Do you consider yourself an audiophile?
- Thread starter Doctor Carrot
- Start date
pogofish
Testicle Hairstyle
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
ATOMIC SUPLEX
Member Since: 1985 Post Count: 3
This is the bit I don't get about "audiophiles", they spend thousands on cables that claim to reduce interference etc, yet use unbalanced phono connections
It's funny isn't it. "Pseudo balanced" phono cable FFS?? Why not just buy pro gear? It's mostly cheaper (but not cheap) and has better spec. It's like being into telephones and buying two diamond encrusted gold cups joined together with platinum string, when you could get buy a towns exchange for the same price.
Fictionist
Serving Eargasms....
mickskyvitch
Sober since 3/1/2003
No, do to fucked hearing.
ATOMIC SUPLEX
Member Since: 1985 Post Count: 3
Are you kidding? I get a faceplam because I say that you know nothing on the subject of real audio acoustics, engineering and components? You have proved you don't because of you bizarre and impossible claims.
You need the biggest faceplam in the universe. This is science. Science fact. What makes you and your home hobbiests think they know better than the people who kit out the best studios in the world? I've worked in Abbey Road and I can tell you they have some crazy expensive shit there but they don't have cable elevators. They also have regular priced 'regular' cable.
It's all in your head. It really is.
I found this great quote on a web forum.
A lot of science? Yeah, basic physics. You think it's time for a rewrite?
I think this sums up the audiophile.
gentlegreen
I hummus, therefore I am ...
I bet there's an overlap with free energy and 9-11 bollocks ..
I went to a mainstream HIFI show in the late 90s and that was bad enough ...
I went to a mainstream HIFI show in the late 90s and that was bad enough ...
Clair De Lune
Apocalypse cocktails
I like to dowse for the correct position to put my speakers. If I find myself wanting to listen to something mellow I make sure the wires are not crossing the ley line that I found crosses my living room. It makes so much difference to the sound. When I cross the wires over the leyline, to my ears it turns greenday into minorthreat. Which is nice 
ATOMIC SUPLEX
Member Since: 1985 Post Count: 3
I will be laughing on the other side of my face when Cern discover the higgs boson creates a 0.5db drop in bass with a Q the size of a gnats little finger at 18Hz in 30-meter length or regular speaker cable compared to 'pseudo balanced' audioinsaniacs solid silver cable.
Luckily at that very moment we will all be sucked into a black hole of ignorant self importance as science and time runs backwards.
Fictionist
Serving Eargasms....
I've give you two facepalms this time around because you continue to be rude and presume far too much, having extrapolated some conclusions from an argument that exists only in your head.
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
I've give you two facepalms this time around because you continue to be rude and presume far too much, having extrapolated some conclusions from an argument that exists only in your head.
Well, no, he hasn't.
You claim that cables make a difference to the sound.
Two professional audio engineers (and, lets face it, the laws of physics) disagree with you.
You need to bring something more than "I just know they do" to the argument if you want to be taken seriously.
stupid dogbot
Haughty and Superior
I've give you two facepalms this time around because you continue to be rude and presume far too much, having extrapolated some conclusions from an argument that exists only in your head.
Smug and a hypocrite, huh?
Boycey
juvenile rave slut
we've all seen what happens when you try audiophiles through blind tests, they fail miserably.
at least the poster in question has an apt name.
fictionist- ever thought of getting a setup with an active crossover?
at least the poster in question has an apt name.
fictionist- ever thought of getting a setup with an active crossover?
teuchter
je suis teuchter
The thing is though; if Fictionist thinks something makes a difference to him, then you can't really change that.
Even if it is the price of the cables that makes the difference, rather than the cables themselves, the end result is that it provides Fictionist with a happier listening experience. It's his money - he has presumably weighed the expense against the perceived benefit and come to the conclusion that it is worthwhile for him. He recommends people listen for themselves and make their own decision. So - what's the problem?
Even if it is the price of the cables that makes the difference, rather than the cables themselves, the end result is that it provides Fictionist with a happier listening experience. It's his money - he has presumably weighed the expense against the perceived benefit and come to the conclusion that it is worthwhile for him. He recommends people listen for themselves and make their own decision. So - what's the problem?
gentlegreen
I hummus, therefore I am ...
The problem is that those who know a bit about the subject hate to leave the possibility that some poor innocent soul would fall for the bullshit. Not that it's likely on a general forum like Urbanz.
ATOMIC SUPLEX
Member Since: 1985 Post Count: 3
I've give you two facepalms this time around because you continue to be rude and presume far too much, having extrapolated some conclusions from an argument that exists only in your head.
Sorry, was it only in my head? Whoops, boy have I got a red face. So you don't think the expensive cabling makes any difference to the sound then? Ok fine, sorry i thought you did.
Sorry about being rude before, It's just that I thought you were a gullible fool who didn't understand some rather basic science (for a self proclaimed audiophile), instead enjoying the odd placebo pleasure of listening to the sound of your money rolling down the drain.
