Alex Salmond accused (and then cleared) of sexual misconduct.

[danny la rouge]

My sole concern is the avoidance of Tory rule. Independence is the only way.

Tory is a party label. I'm not interested in party politics. The New Labour project should have been warning enough that party labels are a red herring.

 

[Pickman's model]

My sole concern is the avoidance of Tory rule. Independence is the only way.

If that's your goal then move to North Korea. There'll never be Tories in power in North Korea.

 

[Border Reiver]

Tory is a party label. I'm not interested in party politics. The New Labour project should have been warning enough that party labels are a red herring.

But policies matter. Labels indicate policies. I am not an absolutist. I just want a non rightist government.

 

[Pickman's model]

But policies matter. Labels indicate policies. I am not an absolutist. I just want a non rightist government.

North Korea beckons, it seems to fit your stipulations

 

[danny la rouge]

But policies matter. Labels indicate policies. I am not an absolutist. I just want a non rightist government.

Which should be a good reason to be suspicious of the Alba Party. So far what have we seen from them? Bigotry and hate. I'm inclined to believe what I see.

 

[Border Reiver]

Which should be a good reason to be suspicious of the Alba Party. So far what have we seen from them? Bigotry and hate. I'm inclined to believe what I see.

PR limits extremism, especially minority views.

 

[Pickman's model]

PR limits extremism, especially minority views.

Does it? Have you ever heard of the NSDAP?

 

[danny la rouge]

PR limits extremism, especially minority views.

A) I suggest you look into history for a refutation of that view.
B) the current electoral system in Scotland isn’t PR.

 

[Pickman's model]

A) I suggest you look into history for a refutation of that view.
B) the current electoral system in Scotland isn’t PR.

He's so full of shit he has his own sewage treatment plant. He's one dog you could never hypnotise as there's only sawdust between his ears

 

[Border Reiver]

A) I suggest you look into history for a refutation of that view.
B) the current electoral system in Scotland isn’t PR.

It is as close to PR as is reasonably possible. Seats have equalled votes very closely in every election. Both OR and FPTP are liable to have problems with certain vote distributions.

 

[danny la rouge]

It is as close to PR as is reasonably possible. Seats have equalled votes very closely in every election. Both OR and FPTP are liable to have problems with certain vote distributions.

The notion of a “supermajority” is in itself a refutation of that view.

 

[Border Reiver]

The notion of a “supermajority” is in itself a refutation of that view.

No it is not. D'Hondt is the most resistant to accidental over representation. STV has more problems.

 

[Pickman's model]

No it is not. D'Hondt is the most resistant to accidental over representation. STV has more problems.

A clinician and a psephologist. How lucky we are to have you.

 

[danny la rouge]

No it is not. D'Hondt is the most resistant to accidental over representation. STV has more problems.

How could you get a pro Independence majority of more than 55% of the Parliament when the level of support for independence amongst voters is 55% if proportionality was automatic?

You're confusing Party label and political standpoints back and forth. I don’t blame you, that’s the story we’re fed by civil society. But it’s erroneous.

 

[Border Reiver]

How could you get a pro Independence majority of more than 55% of the Parliament when the level of support for independence amongst voters is 55% if proportionality was automatic?

You're confusing Party label and political standpoints back and forth. I don’t blame you, that’s the story we’re fed by civil society. But it’s erroneous.

That has not happened. D'Hondt is the most proportional system of PR.

 

[danny la rouge]

That has not happened. D'Hondt is the most proportional system of PR.

We technically have AMS+. But that’s not the issue here. I’m not interested in repeating myself or “vanquishing” you on a trivial side issue.

We have different points of view. Mine is - I’m not a nationalist, and I am concerned by the amorphous and bigoted populism of the Alba Party. And I don’t want them in Parliament. Any more than I want UKIP. That trumps Unionist/pro indy concerns for me.

 

[andysays]

Sounds like Border Reiver is getting into serious "the ends justify the means" territory here...

 

[Border Reiver]

Sounds like Border Reiver is getting into serious "the ends justify the means" territory here...

Only within the law (including recognition of civil disobedience as a tactic).

 

[Raheem]

It's worse than bigotry. Or, rather, it's bigotry and then on top of that it's a party created around one man's ego, with scruples neither here nor there. Salmond doesn't believe in anti-LGBT politics, but it's a small price to pay to get some ex-SNP morons on his mantelpiece. He'd sell his own grandmother, so he definitely doesn't give a shit about you.

 

[danny la rouge]

It's worse than bigotry. Or, rather, it's bigotry and then on top of that it's a party created around one man's ego, with scruples neither here nor there. Salmond doesn't believe in anti-LGBT politics, but it's a small price to pay to get some ex-SNP morons on his mantelpiece. He'd sell his own grandmother, so he definitely doesn't give a shit about you.

Yeah, that’s the populism element I’m getting at. Salmond is quite happy to make full use of the poisonous atmosphere that Stu “fake minister” Campbell has stoked up.

 

[gosub]

The poll as reported on Sky News suggests six seats for Alba, and several extra for Greens and SNP. But with d'Hondt, marginal results are notoriously unpredictable. Whatever it looks like the unionist parties take a big hit and there is a serious Indy majority.

Oh god more shoe gazing

 

[Border Reiver]

Oh god more shoe gazing

You mean political debate.

 

[danny la rouge]

Bravo.

 

[andysays]

Only within the law (including recognition of civil disobedience as a tactic).

No sign of any such qualification here

Well if you will the ends you must will the means...

 

[andysays]

Bravo.

The issue of whether the electorate could pronounce their name came up earlier, now it turns out the leader and three of his close associates can't even spell it...

 

[danny la rouge]

The issue of whether the electorate could pronounce their name came up earlier, now it turns out the leader and three of his close associates can't even spell it...

I have no preference for how they pronounce Abla.

 

[fishfinger]

I have no preference for how they pronounce Abla.

Isn't it baal?

 

[danny la rouge]

Isn't it baal?

You’re after, or just a good time.

 

[Wilf]

It's worse than bigotry. Or, rather, it's bigotry and then on top of that it's a party created around one man's ego, with scruples neither here nor there. Salmond doesn't believe in anti-LGBT politics, but it's a small price to pay to get some ex-SNP morons on his mantelpiece. He'd sell his own grandmother, so he definitely doesn't give a shit about you.

... and no surprise at all to see Sheridan joining.

 

[Fedayn]