editor
hiraethified
I have tried it and I really, really didn't like it but then I'm not a fan of hoppy beers, or ones that cost £6.
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jimbarkanoodle
Well-Known Member
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jimbarkanoodle
Well-Known Member
No its not. No pint of beer should ever cost £6. For someone on minimum wage, after tax, that equates to not far off an hour's work.
Sadly its very quickly becoming the normal price in Brixton and beyond, well £5. Unless you want to part take in mid week day time / happy hour drinking or sit in a weatherspoons you will be hard pushed to get 2 pints for under a tenner. Be interesting to put together the price of a pint in the Brixton spots, sure will have been done before.
Personally I like the beer, but i don't like paying £6 for it. I would call a pint of Carling shitty for sure !
editor
hiraethified
There's plenty of places selling pints under a fiver. Effra/Albert/Beehive spring immediately to mind. Brixton Brewery can't really claim a 'craft premium' given that they're 49% owned by Heineken. Or is it 49.9%?
jezg
Well-Known Member
It's 49% as I've stated to you before.
We don't claim a craft premium, the cost of our beer simply reflects our cost of production (relative lack of economies of scale) and of the ingredients, ie high relative hopping rates using imported US hops.
I guess we could make it cheaper by paying our staff less but we've been a living wage accredited employer since 2014 and always will be.
The juxtaposition of you arguing for higher wages at e.g. Ritzy but cheaper beer from us isn't lost on me.
Oh and you can get a pint for £4.50 in our taproom, which like at any venue includes the not insignificant costs of excise duty and VAT. There really isn't a craft premium being extracted!
CH1
"Red Guard"(NLYL)
I think what we would like to know is this: is the pricing policy decided by you or by Mr van Esch? Or are you indeed Mr van Esch?
editor
hiraethified
Actually, I'm all for prices that are affordable for the people living in the neighborhood (and not just the well-heeled incomers), and all workers getting fair wages, not just the legal/required minimum.
But are you equating successful living wage companies = expensive goods? If that is the case, maybe the bosses shouldn't pay themselves so much: Minimum wage rises 'hit profits, not jobs'
How much has Heineken sunk into your 'independent' company, btw?
T & P
|-o-| (-o-) |-o-|
They also sell pints under a fiver, Editor, so I'm not sure judging them on their affordability by their most expensive beer only is a very convincing or fair standpoint. Incidentally, most venues in Brixton including some of those you mention in your post also sell not-exactly-affordable pints of beer for well above £5 iirc, or even 33cl bottles for a fiver. I myself would describe the latter as shockingly expensive, but so long as cheaper alternatives are also available, the affordability argument hasn't got much legs.
editor
hiraethified
Who are you talking about?
jezg
Well-Known Member
Us!
jezg
Well-Known Member
Like I said in my original post we(BB) only set the wholesale price not the retail price(except that of £4.50 in our taproom).
Both of these have been set totally independently by us and indeed the former hasn't changed in a number of years, I.e. before our partnership with Heineken. Without it though it would certainly have to have been increased in order for us to survive but a bigger brewery has allowed us to partially offset the yearly cost increases and keep it static. It therefore compares favourably to other similar beers from other local (smaller) breweries.
P.s. I'm JezG(alaun) check my profile, it predates our partnership with Heineken and indeed the birth of Brixton Brewery.
Nothing to see here.
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
Sorry I don't follow.
I'm I Loughborough Junction and use Clarkshaws.
Clarkshaw prices seem to be the same as yours and they have stayed independent as a small brewer.
I would have thought teaming up with multinational would have meant lower prices.
In this case there is comparison with Ritzy. Picturehouse are part of Cineworld.
So Living Wage should be not related to prices as the overall owners are big company.
madolesance
Well-Known Member
Effra Social sell this beer for £3.40- Meet the Brewer
Makes me wonder why other cannot do the same.
jezg
Well-Known Member
Volden is a brewery owned and operated by Antic and brews for their pubs. The cost of producing a 3.8% session bitter are significantly lower than a US hopped higher abv keg beer. I also suspect they use this as a loss leader and make up the margin on the bar with other beers.
