Donald Trump, the road that might not lead to the White House!

[bimble]

Interesting how clearly that acknowledges deindustrialisation, precarity and all that stuff in a way that 'moderates' generally don't ...

Thats kind of the whole point of his campaign to make america great again.

 

[TomUS]

More like Bannon's Last Will and Testament about the Jews

The 3 financial bad guys featured as part of the "global power structure" are Jews....Yellen - Fed Reserve Chair, Soros - liberal investor & Blankfein - Goldman Sachs CEO. Guess they couldn't find any non-Jewish big finance threats.

 

[redsquirrel]

And presents entirely false promises.

I don't think anyone on U75 would deny that (bar perhaps one), but the reasons given why people are angry are true. The politicians are corrupt, they have overseen a transfer of wealth from rich to poor. The fact that Clinton can't even come out with some mil rhetoric from this angle just illustrates why she's never going to be a solution to what's making people turn to Trump, indeed she's only going to make the situation worse.

 

[bimble]

The politicians are corrupt, they have overseen a transfer of wealth from rich to poor.

Um. Do you think think Trump might offer any solutions to what's making people turn to Trump?

 

[redsquirrel]

And presents entirely false promises.

I don't think anyone on U75 would deny that

 

[brogdale]

I don't think anyone on U75 would deny that (bar perhaps one), but the reasons given why people are angry are true. The politicians are corrupt, they have overseen a transfer of wealth from rich to poor. The fact that Clinton can't even come out with some mil rhetoric from this angle just illustrates why she's never going to be a solution to what's making people turn to Trump, indeed she's only going to make the situation worse.

As with the 'Leave' campaign, genuine grievances and anger resulting from neoliberalism are being channelled to conceal the cause of people's immiseration. Both campaigns purport to address the widening gulf between de jure and de facto sovereignty identifying 'the political elite' (in various guises) and foreigners as the culprits, whilst scrupulously deflecting attention away from the corporatism of their actual constituency.

 

[two sheds]

It's easy to point out things that are wrong with society (as on Trump's video), it's why cults have such leverage.

 

[Wilf]

We've been hearing this theory since the beginning of Trump's surprising ascension, and while it is easy to buy into and wraps everything up nicely with a bow, I think it also leaves a lot of us with doubts and skepticism.

For one thing, while I'm not regularly hanging out in circles with people who are desperately impoverished or abjectly miserable, I have come across my fair share of Trump supporters. I have tried very hard to understand what might have caused their anger and ire, especially against the Obama administration, The Health Care Reform Act, and such. The reason why it's so hard to understand is that most of these people are not from backgrounds different to mine. Most of them I have met through professional or volunteer circles. In almost every case, they were upper-middle class, college educated, successful, with large, thriving families, support networks: healthy, thriving, and comfortable. We believed in many of the same things on a personal level. In many ways, I and most of my more left-wing friends and family have struggled far more than they ever had.

Yet, yes..they were angry. About a range of things from immigration, to ISIS, to Michelle Obama trying to change school lunch programs to make kids healthier (???) They would rattle on about these things, almost on a daily basis, almost gleeful in their anger and condescension towards "liberals" and people like Al Sharpton, BLM, welfare recipients, and so on. (and no, I'm not trying to insinuate that it's all about racism either) But...it's just that it's not all about being miserable and struggling on a personal level either.

I honestly have had a difficult time getting to the core of what the anger is about. I do remember what it was like living under G.W. Bush, how frustrating it felt to feel so poorly represented or acknowledged to as a citizen. So I tried to see it from that perspective, and imagine what that might feel like to live during the Obama administration as someone who had very different views to mine. I do think this accounts for a good portion of this pro-Trump sentiment. Because we have mixed in with it the fact that Bush let them down too. He showed himself as part of a political dynasty which is seeming more and more removed from US Citizens.

Here's the thing...most right wing people in this country believe in the dream of working hard to achieve their goals...they want government to stay out of the way, they want to live independently without a bunch of red tape or overly sensitive people's distracting ideas about fairness for everyone getting in the way of that singular goal / right. This is a thread that runs through generations upon generations of US citizens. And now, a lot of those people are seeing how the world is changing around them (for the ones I'm talking about, these are the ones who grew up in suburban towns where they didn't have to be exceptionally intelligent or glamorous in order to succeed, to be popular, to be surrounded by people who thought like them, who did the same things they did, and who were accepted and never felt threatened by having to compete with a changing economy and workforce, with instability in their community and the country, etc.) and it bewilders them.

the irony is so many of those people whining about millennials and their requests for "safe spaces" etc.

I don't mean to downplay the role of people who are legitimately suffering, it's just that this certainly doesn't account for all, or even the majority of Trump supporters. I do see mostly in the ones I know a dedication to preserving their way of life for future generations, even if it doesn't make logical sense as a goal. They don't want a "shake up" of the system, they want a return to what they see as the natural order of things. I think Trump appeals to them because he's been straightforward about going after what he wants in life (money, a high-profile career, women) and they appreciate that kind of directness and lack of extraneous fluff or political pandering.

