Are Black kids to blame for street robbery?

[hatboy]

Mmm, speaking as a moderator here, as someone who's only posted twice Billy Joe I think you should mind your manners abit until you get to know people. Maybe it was abit pompous of Paul to say "my island" but if this thread turns into rants slagging off Jamaica or Jamaicans that won't be welcome.

It is completely unjust to accuse Paul of "stiring up racial hatred here". My instinct is that may be more your agenda but we'll see.

By all means debate the relative merits or faults of Britain and Jamaica, but with civility.

 

[Billy joe]

Originally posted by hatboy
I think you should mind your manners abit until you get to know people.

So do I have to invite him round for tea and become his buddy before I can post an opinion on what he is typing ?
I've seen enough of him on the press to form an opinion on him.

Originally posted by hatboy
"stiring up racial hatred here". My instinct is that may be more your agenda but we'll see.

But on the other hand, We've never met but you believe I am a racist and feel its alright to print that on the basis of one post ?

 

[hatboy]

I don't think you're a racist (although I did think as I said that "may" be where you were coming from), but your initial post above is quite aggressive. And yes it would be good net-etiquette not to be abusive, especially when you've just arrived.

Can you try and do that please and then you will be welcome

 

[paul boateng]

Mr Billy Joe, yes it's my island is a an expression, if you have a problem with that then that's your's my friend.
I've lived in Jamaica, and iwas born in the uk, have a problem with immigration do you? Jamaicans flitting between Uk and Yard?
Or do you work for HM customs?

I think youre the one stirring up racial hatred with your Bernard Manning Jim Davidson "fuck off back to where you come from attitude".

This thread was about black youth and crime, or in my opinion the myth of black criminality. I expressed my opinions as a person born in UK but has lived in Jamaica, which as far as aware not many on these boards have done.

No PJ did not give me the island God gave to all who live, come from there.

And finally i dont want to come for tea. I dont fancy myself sharing a table with John Tyndall, Edgar and Nick Griffin, Stan Boardman, Bernard Manning, David Duke, George Rockwell, Ian Duncan Smith, John Townend, and Jimmy Tarbuck.

The sky is blue

 

[hatboy]

I've just realised something. LOL. Billy joe said "I've seen enough of him on the press". Doh, it's not the cabinet minister, Billy, just someone who's adopted the name for use here. Not that the real Paul Boateng goes around "stiring race hatred" either.

 

[paul boateng]

You get me hatboy

 

[Billy joe]

Originally posted by hatboy
Doh, it's not the cabinet minister, Billy, just someone who's adopted the name for use here.

Oppps, sorry I didn't realise.
Who'd have thought it, two paul Boetangs who both seem to be up their own arses. Blimey what sort of coincidence is that ?

 

[Mrs Magpie]

You are an unpleasant little boy aren't you?......didn't your Mother teach you how to behave when you visit a new place?........

 

[rumble]

I would have liked to heard Paul Boatengs response to the reports in 'Home World News' especially things like:

Somewhere between six and 15 men are lynched in Jamaica's cities every year simply for being gay, estimates Linden. Such

In fact he says

First thing Jamaica is not a violent society

The text in HWN makes for appalling reading and paints a portrait of a violent and homophobic country

 

[paul boateng]

Why do you want me to respond to that?

 

[paul boateng]

As far as I was aware this thread is about are black kids to blame for crime within the uk. Black kids come from more than one place and i was stating i was getting vex with this obsession with Jamaica. In that report does it state how many art galleries and performance spaces in Kingston, that the National Dance Theatre is one the top dance troupes, or that Jamaica has more churches per head than anywhere in the world? Or how Jamaican soldiers fighting for the British were interned and many never returned and instead chose Cuba or that Island Records could have made a positive economic impact on the island rather than rip off the artists, or that Marley is still one of the greatest performer ever?

On the question on oppression on groups does it compare Jamaica with UK in terms of hate crimes?

How many gay men were killed in the UK last year? How many Blacks?

And does it state that not alll Black people come from Jamaica?

News Agencies will telll you the news they want to give you for the reasons they want to give it.

When people in power talk about Black crime, what are they saying it for?

I'll take them seriously when they stop using these terms.

 

[paul boateng]

Billy Joe are you lonely? If you are it's okay we'll understand

 

[Spud Murphy III]

If 'black people' want to talk about issues they feel concern them, that's up to them, IMO.

It's a different matter if 'white people' want to stand on high and pontificate about the same subject - nearly always from a position of ignorance.

How would Billy Joe and others feel if Paul Boateng wanted to start a debate along the lines of:

White men - why are so many of them paedophiles, flashers, and serial killers?

