Canterbury Arms, Brixton to be turned into flats - planning application

[Brixton Hatter]

Spot on. 21 names is all that is needed. One of the names needs to be the main contact.

Thanks. Is anyone interested in putting their name to this?

21 people are needed. If 21 people say "yes" I'll volunteer to do the paperwork.

 

[DJWrongspeed]

I've emailed them with my intentions, not sure I got all the facts straight, in a hurry:

I have read your blog about the Canterbury Arms redevelopment and understand you would like feedback.

What do you expect the Brixton community to say? This plan would mean the loss of another beautiful London pub. The proposed community space will never allow similar events as currently hosted by the Canterbury. Another live music venue will disappear. You mention 'Shared-equity' but are not explicit about numbers of units. This term in no way implies 'affordable.'

In conclusion I strongly object to this proposal and will object to the council if it is put before the planning committee.

 

[editor]

<thinking aloud>

I've been mulling over this. Practically, I think it might be difficult to get people to raise the money to save the pub just for it to stay in its current format.

Its main audience appears to be a rather small demographic of Brixton and one that generally isn't particularly well off or influential (this isn't a criticism by the way, just an observation), and most of the pubs that get saved seem to have a broader appeal.

The pub has oodles of potential though so maybe that's something to consider?

 

[leanderman]

There might be greater social utility in creating badly-needed homes for 100+ people than in preserving a pub some say is used by only a few.

 

[TruXta]

High-end sushi place?

 

[Gramsci]

Comments on the pre application need to go in by tomorrow.

I would say it has a lot of potential as a venue. Look at how sucessful of the old Conservative Club "Effra Social" is. The editor photos show that it is attractive inside.

Will not be the same people that use it. But would preserve it as a pub.

 

[editor]

There might be greater social utility in creating badly-needed homes for 100+ people than in preserving a pub some say is used by only a few.

That would make sense if it were social housing. But it's not. Pubs can serve an important social function which will be lost forever if the place is closed down and replaced by stylish apartments for the upwardly mobile.

It is quite a popular pub still, although it has perhaps a more limited demographic than some, and it's probably the 'wrong kind of demographic' when it comes to having the clout, influence and council-persuasive powers to campaign for its survival.

I see a beautiful Victorian pub that could be lovingly restored and made into a real community asset for locals to use, compared with a bland office block.

 

[editor]

I've asked them to extend the deadline because their feedback form is a mess;

Hi
I have to say that the mechanism you've chosen for the feedback form is supremely user-unfriendly. I've known several people who have given up trying to understand how to download and then append the file. It also breaks web accessibility requirements.
To get a real picture of what users think, I recommend that you put up a standard text form that people can access on all devices, and extend the deadline.
Regards

 

[clandestino]

I agree. I've had terrible trouble with the feedback form. A text form would be much better.

 

[clandestino]

The email address for the forms is brixtonconsultation@camarguepr.com

I'm just going to send my feedback to that directly I think...

 

[editor]

That's what I did, but I think it's worth telling them how user unfriendly their feedback form is too.

 

[clandestino]

I've just emailed. Here's part of what I had to say:

The Canterbury Arms plays an important role as a place for music fans to drink before and after concerts at the Brixton Academy. The Brixton Academy regularly attracts thousands of music fans to its concerts and those people need somewhere to go before and after the gigs, and the Canterbury Arms, by being a backstreet pub that’s very close to the Brixton Academy, has served an important role in keeping those people off the streets in Brixton. While there are other pubs in the area that also serve as pre and post gig pubs for the music crowd, there are not enough to cope with the sheer volume of people who come to the concerts, and the Canterbury Arms plays an important role in keeping Brixton tolerable on concert nights. The demolition of the Canterbury Arms would lead to more congestion on the streets on the concert nights, and would have a negative impact for everyone.

I do think its function as a place to go before and after the Academy gigs shouldn't be underestimated. The Academy is Brixton's elephant in the room, in a way - it's huge, it brings thousands and thousands of people into the area on gig nights, and we need a structure in place to deal with those people. There are other pubs but there aren't enough, and on really busy nights the Canterbury opens up the back room as well, and takes 300 people off the streets of Brixton. That has an affect on everyone who lives here. That's just one of many good reasons why it should be saved.

