Basic DIY questions?

[Zapp Brannigan]

Success!

Well... Mostly success. It works, anyway

I now have a light on the stairs again, but it turns on by putting the switch into the off position.
View attachment 448589

The left switch is for the hall light, and the right for the stairs. Both lights are on in the picture. And there's another switch for the stairs light at the top of the stairs, which also now has to be in an off position to switch the light on. I assume this is fine.

Is it fine?

And I also didn't quite manage to make it line up exactly with where the old switch was, but that's easy to sort out cosmetically. Minor stuff.

The main thing is, you made the wiring super easy, when at first it looked like a total muddle, to me. So many thank yous, a donation to the server fund on top of my regular, and a pint next time I see you! (I'll get one for you, as well! )

We have similar in our house, which feels wrong but is fine. Or at least I hope it is, otherwise you and I have got the same wiring slightly off.

Downstairs ON Upstairs ON - light on
Downstairs ON Upstairs OFF - light off
Downstairs OFF Upstairs OFF - light on
Downstairs OFF Upstairs ON - light off

 

[danski]

Success!

Well... Mostly success. It works, anyway

I now have a light on the stairs again, but it turns on by putting the switch into the off position.
View attachment 448589

The left switch is for the hall light, and the right for the stairs. Both lights are on in the picture. And there's another switch for the stairs light at the top of the stairs, which also now has to be in an off position to switch the light on. I assume this is fine.

Is it fine?

And I also didn't quite manage to make it line up exactly with where the old switch was, but that's easy to sort out cosmetically. Minor stuff.

The main thing is, you made the wiring super easy, when at first it looked like a total muddle, to me. So many thank yous, a donation to the server fund on top of my regular, and a pint next time I see you! (I'll get one for you, as well! )

Woohoo!

Glad it all worked out.

Maybe have a juggle with the pairs of switches (both stair, both hall) and see if you can get them to settle how you might like. As Zapp Brannigan shows, there are two possibilities for on and off.

Failing that, you can swap over wires in the switch but as it was like for like, it should work out

 

[WouldBe]

Success!

Well... Mostly success. It works, anyway

I now have a light on the stairs again, but it turns on by putting the switch into the off position.
View attachment 448589

The left switch is for the hall light, and the right for the stairs. Both lights are on in the picture. And there's another switch for the stairs light at the top of the stairs, which also now has to be in an off position to switch the light on. I assume this is fine.

Is it fine?

Yes it's fine. With 2 way switching you can get the 2 switches in opposite positions to get the lights to work.

I assume that the stair light is also 2 way or you wouldn't be able to turn them off from upstairs.

 

[Mation]

We have similar in our house, which feels wrong but is fine. Or at least I hope it is, otherwise you and I have got the same wiring slightly off.

Downstairs ON Upstairs ON - light on
Downstairs ON Upstairs OFF - light off
Downstairs OFF Upstairs OFF - light on
Downstairs OFF Upstairs ON - light off

Oh goodness! I didn't think to try all the permutations! (And was therefore wrong to assume they both had to be off for the light to be on )

So, mine goes:
Downstairs ON Upstairs ON - light off
Downstairs ON Upstairs OFF - light on
Downstairs OFF Upstairs OFF - light off
Downstairs OFF Upstairs ON - light on

 

[danski]

Success!

Well... Mostly success. It works, anyway

I now have a light on the stairs again, but it turns on by putting the switch into the off position.
View attachment 448589

The left switch is for the hall light, and the right for the stairs. Both lights are on in the picture. And there's another switch for the stairs light at the top of the stairs, which also now has to be in an off position to switch the light on. I assume this is fine.

Is it fine?

And I also didn't quite manage to make it line up exactly with where the old switch was, but that's easy to sort out cosmetically. Minor stuff.

The main thing is, you made the wiring super easy, when at first it looked like a total muddle, to me. So many thank yous, a donation to the server fund on top of my regular, and a pint next time I see you! (I'll get one for you, as well! )

So, turn off one stair switch (to the on position) then switch the other one to the on position. Light should be on, switches should be 'on'

 

[Mation]

Yes it's fine. With 2 way switching you can get the 2 switches in opposite positions to get the lights to work.

I assume that the stair light is also 2 way or you wouldn't be able to turn them off from upstairs.

I can't affect the hall light from upstairs; that switch only does the stair light.

 

[Zapp Brannigan]

Oh goodness! I didn't think to try all the permutations! (And was therefore wrong to assume they both had to be off for the light to be on )

So, mine goes:
Downstairs ON Upstairs ON - light off
Downstairs ON Upstairs OFF - light on
Downstairs OFF Upstairs OFF - light off
Downstairs OFF Upstairs ON - light on

Yours is the better way round - my tendency towards OCD (it's not OCD, I just like ordered things) would prefer to be able to have both switches off = light off!

 

[Mation]

So, turn off one stair switch (to the on position) then switch the other one to the on position. Light should be on, switches should be 'on'

Now I'm confused

I think I'm just going to have to see how it works in practice, as I can't keep the permutations in my head when thinking about whether I want to turn the light on or off from either the top or bottom of the stairs.

I can envisage myself having to run downstairs in the dark in order to turn the light on so I can walk down stairs in the light, having gone back up

 

[Mation]

Who'd have thought light switches could be so entertaining?

 

[danski]

Now I'm confused

I think I'm just going to have to see how it works in practice, as I can't keep the permutations in my head when thinking about whether I want to turn the light on or off from either the top or bottom of the stairs.