What's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.

 

[hatboy]

Paul - I guess the reason the article I posted doesn't discuss positves about Jamaica (some of which you have mentioned) is because it is an article about Jamaica and homophobia. I put it up however, just for information, not with malice and definitely not because I expected you to be answerable for it. It does seem to me however, partly from what Jamaican gay and straight men have told me, that there are easier places to be gay than Jamaica. To say the least.

That aside, I don't personally have an axe to grind on this. Quite the opposite. I often find myself explaining to ignorant white people that "no, of course not all Jamaicans are homophobic". So I won't be pursuing this subject here, especially as this thread has gone right off topic anyway.

If this thread descends in to racist abuse people who do it will be banned.

 

[Billy joe]

Originally posted by paul boateng
As far as I was aware this thread is about are black kids to blame for crime within the uk.

I thought that too Paul,

But then you posted this--->

Originally posted by paul boateng
strange why the dibble arent debating 'white boy' crime.

Wonder why that is?

So, is it okay for you to stray off topic but not anybody else ?

 

[paul boateng]

Point taken Hatboy...

Spud I hope we're in agreement too??

Billy Joe I have to say you're in total agreement with me. The use of what I said was nothing but a touch of genius...Well done you've past so far, not see if you get to the next level.

A man in a blue uniform will meet you outside the third telephone box as you walk eastwards down Acre Lane at 13.07 exactly on thursday the 27th of june.

He will hand you a book on the issues and mythology of 'Black' crime.
You will leave in an unmarked car facing northwest, you will be blindfolded. They will drop at a place you have never been before
all i can say it is near victoria. You will read this book digest it then come up with a new thread on ethnicity and crime by no later than friday the 28th of july 15.09.

If you or any of your colleagues are captured by the enemy, we will deny any knowledge of this operation.

This message will not self destruct as it has to stay on the board.

 

[hatboy]

Er, but Paul's comment above WAS exactly on topic, which I took to be crime and it's links (or lack of them) to ethnicity. We're all "ethnic" whether black or white or green, so asking about dibble and "white crime" is the same subject.

If you read back through this thread (anybody who's interested) it would seem that it's been pretty comprehensively covered anyhow now.

 

[pooka]

"If you read back through this thread (anybody who's interested) it would seem that it's been pretty comprehensively covered anyhow now"

Too true Hatboy, if this were a program it would be time to write something along the lines of
I=I+1
GOTO FSTPST

(sorry, FORTRAN origins - and age- showing)

 

[William of Walworth]

Eyes out, racists about ....

I wonder why rumble is so concerned about homophobia in Jamaica, or rather he isn't concerned in the slightest and I don't wonder at all why he posted that post ... another rare visit by U75's resident racist to the Brixton board ...

Spot on with the gentle moderation hatboy and Mrs M. Keep on keeping an eye out for them, I'm sure you are ....

 

[rhoobarb]

"Though the Black community should be prominant and take the lead in these debates it is wrong to think this is simply some kind of "black" problem, in that we all live in this country, all are affected by crime to a greater or lesser degreeand it will require the involvement of all sections of society in order to effect any change"

dunno who wrote this bit...couldn't read all of it too much, all the slagging off + point by point critique

From my point of view, crime is a general problem in societies and families have a lot of responsibility. The problems in the black community should be sorted out by the black community, taking responsibility as they are with the meetings, black policing (Trident etc) with some external support but I really do not think liberals or right wingers turning up to contribute their theories of black kids is gonna help, hasnt so far...

 

[rumble]

Wow, .., to see you nice! Some Brixtonians came a' calling so I thought I'd repay the compliment.

I fond talk of 'batty boys' and much else of Jamaican patois that has established itself in the venacular rather irritating. It would seem that they also walk the walk in Jamaica if the lynchings are to be believed. We may also feel other reverberations from that place in the way of drug-smuggling and gun-crime. I hope our officials are watching over us.

Keep on keeping an eye out for them, I'm sure you are ....

WoW are you the Brixton Threads equivalent of Neighbourhood Watch, a bit Daily Mail of you, I'd have thought

 

[hatboy]

Why is "battyboy" irritating? Surely it's just another word for homosexual originating somewhere other than Britiain. It's been/is being absorbed into vernacular/slang here just as faggot was from the US.

It's not what you say it's who's saying it and how. ie: whether someone calls me battyboy or queer cunt, it's how it's said that counts. Both could be an affectionate dig or an insult full of hate.

And yes William, without making some big deal out it, I am watching.

