Whats Psychology got to say about God

[frogwoman]

actual experimental research into the foundations of religious belief is fairly flimsy but lots of people are speculating on it in theory.. mostly from evolutionary psychology perspective as has been mentioned..

a summary of one approach here.


Pascal Boyer said a similar thing about the mechanisms except his conclusion was that belief in God was the by-product of other useful human traits..

for example, we have what might be called a hyperactive agency detection device.. the strong tendency to infer a conscious agent behind unexplained events.. it's a useful type of jumpiness to have.. you are more likely to live if you assume that rustle in the forest is a tiger rather than just the wind..

you end up applying the same reasoning to thunder etc.

this goes hand in hand with our strong teleological bias.. tendency to look for the reason behind everything.. great for figuring out that planting seeds leads to crops.. bit less effective when concluding that illness is caused by offending the ancestors.. but if you have the former cause and effect reasoning, it's likely you'll have a few superstitions too.

God ain't dead yet.. but we are working on it

Yeah but then you have to examine why it's so beneficial, and trying to explain religion by saying it "helps us to survive", and is simply some kind of animal reflex, misses the point IMO. why does it help us do this? simply because something can be explained in evolutionary terms, and the explanation be perfectly true, doesn't mean that it isn't like this for some other reason.

people who view science as a substitute for religion often have just as much faith in their own "theories" as any religious fundamentalist. and i don't buy the idea that science and religion are incompatible, because the explanations for religious belief don't rule out the possibility that that belief is correct, and the idea that the earth was created with the big bang, and that time and space have progressed to this point, seem to make the idea of us coming into being by accident extremely fucking illogical ...

the idea of an animal who has been conditioned, or has the instinct, to think that any rustling in the leaves must be something dangerous, is vastly different to believing that G-d created the universe. most theological conceptions of G-d don't just portray him as a designer, they portray him as acting today in the world as we know it. im not sure how you're making that leap of logic tbh ...

it is true that many people seek other explanations for the way the world is, and that's one of the reasons IMO why people turn to things like conspiracy theories, or an ideology such as marxism, neo-conservatism or national socialism that can apparently explain everything - because people need something to believe in . the problem with these is that they are narrow and usually extremely cynical and negative, and they don't take into account things such as the complexity of the world that we live in. they are not demanding either - all you have to do is believe to an extreme degree, without any other additional standards of behaviour or requirements to follow. i don't think they are a proper substitute.

 

[merlin wood]

Or possibly "What would I know from psychology? I'm an abstract concept invented by human beings in order to explain things they don't understand."

But then psychology was also invented by human beings in order to explain things they don't understand. And just as there quite a lot of different gods there are quite a lot of different psychologies.

Who knows? perhaps there are more things than are dreamt of in either any psychology or any theology.

 

[fela fan]

Well, I do think your views are inconsistent. But the problem is they're not really views, they're doctrine. And I reckon you've swallowed the doctrine whole.

Good post, but not quoting it all here. But this bit: i've actually not swallowed any doctrine mate, coz my thinking is my own. Maybe i've created my own doctrine, yes that is possible, although i disagree with even that. A writing message board is impossible to carry through discussions such as these with the full context. I'm sure you will agree with me that this kind of topic would bear a far more fruitful and complete discussion in the quickfire medium of the spoken word. I can talk about this sort of thing all night with mates where i am, and you know what: after having gone through the whole lot, everything just comes down to one thing, nothing matters. Satanism, God, bad, good, love, hate, it's all there and it's seemingly always going to be there. We are accidentally put on this planet, we do what we can, or we exist at barely levels above the animals we used to be, and then we die. We are totally insignificant.

I am against all doctrines, which is why i disagree with me having one. Everything i might say is not designed to tell others what to do, it is more of a report, an insight into one person's thinking in the world at this moment in time. People can then do what they want with my language and any message they interpret from it. It will piss some off, it might spark something good in others. Still others no doubt just ignore it when they see my name.

Everything is. Everything happens!