PS. I don't think you know how to use faceplams.
wemakeyousoundb
hopefully not gimboid
... need ... ley line ... now ...I like to dowse for the correct position to put my speakers. If I find myself wanting to listen to something mellow I make sure the wires are not crossing the ley line that I found crosses my living room. It makes so much difference to the sound. When I cross the wires over the leyline, to my ears it turns greenday into minorthreat. Which is nice
teuchter
je suis teuchter
wemakeyousoundb
hopefully not gimboid
shouldn't that link be in the "funnies" thread?
Fictionist
Serving Eargasms....
Let me pose this question to you. You have stated that you have worked at Abbey Road studios and they "have some of the most crazy expensive (sic) shit there"........
Why do they use "crazy expensive shit" and not everyday equipment within the reach of the consumer? Setting the issue of room acoustics aside why would Abbey Road choose to use B&W speakers for example? If all gear sounds the same - as some appear to be suggesting on this thread - why do studios spend so much on having what they consider (personal perception?!) the best possible gear - and often the most expensive equipment?
Fictionist
Serving Eargasms....
Smug and a hypocrite, huh?
Sorry, I thought we had already been through this. Who are you?
Fictionist
Serving Eargasms....
The gear is expensive - the cables are not. I have a reel of solid core 13A mains cable to wire my speakers up and it works very well
Hang on - writing that the gear is expensive isn't the same as writing (or admitting) that gear sounds different. Presumably a subjective judgement has been made that the gear is the best available for a particular cost (not that expensive will always equate with the best subjective sound).
So are you now admitting the possibility that gear sounds different (without the need for 'listening tests' / ABX tests etc?
ATOMIC SUPLEX
Member Since: 1985 Post Count: 3
Let me pose this question to you. You have stated that you have worked at Abbey Road studios and they "have some of the most crazy expensive (sic) shit there"........
Why do they use "crazy expensive shit" and not everyday equipment within the reach of the consumer? Setting the issue of room acoustics aside why would Abbey Road choose to use B&W speakers for example? If all gear sounds the same - as some appear to be suggesting on this thread - why do studios spend so much on having what they consider (personal perception?!) the best possible gear - and often the most expensive equipment?
Who said all gear sounds the same? I didn't. It doesn't. Also to a large extent the signal path is monitored using audio spectrum analyzers, it's not personal just 'personal perception' it's science. Speaker cables don't make a difference.
Abbey road have a lot of very rare and very cool microphones for instance. They have spent a fortune over the years on getting some of the best equipment for recording and mastering music. They have some of the top sound engineers from around the world working on some of the most expensive equipment mastering music so that it can be the best it possibly can be on the final CD. They have state of the art sound monitoring equipment and the best ears in the business. They spare no expense in having the very best unhindered signal pathways.
One thing they don't have is silver lined pseudo balanced interconnects. They use the same leads I do at home for my guitars and speakers and whatever. They have expensive gear but they don't waste money.
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
You're getting rather confused here.
For starters, nobody has said that "all gear sounds the same". What I have said is that all CD players sound the same, and that cables make no difference to the sound. I also personally think that amplifiers all sound the same, or to be more precise, any differences they may have are so small as to be insignificant.
As for studios, recording is a completely different process to playback. Microphones all sound different as they are mechanical devices. Different EQ units will impart their own sonic signature on things, and so on.
The one area in a home hifi setup that really matters is the speakers. They (and the room you put them in) are what defines what you hear.
Fictionist
Serving Eargasms....
Oh hang on. You wrote:
"Everything you've ever written about this sort of stuff revolves around you saying things like "try a Rotel amp, they're more laid back" or "a marantz CD player is usually more forward sounding"
"Until you do a proper blind test you're wasting your time"
Re-read the thread. When I suggested listening to a variety of different systems at different price points some posters opined that the only valid means of assessing the sound of a system would be via ABX testing -you wrote of "proper blind tests".
If you are now accepting that gear doesn't all sound the same (oh no - now all amplifiers sound the same or the differences are so small as to be insignificant) then you will concede that Marantz amplifier can sound different to a Rotel amplifier and a host of other brands. I explained that using terms such as 'warm', 'open' (etc) is a non-technical means of describing a sound - I pointed out that you would explain such differences of sound in technical terms and I provided some crude examples for comparison.
If the issue isn't the gear then presumably your insistence that such differences can only truly be detected using blind tests is nonsense? Unless of course you have no faith in your own abilities not to arrive at an individual conclusion regarding the sound you prefer (quite subjectively of course). This explains:
"You pay more, you know what is being tested and when it's being changed, so you think they sound better".
CDs and amplifiers sound the same?
Incidentally, the guy behind the video (Ethan Winer) can be seen writing about the video and responsing to criticisms regarding the partisan nature of the video on the gearslutz.com forums. You are an audio professional so you may already be on the forum, but for others reading this thread it offers an alternative view of the issues he raises.
To conclude, I say to people buying gear that the most important factor to consider is how a system sounds to you. Does it get you closer to the music? Does it make you want to listen again and again to your favourite music format? If yes then great. The gear is a means to an end - and not the end in itself.
BigTom
Well-Known Member
I think Bee's point is that there aren't really any differences to be heard - certainly not because of cabling, and not really because of CD players or amps - and by doing blind tests you will find out that you cannot tell the difference between them, because there is no (appreciable) difference. When you are doing a non-blind test, the difference you hear is because you want there to be a difference, not because there is one.