Interesting post. The question I'd ask though is why is it at such an intensity now? In other words, why will all those people with those feelings and grievances actually vote for a candidate who is 'bonkers', beyond the pale, not remotely presidential, whatever phrase you want to use? Yes, I know, the answer to that is partly because he is all of those things - it allows him to embody all the sentiments you describe. But are you saying American society and politics was always going to produce a president or close call who was as wild eyed as Trump - austerity might have been a catalyst, but he's really a product of what was there all along?

 

[bimble]

Videos around of numbers of trucks and cars with confederate flags flying driving about circling polling stations in florida. Cos thats when America was Great, presumably, before the south lost the war.

 

[krtek a houby]

Thats kind of the whole point of his campaign to make america hate again.

Fify

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Videos around of numbers of trucks and cars with confederate flags flying driving about circling polling stations in florida. Cos thats when America was Great, presumably, before the south lost the war.
View attachment 95184

If Trump wins it will be seriously ugly. Put our post-Brexit vote nastiness in the shade.

 

[two sheds]

If Trump loses it will be seriously ugly. Put our post-Brexit vote nastiness in the shade.

 

[8ball]

Bloke at work seems to know his stuff and is expecting Trump to be utterly crushed at the ballot box.
My less informed impression is that it might be a pretty close win for Clinton.

I wonder exactly how crushed he can get and still refuse to give in gracefully.
I've got a feeling there might be a relatively graceful climbdown tomorrow.
Might be giving him too much credit.

 

[krtek a houby]

It will be the will of the people and never again will Americans be called "stupid" or "thickos".

 

[Treacle Toes]

If Trump wins it will be seriously ugly. Put our post-Brexit vote nastiness in the shade.

If Trump loses it will be seriously ugly. Put our post-Brexit vote nastiness in the shade.

You are both right. Fucking hell.

 

[8ball]

It will be the will of the people and never again will Americans be called "stupid" or "thickos".

Not by us, anyway...

 

[frogwoman]

I have a feeling that one of the 'safe' states like Texas might go over to democrats, and the same on the republican side. theres gonna be a few shocks tonight imo

 

[two sheds]

You are both right. Fucking hell.

I think lbj's righter than I am though.

 

[Obediah Marsh]

If Trump loses it will be seriously ugly. Put our post-Brexit vote nastiness in the shade.

The nutters in Texas are threatening to secede if Clinton wins.

 

[8ball]

You are both right. Fucking hell.

I think even if Trump were to bow out with the grace of Ginger Rogers and never darken the political scene again, there are a lot of genies that won't be going quietly back in their bottles now.

 

[krtek a houby]

The nutters in Texas are threatening to secede if Clinton wins.

Texas has been independent before, I think.

 

[rutabowa]

Texas has been independent before, I think.

It used to be Mexico, they should give it back.

 

[hot air baboon]

genies that won't be going quietly back in their bottles now.

....no that's fine - Trump will be subjecting them to "extreme vetting" as they come from the Middle East...

...and don't genies come out of lamps...its messages you get in bottles isn't it..?

 

[DotCommunist]

The nutters in Texas are threatening to secede if Clinton wins.

texans are always saying that though

 

[two sheds]

I've often wondered whether we'd be better off if all the US states became individual countries. They'd all probably get equal shares on the nukes though.

 

[DotCommunist]

It used to be Mexico, they should give it back.

it was funny when some mexican state official said that they would gladly pay for a wall if it was built to pre mexican-american war borders lol

 

[krtek a houby]

I've often wondered whether we'd be better off if all the US states became individual countries. They'd all probably get equal shares on the nukes though.

Like the break up of the USSR? Yeah, I've mentioned that to US family and friends but it hasn't always been a conversation winner. China could do the same, too - it's such a mix of cultures and so vast.

 

[Idris2002]

Like the break up of the USSR? Yeah, I've mentioned that to US family and friends but it hasn't always been a conversation winner. China could do the same, too - it's such a mix of cultures and so vast.

China has a single party dedicated to national unity at all coasts.

The next time you see your US family and friends, they'll probably be fresh out of the reception camps set up for American boat people.

 

[Idris2002]

I've often wondered whether we'd be better off if all the US states became individual countries. They'd all probably get equal shares on the nukes though.

When the Central African Federation was dissolved, Southern Rhodesian got to walk off with the CAF army's entire arsenal. Hijinks ensued. . .

 

[Yossarian]

There was a pretty big Texas secession movement after Obama won in 2012, probably be at least a modest revival of that if Clinton wins. Though the one time they actually got around to doing it, it didn't work out so well...