 

[fela fan]

God (as in a higher consciousness that has access to alll our individual consciousnesses) actually is needed, because if there is no God, the world you're delighting in is one of six billion competing egos, each thinking they're their own God, and trying to create/buy their own slice of heaven. (or do you manage it without money) And you think there won't be conflict, and you think one person's heaven won't be at the expense of someone else's.? ? ?

There are not six billion competing egos in my reading of it. Remember i reckoned there to be six billion and one. The one is the uniting force, call it God if you want. But that one ego, or more accurately one consciousness, is the bit that makes us human. This one consciousness has the ability to influence human behaviour positively much more than it actually does. It represents all the bits that are the same about humans, wherever they were born and whatever colour they may be or religion they have foisted on them. It can be seen in glimpses, eg during world cups, during natural disasters. It's when compassion and comradeship comes to the fore.

I absolutely wish to lay claim to my single consciousness that gives me my individuality, while at the same time paying my dues to the single one that unites me with my brothers and sisters around the world. My underlying point in this thread is that too many people (including myself formerly) pay too much dues to the single force/consciousness which impacts upon our own individuality which becomes subdued, buried, covered up, suppressed, whatever, to a greater degree than is spiritually or mentally healthy.

Now, if i read what i've just written, and i have done (!) i can see problems with it. It says what i want it to say, yet i can also see an interpretation that contradicts what i'm trying to say. Such is the limitation of language on in a written medium.

Let me try and sum up to clear up. We are two people, our own selves, and the person that society sees and judges. We have to take care of both of those in order to achieve harmony. But if we take care too much of our society self, then our very soul loses harmony.

As for your comments about money and poverty and poor people not having the luxury of even thinking about all this, agreed. And it rather confirms my point: they have little internal harmony. They're either trying to just exist, or they're conforming to expectations.

Relatively i'm a rich bastard, but instead of just concentrating on enriching myself, i've recognised that the only path to internal harmony is to love oneself and to love all others and to love nature. There is nothing else to life in my book. Just wake up and enjoy. Then die one day. The mountains and sea will shed not one tear for my passing:

we are all dots in the landscape of time. We are all nobodies. 'God' as he is painted certainly helps many people, but my ultimate point is that for those who got dealt a lucky enough hand, if we want to extract the maximum out of our lives, we need to achieve freedom. And that means poor old God has to cop it.

[and if i were the poor indian in your tale mate, then i'd not be thinking any of this. But i'm not him, and i could never become him]

 

[fela fan]

Psychologically I can understand the popularity of fela's views, particularly among westerners living the good life in Thailand and India. The view that everyone is their own God, and must take responsibility for their own life, allows one to be content, able to tolerate the spectacle of terrible poverty, and become immune to it, because, hey- it's all perfect really and everyone's on their own trip, and allows you to reject politics completely as a means for giving people a chance of freedom.

I'm afraid you've been rather too subjective there, and simply demonstrated your own ideas about such things. For a start are you aware of how many cynical 'ex-pats' there are out here?! How many who seem to complain more than back at home? I often wonder what the fuck they're doing in a country they've actually chosen to be in, yet complaining so much about. I do not think they're living the 'good life' at all. In fact i see many, and i know they're not.

Before i came to my views about God, i had lived for nearly 10 years in thailand. I was more than just content in that time, i had the time of my life. I never stopped thinking how lucky i was, and to grab all that luck while it lasted. And that was nothing to do with who or where God was.

As for the spectacle of terrible poverty, well i deal with that in my own particular way. Thailand has far far less than india where i don't think i could cope with it. Like i say, no-one on this forum could possibly know about me and my reaction to things that no comfortable human ever wishes to see.

I don't reject politics per se, if i did i'd not be on these forums. But i do reject politics as our default organising system. I want something else to replace it. I want an end to perpetual wars and empires. I believe humanity has it within itself to solve. I will keep fighting for the ideas to spread. It is hard, very hard, to get across the whole thing on a medium such as urban75. There is one thing that i fight against constantly in whatever tiny way i can, and that is the injustice that is everywhere. But one has to temper that fight over the years or you would lose your health. For example, in the first half of the 90s i fought a lot over the burmese situation. I felt that was a good way of balancing out my own extreme luck at finding a great life for myself. But if invested the same emotional energy now, i'd be lost.

