’t happen anyway because the Board aren’t going to hire three managers in a season - and are instead backing Barnes a little now to get players in now that they can.
Pink Panther
Well-Known Member
Come on, this is a bit silly. The only time we went 7 months without a win was during the pandemic, when one season ended in March and the next didn't start until October, so it was 5 games without a win. There are enough valid arguments to support your case without resorting to this.
And until this time last month Barnes had collected 26 points from his first 15 games, winning 8 of them, so the "Sack Barnes" brigade have effectively written him off on 4 weeks of results.
A big part of the problem is surely the complete lack of playing infrastructure below the first team. We were supposed to have a B team this season, playing friendlies with squad players and triallists plus the best academy players, but we've now lost that along with the Aspire Academy link. Paul Barnes is the last person to blame for that.
Paula_G
Flitting in & out like Tinkerbell on Meth
Bit confused here. “Atmosphere was as flat as a pancake” yet Twitter talks of “unbelievable noise”
It can’t be true that Barnes got 26 points from 15 games as all I’m told is that he was unable to do anything with the squad he inherited from Gav being under contract.
thenewone2
New Member
Im actually more to the fact that I blame a lot on the shoulders on the board to be honest but I do accept that after 4 weeks I shouldn’t cast doubt but I’m human and love this club in my opinion I don’t think Paul barns is the right manager to take us out the mess the board has given him to sort out but your completely correct.
Do I think Ben has brought in someone that he hopes can keep us in the league so the beer can keep flowing whilst the 3000 odd chat and dont really care if we win or lose whilst the manager won’t complain about ambition yes I do that’s why football is a game of opinions
The first thing the board done was to cut barns budget why give that budget to gavin in the first place then. Something just smells fishy
Moroccan Sunset
Well-Known Member
I take it all back - apologies. I genuinely thought we had gone that long - I'd even gone back and found some old posts from the 2019-2020 season! It was 4 months we went without a league win: 24.8.19 - 21.12.19. No idea where I got seven from. I've changed the original post now.
All the same, four months very different to the month and 4 days Barnes is currently on.
pitchfork
Well-Known Member
Maybe just maybe the players and manager are just not good enough compared to the majority of the other teams. The league table never lies. The team hasn’t had a consistently good core of players for a number of years. You could almost name the Dulwich Team week in week out during the promotion years. Since then it’s been like a revolving door.
Moroccan Sunset
Well-Known Member
As for the rest of this:
1. I never said anything about post-Covid. GR did had them 3 mornings a week in the 2019-2020 season.
3. No, I haven't. But I'd like to hear the board's version of that story. A week before the season started? He'd be lucky to have any squad at all - I find it hard to believe that Holland, Raymond and Grainger wouldn't have been short of other options. If they had no idea what wages they were gonna get they would have been off.
I've got no narrative to spin. The only drum I've banged repeatedly is that Gavin should have gone, and frankly a long time ago before we wasted hundreds of thousands of pounds on abject performances. We seem to at least partly agree on that.
I think you're perfectly entitled to say he shouldn't have been replaced by Barnes. I disgaree myself: think despite the run, the football has improved, and he's doing it all in mid-season while having to cut the budget. It was never going to be the finest season in the club's history, IMO.
And I agree with you that the board are, largely, to blame. We should never have got to the position where the club's manager had such a stranglehold on the club. I think he knew was untouchable and we gave him near endless resources for what? Subpar performances, unhappy dressing rooms, and interviews that blamed everyone but himself. It's shambolic.
thenewone2
New Member
I respect that
and you right month and 4 days is different and maybe to harsh I feel gavin time is a bit like how wenger was at arsenal and the board using him as an excuseI’m just looking at it maybe in a different way the fact that you can not cater for the 3000 odd and make the money you do in this level then above with the constant excuses in the gavin and now barns time from the board is ridiculous I think that plays a big part and constrains for both managers 3000 a home game with beer at 5 pound a pop….. would love to know the outgoings we are a fan owned club
Paula_G
Flitting in & out like Tinkerbell on Meth
Your point being? The two replies to this tweet came from Bath City fans, hardly a scientific sample.