Cask also tends to be priced lower as it has a very limited shelf life once tapped so only works in busier venues.
jezg
Well-Known Member
To make cheaper beer you have to reduce costs through cheaper ingredients or massive economies of scale or cheap labour etc
You can't have your cake and eat it.
jezg
Well-Known Member
Sorry which prices are you comparing to Clarkshaws?
Also Heineken are not the overall owners, they have a 49% share.
editor
hiraethified
If Sky News bought 49% of this site, do you think I could still claim that it is truly independent?
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
My question was:
You said to editor that:
I asked what you meant by that.
I hope your not implying hypocrisy.
I guess from your reply your not implying that.
I take from your reply that if workers want wages that cover cost of living a decent life ( paying enough to cover basics and have some after work enjoyment) paying higher wages means higher prices for the workers.
One of the problems of Capitalism as a system is that it drives down wages to increase profit whilst expecting the workers to buy its products. The last post Thatcher / Reagan decades have meant the workers bargaining power has dramatically reduced. Government has had to step in. In this country the best thing Blair did was bring in minimum wage. The weakness of Labour meant government had to interfere in the market.
As wages in Western Economics have been suppressed in order to buy goods credit has increased. Credit has bridged the gap between low wages and the cost of living. Its one of the issues that capitalism causes. Public and private debt is a real issue for long term future of capitalism.
I'm not having a go at you personally. I also think its a good the company are paying living wage.
But given the overall way capitalism works I don't see a problem with asking for higher wages and cheaper goods.
On " you can't have your cake and eat it" - this worked for the Bankers. To save them the whole neo liberal rule book was chucked out the window.
The Bankers who caused the last economic crisis ( Wall Street and the City) who had been preaching unassailable logic of the market demanded and got cake.
So if the workers want higher wages and cheaper goods I don't think now that can be criticised.
Capitalism is about power. The workers over last thirty plus years since Thatcher have lost out whilst being told things like you can't have your cake and eat it. You should be grateful for having a job etc etc.
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jezg
Well-Known Member
If you mean Taproom By Brixton, it's CNTNR Ltd.
jezg
Well-Known Member
We've had this discussion in previous threads. FYI The Ratebeer website you linked to earlier is now owned by ABInbev via ZX Ventures. Prior to that it was quite biased against breweries with links to "BIG BEER" which might explain some of our reviews. Hard to say though and not sure about the community now.
BusLanes
Pedestrian
Thanks. Went there yesterday. Seemed ok
editor
hiraethified
Right. So the good reviews are straightforward, salt of the earth, honest opinions to be trusted, but the not so good ones are probably 'biased.' Gotcha.
CH1
"Red Guard"(NLYL)
This is useful to know. I wondered why the Ratebeer website now looks like an outpost of Facebook.
It did however tell me yesterday that the firm who make Sadlers White (which now seems to be a substitute for Blue Moon in the Beehive) also does own brand ales for Aldi.
Eek there's a picture of it here
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jezg
Well-Known Member
Possibly, like the "Shitty" view you have of our beer, that you then linked to the wrong beer which you likely haven't even tried recently. But then you also don't like hoppy beers so doesn't that make you biased?
Interesting read: RateBeer is Dead, Long Live Untappd — CraftBeerInSanDiego.com
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editor
hiraethified
I'm expressed my opinion on a (non profit, truly independent) board that was set up for, err, people to express their opinions, so I've no idea why you're getting your knickers in a twist.
That same beer gets more or less the average same score on most other sites too - around 3.7 - so I'm not sure why you're complaining about 'bias.' Maybe it simply isn't as great as you think it is, or you simply can't accept criticism?
jezg
Well-Known Member
Not getting anything in a twist, merely expressing my opinion that your original comment feels uninformed and unjustified and I'm entitled to defend us. I suspect if we were a "truly independent" brewery you wouldn't have made it using that language.
Re ratings only super hoppy and super strong beers(e.g. Impy stouts) tend to score "well". A good example of this is Keller Pils from Lost and Grounded. It's widely regarded as the best craft lager and one of the most finessed beers in the UK amongst experts but has a relatively low score simply because it's a lager.
To be honest I gave up looking at rating sites for the reasons I've tried to articulate, some time ago. I'd rather focus on creating beers and a business Brixton can be proud of.
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