I think a lot people here are in no way on a trip thinking things are perfect, ignoring all the poverty. In fact us 'farang' do fucking shedloads for the poor in this country. You really couldn't be more wrong mate, at least about thailand.

As for your indian man and his look of total bitterness at the rich plump westerners, how can you be so sure that he was bitter? On what basis were you able to conclude this? I ask the questions for good reason.

 

[fela fan]

Those like hitler, the bad people, the people who set out to destroy others, there is one common thing about them: however many people they destroy they first destroyed themselves. That is 'God's' punishment for them.

 

[fela fan]

I can't see the 'arrogance' to be honest. I think there's a certain humility in recognising that, no matter what you do or who you are, even if you're Hitler, you are no worse, or even better than anyone else

No better or no worse than anyone. Respect beggars and kings alike. We can attach whatever language we want to this attitude, but wars will stop if this became the default way of our life. Personally i subscribe to this way of living, hence my healthy disrespect for those that think they have power over me. And hence my dropping of power that's been accorded to me by some in this life. Empower yourself, but never at the expense of others.

It's interesting how this thread has progressed, because to me it keeps coming back to niksativa's first question, that of the role of the ego. It definitely is very tied up with this God chappy.

 

[Sid's Snake]

Psychologically I can understand the popularity of fela's views, particularly among westerners living the good life in Thailand and India. The view that everyone is their own God, and must take responsibility for their own life, allows one to be content, able to tolerate the spectacle of terrible poverty, and become immune to it, because, hey- it's all perfect really and everyone's on their own trip, and allows you to reject politics completely as a means for giving people a chance of freedom.

My own experience has been absolutely the contrary.

 

[Structaural]

I think that if you know there is someone out there who you know has given you the freedom to make your own decisions, and someone who wants you to be decent and good to other people and respect yourself, who you really don't have an excuse not to listen to, then you have a good reason to act in that way ...

Aren't they called 'your parents'?

I don't think we can all be G-d because we are not perfect, we are only human. There are loads of contradictions in that attitude, because it's all very well saying "oh we're all G-d," but then it also absolves you of moral responsibility, because you regard yourself like that, it means that you have the power to determine your own morality if that makes any sense and decide what's right, and what isn't ... if you think you are that higher being or that you take the place of G-d then you're not really accountable to anyone except yourself .

If you were perfect - how would you know?

You're actually getting somewhere here - you ARE absolved of moral responsiblity if you so choose and you do have the power to choose for yourself what is right and wrong for yourself. You are really accountable and responsible only to yourself (unless of course you choose to transgress the cultural laws of the society in which you live). If a god exists then 'he' doesn't really give a fig what you do. That's hubris.
The idea that you are god has a lot more power than spending your whole life trying to please some invisible 'father figure', who may or may not exist.

it's true that G-d created us in his image and so we have to become as much like he is, as possible, and that essentially means to live up to the ideal that you described ... so maybe we're saying the same thing but in different ways

How do you know this is true? To accept with blind faith the words of two, three thousand year old literature as truth is rather silly. Children don't accept such tyranny from their parents why should you from priests as a fully grown adult?

 

[Structaural]

... but maybe some tips: say these to yourself, and if you mean it, then you can find!

I don't care about anything.
Whatever happens happens.
Nothing matters.
I am a nobody, and i want to be a nobody. I absolutely do not want to be a somebody.

I would suggest these affirmations would create as much false personality as those along the lines of: 'I am better than everyone else'. I would say the ego is your false personality (that part based in fear). Self-deprecation and martyrdom is as much a part of false personality as stubbornness, arrogance and impatience. They don't call it false humility for nothing.

I would say that 'god' is the True personality - or that part based in joy and love. This is barely glimpsed at generally and so the experience is often seen as 'religious'. ...To continue with this Gurdijefian thought the false personality sees this part as 'evil'....

 

[Structaural]

Shakyamuni Buddha was not "God, " or even "the Christ" in the way that Christianity thinks it. Shakyamuni was a Hindu Prince who became disatissfied with the existing practices of his religion.

