Well I can’t speak for Ed but I’m not missing the point, I just fundamentally disagree with you. Crime is crime, simple. We live in a democracy underpinned by law and order. You can pick and choose which laws you want to observe, depending on your moral compass but then so can the burglars, racists and anyone else who doesn’t agree with something, doesn’t make it right. It’s just a few cameras, who cares? What happens if another young woman is snatched off the street and the cameras are not working so you can’t trace the car. That ok? One Lambeth to be fair have gone down the correct, legal route. To use examples like the suffragette movement to make it an equitable case is classic deflection, most would just say fair point and agree to disagree
Brixton Liveable Neighbourhood and LTN schemes - improvements for pedestrians and cyclists
- Thread starter teuchter
- Start date
toblerone3
Grrrrr
Just looking at some really interesting unpublished data on traffic trends on LTN boundary roads. If a decision is taken to remove the LTNs in Brixton, will an EQIA on the effect of removing them be done?
sleaterkinney
Well-Known Member
Traffic is already exceeding pre-lockdown levels and this with a lot of people still wfh. I wonder if the antis have any solution to this?.
www.thetimes.co.uk
Traffic heavier than before pandemic
Traffic on British roads is exceeding pre-pandemic levels, fuelled by a reluctance to use public transport and a big rise in internet shopping.Official data s
www.thetimes.co.uk
sleaterkinney
Well-Known Member
Maybe instead of an LTN they could do that motorway they were going to put through Brixton?.
Jeanette Moo
Active Member
What was the vandalism? I heard someone pointed them all upwards. is that what people are referring to?
I think the point was that lack of proper and meaningful consultation leads to anger and frustration that is easy avoidable. It also leads to unchecked bodies of power, which is never a good thing.
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
"Just build one more lane"
Jeanette Moo
Active Member
Not really if a change such as the LTNs has had an negative effect on people's lives why wouldn't they want it to go back to the way it was or protest something that would have had a negative effec tto many (poll tax riots).
Many people don't want these shemes at all. They don't want tweaks. They don't want to hear how maybe adjusting xyz traffic light would help. Its a sticking plaster on a gunshot wound. Everyone knows the consultation is a farce, excludes many (Lambeth already admitted they breach human rights) and is pre determined. Thats why many are taking the no compromises route.
I see lots of council due diligence talked about five a side pitches on common, planning for new things...but throw something in that has a massive impact on a huge number of people and they stick their fingers in their ears and sing lalalalalalalala
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
Fair enough.
Your view is we live in democracy with rule of law. There is legal right to peaceful demonstration following the rules , writing letters to Cllrs and lobbying those in power for example. If one isn't happy with present state of affairs there is legal route to take to change things.
Direct action/ vandalism of any kind is outside of this and is not legitimate. Its a criminal act whatever the reasons/justifications behind it are.
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Gramsci
Well-Known Member
This started with chowce5382 being told to condemn "vandalism".
What irritated me last night was that chowce5382 has gone down the legal route. That wasn't good enough. Poster was expected to account for the actions of others in the very loose group of those who oppose LTNs who break the law.
The line that a person who is opposing the actions of state authorities legally must condemn a minority who break the law is pretty standard right wing thing imo.
What irritated me last night was that chowce5382 has gone down the legal route. That wasn't good enough. Poster was expected to account for the actions of others in the very loose group of those who oppose LTNs who break the law.
The line that a person who is opposing the actions of state authorities legally must condemn a minority who break the law is pretty standard right wing thing imo.
I’m sure some will argue that it’s the wrong time to close roads but this was predicted and one of the reasons behind LTNs. These schemes are protecting residents from the minority of car owners and people driving through the borough’s minor roads.Traffic is already exceeding pre-lockdown levels and this with a lot of people still wfh. I wonder if the antis have any solution to this?.
Traffic heavier than before pandemic
Traffic on British roads is exceeding pre-pandemic levels, fuelled by a reluctance to use public transport and a big rise in internet shopping.Official data s
Where was the consultation & EQIAs on ever increasing traffic?
Jeanette Moo
Active Member
So from what I can read the recent 'vandalism' towards the cameras in Streatham was someone pointing all the cameras up with a stick or something.
Seeing as being pedantic is a common theme......that doesn't even meet the definition of vandalism. Yes there has been actual vandalism to all sorts of signs and planters but the cameras.....
What does that fall under? There's no damage. It's public property so no trespass. The fines can't lead to a criminal conviction so it's not perverting the course of justice. WHat can they do here?
Seeing as being pedantic is a common theme......that doesn't even meet the definition of vandalism. Yes there has been actual vandalism to all sorts of signs and planters but the cameras.....
What does that fall under? There's no damage. It's public property so no trespass. The fines can't lead to a criminal conviction so it's not perverting the course of justice. WHat can they do here?
I don’t think that’s true. I think it started with Charlie appearing to defend them, or at least down play them.
Jeanette Moo
Active Member
or from another angle the attempt to stop a 'car led recovery' has failedTraffic is already exceeding pre-lockdown levels and this with a lot of people still wfh. I wonder if the antis have any solution to this?.
Traffic heavier than before pandemic
Traffic on British roads is exceeding pre-pandemic levels, fuelled by a reluctance to use public transport and a big rise in internet shopping.Official data s
toblerone3
Grrrrr
Disgusting car lobby fuck off.
The police & council have confirmed it’s criminal damage.
Criminal Damage | The Crown Prosecution Service
toblerone3
Grrrrr
It hasn't failed its a continuing battle. Perhaps distance-based road pricing is in the offing as an addition not as an alternative to LTNs. The technology is increasingly there.
Jeanette Moo
Active Member
Car lobby. Big car lobby money is taking over our country. Has learned form big oil and big tobacco.
Or car lobby. AKA normal people who happen to have a car.
Jeanette Moo
Active Member
I stand correctedThe police & council have confirmed it’s criminal damage.
View attachment 273517
Criminal Damage | The Crown Prosecution Service
www.cps.gov.uk
View attachment 273518
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
The police & council have confirmed it’s criminal damage.
View attachment 273517
Criminal Damage | The Crown Prosecution Service
View attachment 273518
So smearing "mud" is criminal damage. Your having a laugh. Or are you serious
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
Your using posters real name. Ed is part of your user name.
Its not the etiquette here.
Winot
I wholeheartedley agree with your viewpoint
Don’t compare LTNs to gunshot wounds please. Not ever and not right now in Lambeth.
Fair play Grams!
Jeanette Moo
Active Member
It wasnt a comparison it was an analogy and get back in your box - Pre-kids I was a volunteer at a youth club trying to stop the very stuff that is happening in Lambeth now so save your faux offence
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
And to follow from Jeanette Moo I was one of those who campaigned against our right on LTN Council to stop them selling off my local Adventure playground. Used by kids on my local Council estate.
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