There are too many threads on the subject of race floating around on the boards lately IMO. Not that there's a limit, but I think many here would agree that if they get hijacked by people who want to goad people into arguing the case for not being racist the whole time that will be very tiresome.

 

[hatboy]

Oh yeah rumble, and another "legacy" we may be feeling from the West Indies is the broader range of music, literature, art, entertainment, er, basically, culture... that you get from opening up a rainy little island to immigrants. Anyhow, who's "we"? I presume you mean black, white and brown Britishers.

What do other people feel about this guy rumble? He's starting to piss me off.

While I'm on the subject, I wouldn't mind seeing abit more of a mix of people (more black people to be blunt) posting here. That would be a truer reflection of the Brixton population. I'm not criticising U75 - I've talked to Mike and if people wanna come here, they will. No big deal. What I would say is that I don't think black posters are gonna want to be confronted by a load of crap on the subject of race all the time, especially with what appears to be your thinly veiled subtext rumble. And especially since if your not white you have to deal with a low level of background racism most of the time.

Provided Mike is OK with this Im going to be arguing less and deleting more.

 

[pk]

NO!

NO NO NO NO NO !

No more fucking deleting posts!!!

There's enough of that elsewhere!

How else am I to find and fight trolls??

And deliberately deleting posts just to appease/attract the black community smacks of inverted racism to me.

Just let people be people - the boards will sort themselves out. Pruning the boards just so they are more to your liking... well.. I dunno.
Seems pointless to me.

 

[Mrs Magpie]

We don't make a habit of it erring on the side of caution, but some stuff gets deleted as soon as we see it....recent examples include bestiality images, a disturbing post about feeding someone drugs and raping them, spam, meaningless shouty gibberish in caps throughout....sometimes just a sentence gets blue-pencilled because of possible legal implications for the site......also, unless they get archived, all posts get deleted eventually....it's just some go sooner than the poster anticipated.......
The bottom line is to keep this site untrashed by trolls and fuckwits..........until I came across U75, bulletin boards that I saw were full of complete rubbish and the written equivilent of used arse-wipes.....therefore apart from a very obscure botanists board, this is the only site I have posted on....didn't want to waste my time with any others......

 

[hatboy]

I'm not trying to appease, PK. If the place was a predominantly black board and it started to fill up with snide comments on white people I'd feel the same - Bored.

It's not that serious yet. I just wanted to get that off my chest. In Brixton at least alot of people are beyond constant talk about what race we all are.

Now where were we?

 

[William of Walworth]

There are too many threads on the subject of race floating around on the boards lately IMO. Not that there's a limit, but I think many here would agree that if they get hijacked by people who want to goad people into arguing the case for not being racist the whole time that will be very tiresome.

I agree with this entirely ... and that's it from me for now .... may add more to the substantive debate if anything interesting/new/relevant comes up in this thread on crime and whether race has any relevance to it or not.

But loads of connected issues have had a pretty good airing in this thread most of which has been well debated I think.

 

[Balbi]

Epic thread necromancy

And for some reason, I appear to have rez'd it. Except it turned up on page 1 for me when I was logged out. Logged in, still here.

Odd.

 

[stuff_it]

If it is the case that the figure is 1 in 4, then there is a question to be answered given that across the UK, about 5% of the population are categories as belonging to "ethnic communities", which includes afro-carribean, asian etc. I recall that about two years ago the Met issued figures that there was a disproportionate number of young black kids nicked for robberies. There was an outcry against it initially. But if there is an issue then it has to be addressed, in fairness to the kids themselves as much as anyone else. And that should be done in a cross community non-racist fashion.
Asking the question need not be racist, indeed failing to may well be, in an inverted sort of way.

We do know that crime is associated with:

Young men;
Low educational achievements;
Unemployemnt;

And we know that young black people suffer disproportionately from the latter two. And that the alienation that breeds has, for some, contributed to the development of a "gangsta culture".

If recognising the symptoms honestly leads to addressing the causes, then it should be faced up to.

That's across the UK though - in cities it's a far higher percentage, many major cities have or nearly have over 50% non-white. Oh wait, that would mean that if the other three of the four were white that kids with an ethnic background were less likely to commit crime.

There will always be a disproportionate about of black kids nicked for crimes by the Met anyway as they are very much institutionally racist as has been shown on many occasions.

 

[Firky]

That's across the UK though - in cities it's a far higher percentage, many major cities have or nearly have over 50% non-white. Oh wait, that would mean that if the other three of the four were white that kids with an ethnic background were less likely to commit crime.

There will always be a disproportionate about of black kids nicked for crimes by the Met anyway as they are very much institutionally racist as has been shown on many occasions.

That post you quoted is older than my mental age.