He meditated constantly, observed the then current ascetic practices of dedicated Hindus, but decided they were insufficient to solve the great matter of birth and death and the extinction of suffering.

He decided to go it alone, adapting to his own style. He started to eat and drink in moderation but not to let up on what became an increasingly intensive meditation programme.

One day he sat under the Bodai tree and decided he would not rise until he was fully enlightened.

When he did rise, he had, Buddhists believe, experienced full enlightenment. And, necessarily, as Shakyamuni became enlightened, it penetrated throughout the cosmos. The whole world became enlightened with him as the cosmos pentrated him. Animals and birds, rocks and mountains.

Nothing was, afterwards, the same.

What your girlfriend may mean when she says 'up to buddha' is not "up to a diety in the sky," but up to the nature of the buddha that arose with the Buddha's enlightenment. A nature which had previously existed as potentiality in Shakyamuni himself, but which now extended beyond his body, as the earth became, in a way, the buddha's entire body exetended - mortal and immortal, limited in time and space, yet unlimited in time and space and inextinguishable.

Nice to see Buddhism has a load of ludicrous diety crap as well. We can't just have great teachers - they all got to have super powers... Once the teacher is dead it's just literature - usually written by a load of stars-in-their-eyes accolytes of the original teacher.
Enlightenment is an experience like any other, seek it and you'll have it. But it won't last....

 

[frogwoman]

Aren't they called 'your parents'?

No.

If you were perfect - how would you know?

Fair enough I guess, but "realising you're perfect" does sort of imply that you, well...realise ...

You're actually getting somewhere here - you ARE absolved of moral responsiblity if you so choose

so being able to opt out of taking responsibility for one's actions is somehow a good thing?

and you do have the power to choose for yourself what is right and wrong for yourself.

yeah, sure, but that's quite a different concept to implying that everyone should do that, and that one individual's morality isn't better or worse than another.

You are really accountable and responsible only to yourself (unless of course you choose to transgress the cultural laws of the society in which you live).

And you're responsible to other people, too.

I'm sorry, but this "cultural laws" stuff is just bollocks. There is a universal morality which is basically not to do anything which harms another person, and obviously some people's morality doesn't work that way. sometimes the laws of society don't work that way either, because the people who make them are immoral and only care about making money or holding onto power. you're saying that the only reason why things are right and wrong is because of "culture", which is obviously not true. if you lived in a culture that promoted female circumcision, and you refused to let this happen to you, or your child, would you be doing something wrong? or what about if you lived in a culture where some people were suspected of being witches, and you actually protected one of these people in your house? i mean, you'd really be transgressing the cultural laws then, they might even think that you were trying to harm them by helping this person.

cultural relativism is really one of my pet hates.

If a god exists then 'he' doesn't really give a fig what you do. That's hubris.

But if you're only accountable to yourself you don't really have a reason to give a shit either, unless you're doing something that doesn't really benefit you. and sometimes the right thing to do is something that will harm you as a person, that nobody will understand why you did it, and it might make people hate you, you might suffer all sorts of consequences. and sometimes people give their lives in order to do what's right.

The idea that you are god has a lot more power than spending your whole life trying to please some invisible 'father figure', who may or may not exist.

look mate to be honest you're coming over as a bit of a twat here. i know that's not your intention, and maybe i am too, but i really don't have a problem with your beliefs. seriously. i dont care what you believe, as long as you're a nice person it's fine.

i have had experiences that confirm to me that G-d exists. fair enough - you don't believe in it. i don't know why you don't, but you don't, and that's fine.

and as I've said before I don't have an oedipus complex or anything, and i don't view G-d as some kind of substitute for my parents, and i find that pretty insulting, tbh.

How do you know this is true? To accept with blind faith the words of two, three thousand year old literature as truth is rather silly.

I don't "accept it with blind faith". there are a lot of things in the torah and the bible which aren't literally true or may have even been added for political reasons. some of them might not apply now, but applied in the context of the time. i know this. you have to interpret the text for every generation, and that doesn't mean rewriting it, it just means trying to apply the words in a way which people can understand as life is vastly different now than how it was in the bible.