 

[marty21]

The Bell community buy out involved a mixture of shares and a bank loan - they raised about £800,000 from the share issue, and it cost them £920,000 , the rest being funded from a bank loan - . The Bell is a muso pub - gigs 4 or 5 times a week, I think Robert Plant got involved as his son plays in a band I think - and a lot of musicians in the Bristol scene had heard of, or played in the pub, and got involved too.

No idea if the Canterbury is worth the same - but it can be done

 

[leanderman]

That would make sense if it were social housing. But it's not. Pubs can serve an important social function which will be lost forever if the place is closed down and replaced by stylish apartments for the upwardly mobile.

It is quite a popular pub still, although it has perhaps a more limited demographic than some, and it's probably the 'wrong kind of demographic' when it comes to having the clout, influence and council-persuasive powers to campaign for its survival.

I see a beautiful Victorian pub that could be lovingly restored and made into a real community asset for locals to use, compared with a bland office block.

There will be a proportion of social or affordable housing.

As long as it is occupied, a home is a home, whether social or private.

And we need more homes.

 

[editor]

There will be a proportion of social or affordable housing.

As long as it is occupied, a home is a home, whether social or private.

And we need more homes.

We need places for people to go and socialise too.

 

[Winot]

We need places for people to go and socialise too.

We need a national charity to be launched for the pub-less generation - perhaps off the back of a 'Cathy Come Home'-style film to tug at the heart strings first.

 

[editor]

We need a national charity to be launched for the pub-less generation - perhaps off the back of a 'Cathy Come Home'-style film to tug at the heart strings first.

I just think that pubs should be afforded some kind of protection from short-term profiteers - particularly the pubs out in the country and n smaller communities where they're often the only place people can socialise at night.

Sorry if that's not jokey enough.

 

[Winot]

I just think that pubs should be afforded some kind of protection from short-term profiteers - particularly the pubs out in the country and n smaller communities where they're often the only place people can socialise at night.

Sorry if that's not jokey enough.

Yes I have sympathy with the only pub in the village closing. Not the case here though, and, as others have pointed out, some pubs are being created/revamped in the area.

 

[clandestino]

Why can't this one be revamped too?

 

[Winot]

Why can't this one be revamped too?

I've no idea. Presumably there's more money to be made converting to flats. Perhaps you should ask the owner of the Crown & Anchor - they made a decision to revamp rather than convert.

 

[leanderman]

I've no idea. Presumably there's more money to be made converting to flats. Perhaps you should ask the owner of the Crown & Anchor - they made a decision to revamp rather than convert.

Effra Social too.

 

[editor]

Yes I have sympathy with the only pub in the village closing. Not the case here though, and, as others have pointed out, some pubs are being created/revamped in the area.

Brixton has already lost many pubs, and given how rammed they're getting already - before the big new developments have fully opened - I'd say losing another would have a detrimental impact on the area as a whole.

 

[clandestino]

I've no idea. Presumably there's more money to be made converting to flats. Perhaps you should ask the owner of the Crown & Anchor - they made a decision to revamp rather than convert.

Well, I think it can, and should, be. The location - between the Academy and westernmost exit of Brixton Village - couldn't be more perfect. Whoever did it up would make a mint.

 

[clandestino]

Don't forget there's an exit of Brixton Village that opens out directly onto Pope's Road. It's often closed, but I bet it would be easy to get it open once the Canterbury had been revamped. Then suddenly the pub's in a prime location.

 

[leanderman]

Isn't there going to be a new pub or something in the back of Bon Marche?

 

[leanderman]

Well, I think it can, and should, be. The location - between the Academy and westernmost exit of Brixton Village - couldn't be more perfect. Whoever did it up would make a mint.

That area is not on my radar and I have always written it off - perhaps because I'm SW2

 

[clandestino]

 

[editor]

Isn't there going to be a new pub or something in the back of Bon Marche?

No. You're thinking of the trendy Drink, Shop & Do, which is a "design shop and café bar selling products from emerging designers alongside vintage furniture and home wares". So nothing like a pub.

http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2013/05/...-to-open-new-branch-in-ferndale-road-brixton/

 

[leanderman]

No. You're thinking of the trendy Drink, Shop & Do, which is a "design shop and café bar selling products from emerging designers alongside vintage furniture and home wares". So nothing like a pub.

But we are getting two new champagne bars this summer - those will be right up your street!

 

[Onket]

Has the pub actually closed yet?