Moroccan Sunset
Well-Known Member
I don't think I've said anything contradictory. I was foaming at the mouth when GR was in charge, certainly, but that's because we were flushing buckets of cash down the toilet season after season on tactics and sides that he'd created. He'd got himself into a position where no one at the club was prepared to do anything about him.
In terms of Barnes, I think it's a tough situation. This isn't his mess: it's primarily the board's and GR's, and yet he's the one that's got to clear it up with minimal resources. I think the bloke needs our support as much as poss.
Also been a DHFC fan for 25 years - the comfort at the moment is that I've seen a lot worse than this, as I'm sure you have.
The thread you are on.
scousedom
Well-Known Member
In fairness to the current board, Gavin’s stranglehold was established under the previous regime(s). The Aspire thing, I mean. Yes they did give him a three year deal at what must have been close to their outset, but at the time the club was on such shaky ground and would not have got a better manager - who had just secured promotion and would have been a target. The last contract was only one year. As to giving him a playing budget, we’ll, that’s what Boards are for. You back the manager with what you can afford to spend, that’s what they’ve done. They’ve not over-spent if Paula’s information on the accounts is to be believed (and I do), it’s not been speculative. It’s just what the club could afford.
I don’t see how they could have untangled Aspire etc from him while in situ. I just don’t see how that conversation would go, as Gavin would always have (rightly) seen it as planning for life after him which would instantly sour the conversation. Basically having got into that situation (on a previous Board’s watch) you could only start to get out of once the manager went.
thenewone2
New Member
I honestly agree
Honestly I agree with certain things you have said gavin should have left a long time ago 100% maybe his loyalty for not going to others teams whilst we was the in process of no longer existing made his power and hold of the club for that reason a recipe for disaster. But again Ben clasper and his entourage have massive blame the fact that Ben has openly said (we have endless managers applying for the role) then picks Paul Barnes just doesn’t feel right especially when immediately Told him to cut the budget just doesn’t sit right with me then blame the players that was brought in IE Liam no it’s just fishy to me that’s all
Moroccan Sunset
Well-Known Member
Liam is perfectly capable of making his own points but Ill say this for him: I dont think hes blaming the players themselves. I think hes blaming the fact that some of them arent great shakes but were recruited on good money in thr first place.
Re: budget, I dont know, but I think the reasoning was likely: we're not gonna get as high a finish as we expected, so we'll cut the budget back and save a few quid. Don't think its anything odder than that tbh. Obviously that's landed us in a bit of crap; I think it was an overconfident decision.
And another note on finances: I dread to think how much GR got paid off.
Moroccan Sunset
Well-Known Member
Politely disagree. At some point, GR and DHFC were gonna have to part. It couldn't last forever. G knew that, I just think he was trying to hang on for as long as poss, bc he was doing very nicely out of it, thank you v much. If he had the best interests of the club at heart, why would he take offence to the fact that we needed to plan for like posr-ASPIRE? He knew the club would need its own academy long-term. It's a difficult conversation but one I think the club should have had, or we certainly should have had plans for what to do once ASPIRE left. We didn't though. I honestly we were scared of GR.
Finances - completely agree. We didnt overspend insofar as going beyond what the club could afford, but we did overspend in terms of the money we forked out. The pandemic season being a fine example. We had a strong play off place budget (five figures a week), and yet when Covid intervened we were mired in a relegation battle. That was an opportunity to break the stranglehold, but we let enormous underperformance and waste of resources go unaddressed.
Totally with you that some of the problems were sewn under the previous owners but we had ample opportunity to wrest some of the power he had back. If he didn't like it, then there was an obvious solution: he had to go.
Paula_G
Flitting in & out like Tinkerbell on Meth
There’s an interesting dichotomy in there. If these problems are created as much by the board as by any manager then in supporting Barnes then you are also endorsing the board.
Paula_G
Flitting in & out like Tinkerbell on Meth
We’re constantly talking about the need for our own academy; indeed it was one of the subjects covered in the Crouch documentary where the existence of the Aspire Academy was totally glossed over. Along with the training ground and a revamped upstairs function room, the Academy was one of the most trumpeted tasks of our then “Director of Football” as part of his five year (five month?) plan. It may have been mentioned in programme notes elsewhere or not but if it has is there anyone able to enlighten this oblivious fan?
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