I can envisage myself having to run downstairs in the dark in order to turn the light on so I can walk down stairs in the light, having gone back up

Sorry, was referring to your pic and quote that both switches were off for the light to be on. However your subsequent post says different so I'm confused!!

 

[danski]

Who'd have thought light switches could be so entertaining?

Oh yeah, laugh a minute for thirty fucking years

 

[Mation]

Sorry, was referring to your pic and quote that both switches were off for the light to be on. However your subsequent post says different so I'm confused!!

Sorry! I must have been at the top of the stairs, with Downstairs ON Upstairs OFF, whilst assuming downstairs was also off. I was wrong, basically.

 

[WouldBe]

Now I'm confused

I think I'm just going to have to see how it works in practice, as I can't keep the permutations in my head

You don't need to. If the light is off flick the switch into the opposite position and it will come on.

 

[Crispy]

Now I'm confused

I think I'm just going to have to see how it works in practice, as I can't keep the permutations in my head when thinking about whether I want to turn the light on or off from either the top or bottom of the stairs.

I can envisage myself having to run downstairs in the dark in order to turn the light on so I can walk down stairs in the light, having gone back up

Now try and get a fox, a chicken and a bag of grain upstairs while leaving the lights off when you're done.

 

[Mation]

Now try and get a fox, a chicken and a bag of grain upstairs while leaving the lights off when you're done.

I had exactly that thought!

 

[existentialist]

Oh goodness! I didn't think to try all the permutations! (And was therefore wrong to assume they both had to be off for the light to be on )

So, mine goes:
Downstairs ON Upstairs ON - light off
Downstairs ON Upstairs OFF - light on
Downstairs OFF Upstairs OFF - light off
Downstairs OFF Upstairs ON - light on

In boolean logic, this is an Exclusive OR - the light will only be on if the switches are in a different state or to each other, so one switch will always be off for the lights to be on.

 

[Mation]

In boolean logic, this is an Exclusive OR - the light will only be on if the switches are in a different state or to each other, so one switch will always be off for the lights to be on.

So it is. I was just expecting it to be an AND for on

 

[existentialist]

So it is. I was just expecting it to be an AND for on

That would be annoying, as if the light was off at the upstairs switch and you were downstairs, you'd have to scurry upstairs to turn it on

 

[Mation]

That would be annoying, as if the light was off at the upstairs switch and you were downstairs, you'd have to scurry upstairs to turn it on

Yikes! You're right!

I can't remember what it did before, then. I'm (increasingly less) sure I'd have noticed the downstairs double switch ever turned the light on in the off position, especially as the current setup seems different

I mean, it doesn't matter, as it works...

Changing the position of one switch couldn't have changed the position of the other automatically, could it?

(Feeling very stupid right now )

 

[danski]

If you really want it to work the other way, you just need to swap the 1 way and 2way connections over for that switch, although it would be easier to do at the top of the stairs as there will should only be a single cable in each terminal

 

[Mation]

If you really want it to work the other way, you just need to swap the 1 way and 2way connections over for that switch, although it would be easier to do at the top of the stairs as there will should only be a single cable in each terminal

I think it's probably best if I leave well alone. However, which other way do you mean?

 

[Zapp Brannigan]

I think it's probably best if I leave well alone. However, which other way do you mean?

It's either:
(A) Both switches the same = light on;
Both switches different = light off; or:
(B) Both switches the same = light off;
Both switches different = light on

 

[danski]

Wot he said ^

 

[Mation]

It's either:
(A) Both switches the same = light on;
Both switches different = light off; or:
(B) Both switches the same = light off;
Both switches different = light on

Right. Thank you!

It must have been (A) before, and I just didn't notice.

 

[Crispy]

my hallway lights are Turing complete

 

[MrsArcanum]

Woohoo!

Glad it all worked out.

Maybe have a juggle with the pairs of switches (both stair, both hall) and see if you can get them to settle how you might like. As Zapp Brannigan shows, there are two possibilities for on and off.

Failing that, you can swap over wires in the switch but as it was like for like, it should work out

Did this with our hall lights until the left hand switch was correct (down for on), and the right hand switch (landing) was pot luck as the landing light is a single switch upstairs.

 

[Mation]

Did this with our hall lights until the left hand switch was correct (down for on), and the right hand switch (landing) was pot luck as the landing light is a single switch upstairs.

Yes, I've only got a single switch upstairs, for the stair light. I missed the reference to pairs of switches

Downstairs is two doubles. Loo & hall; and hall & stairs.

This is fun

 

[teuchter]

With two way switches there's no such thing as "off" and "on" as far as the individual switches are concerned, only "up" and "down".

If you mount the switches sideways then this is changed to "left" and "right" neither of which have an "off" or "on" association and there need not be any OCD trouble.

 

[Epona]

If you mount the switches sideways then this is changed to "left" and "right" neither of which have an "off" or "on" association and there need not be any OCD trouble.

How to say you don't have OCD without saying you don't have OCD

 

[WouldBe]

With two way switches there's no such thing as "off" and "on" as far as the individual switches are concerned, only "up" and "down".

If you mount the switches sideways then this is changed to "left" and "right" neither of which have an "off" or "on" association and there need not be any OCD trouble.

Strictly speaking with a 2 way switch there is no 'off' position as the common is connected to either the 1w or 2w position.