Children don't accept such tyranny from their parents why should you from priests as a fully grown adult?

"Priests" LOL. believe it or not, i don't agree with everything my rabbi says. i think about things for myself. i actually CHOOSE to believe this - my parents are atheists, i was brought up not to believe in anything. it's what I actually want to do, it's how I want to live my life, so I don't see it as "tyranny". and i happen to enjoy it and get a lot out of it.

 

[frogwoman]

Those like hitler, the bad people, the people who set out to destroy others, there is one common thing about them: however many people they destroy they first destroyed themselves. That is 'God's' punishment for them.

I agree with you.

 

[ZWord]

hmm, fela, it's difficult to know what to say now, i can't organise a response to everything you've said, as you've said so much.

Satanism.. Could be too strong a word, but, actually it's not too different from something someone posted about satanism a while ago. But maybe what I was thinking of was some parallels with a variety of christianity popular in the US called prosperity theology. you become christian, get to know god, and then God blesses you by making you make lots of money, and if you don't make lots of money, well then obviously God doesn't like you very much.

Six billion or six billion and one, seems quite a crucial difference, but if you want to kill off the One, then you're left with six billion, and if you don't kill off the one, then it seems to me you're left with the fairly traditional One God, and six billion aspects, which sounds about right to me.

Nothing really matters? anyone can see? last lines of bohemian rhapsody, Well, I wish I knew whether this is true or not.

With regard to the bitterness on the face of the indian. Of course I don't know if what I saw reflected what was actually happening or was just my projection. I myself, in the time I was in India, was just as bad as anyone else, as far as exploiting and disrespecting indians was concerned, it's something you get used to after a while. But I did have an interesting experience once, following an insane episode where I threw away my money and passport, - they were looked after by an indian guy, "until I was in my right mind again." and suddenly found that I was offered a place to live for the winter, and then weirder still, found in a place far down the valley, that I wasn't charged for the rizlas I wanted. Which was very odd, and kind of evidence of an indian grapevine.

On the one hand, you have people saying, "money's just an energy like any other, - it comes it goes. " and on the other there's the view point, that money is a deeply destructive and exploitative energy. Nonetheless, it's one that most of humanity is addicted to, or cannot live without. Personally, I think it's true that every time you enjoy yourself using money, to some extent, you do so at someone' else's expense, you contribute to the suffering of many people. Whether the best response to this, is to frankly admit that what you're doing is wrong, but you don't see any alternative, or whether it's better to not feel guilt about it and think that your first responsibility is to your individual self, I don't know. And I don't know whether it matters.

But I tend to think that the original divide among the wise was between those who always thought or knew that everything was perfect, and nothing mattered, and lived in Tibet, to rise above the noise of the suffering of the world, and one who couldn't rise above the noise but wanted to transform it into something beautiful, incarnated in a dark place in a dark time, and is also known as the renegade master.

 

[fela fan]

I would suggest these affirmations would create as much false personality as those along the lines of: 'I am better than everyone else'. I would say the ego is your false personality (that part based in fear). Self-deprecation and martyrdom is as much a part of false personality as stubbornness, arrogance and impatience. They don't call it false humility for nothing.

I would say that 'god' is the True personality - or that part based in joy and love. This is barely glimpsed at generally and so the experience is often seen as 'religious'. ...To continue with this Gurdijefian thought the false personality sees this part as 'evil'....

They weren't affirmations. They were words trying to describe the fact that the world is so much bigger than an individual human being. And that we are insignificant when taking the world into account. A spot i get to a few times a year has nothing but mountains in view, 360 degrees. As far as the eye can see. No humans, no human noise. I often think that if, say, blair was put there for a week, he'd be totally insignificant, and nobody would give a monkeys about him. That is as it should be, but it can only be seen/understood by relating our world (the human world) to the world of nature.

We are nothing, and our own egos are pathetic. All that jumped-up puffed-up importance! All hot air.

Nothing false mate, not even about humility, just about what is. Trying to be a somebody is the biggest waste of time we could embark upon in this life. Here today, gone tomorrow. What about that lad, can't remember his name now, y'know, the one who lived to 64, died, oh, not sure now, i think maybe 424 years ago, in his sleep i think...

 

[fela fan]

On the one hand, you have people saying, "money's just an energy like any other, - it comes it goes. " and on the other there's the view point, that money is a deeply destructive and exploitative energy. Nonetheless, it's one that most of humanity is addicted to, or cannot live without. Personally, I think it's true that every time you enjoy yourself using money, to some extent, you do so at someone' else's expense, you contribute to the suffering of many people. Whether the best response to this, is to frankly admit that what you're doing is wrong, but you don't see any alternative, or whether it's better to not feel guilt about it and think that your first responsibility is to your individual self, I don't know. And I don't know whether it matters.

Heh, now you raise another God, money! Yes, many are addicted to it, and that is another method to miss the miracle of life. So much insanity about!

I can sit and look at various views of nature around me, and that is my God. To me nature is life, it holds all the good-feelings one can have. The chase for money takes many a human down the wrong path. I can't tell you the amount of times i meet a north american or a british lad at any of my favourite spots in the north of thailand, and they tell me of their life back home, earning huge bucks, working insane hours, living the ultra-modern and 'successful' lifestyle, yet here they are with water and mountains all around, the sounds of nature, good company and chat, maybe a spliff or two, and they are making new plans for the next chapter in their lives.

For me money is needed just enough. Just enough is okay. But the real joy in life needs no money at all.

Interesting your story about being in india. I think thailand induces a different reaction to the newly-arrived. India is obviously 'spiritual', at least to the western mind, whereas thailand, and this is the joy of the place, just is. The people smile all the time, and that is a great default for life...

 

[fela fan]

I agree with you.

You know it's interesting. Your view of God, and mine, don't obviously coincide, at least not on the face of it.

But dig a bit deeper, and our views do coincide! Going beyond the God, we have a similar view that one should just do good and one's best in life to not harm others, or nature. But you believe in God, i say there is no God, not as we've been told down the years.

Try this one out: every time you write or think the word God, replace it with the word 'nature'. Let me know what happens frogw!!

 

[fela fan]

I would suggest these affirmations would create as much false personality as those along the lines of: 'I am better than everyone else'. I would say the ego is your false personality (that part based in fear). Self-deprecation and martyrdom is as much a part of false personality as stubbornness, arrogance and impatience. They don't call it false humility for nothing.

I've reread this. Are you saying that the ego is us? You say it is our 'false personality', yet i'd say that the ego is the part of us that is not us. Our ego can only exist with other people around. Our ego is society embedded in us. It is the reaction to all the other humans. Our ego is not us, nor is it false.

Nothing in life is false, it cannot be. Something is, or it is not. A lie is a lie, truth is truth, and neither are false.

 

[Sid's Snake]

fela

would you be interested in living together

I could send a photo As long as you promise not to go on so much I think it could be a relationship with legs.

anyway think about it

lots of love

Sid

 

[fela fan]

fela

would you be interested in living together

I could send a photo As long as you promise not to go on so much I think it could be a relationship with legs.

anyway think about it

lots of love

Sid

Sorry, already live with someone, and i greatly fear ssssnakes...

 

[Sid's Snake]

 

[Aldebaran]

PM me if you want this. I can't and don't wish to post it all

Your PM inbox is full.

If it the article is interesting maybe it would also be a good start for a thread.

salaam.

 

[Aldebaran]

Religous people are not adult yet.

Thank you for making us for-ever-young.

salaam.

 

[Aldebaran]

God stops people from taking full responsibility for their own lives and decisions.

You show to have no idea about Islam.

Freedom, the sort that exists at our very core, can only be achieved once we kill off God. On an individual basis, which of course has happened the world over, and humanity as a whole. When the latter happens, no more war. Free people don't fight.

What has God to do with freedom in hupman perspective, in your view?
It seems you think that what you perceive as "freedom" would prevent all humans who are ever born on this planet from doing what you would cinsider "evil". Can you give the reasons why nobody would even come to the idea to do something that could harm someone else.

The idea of God simply allows others to dominate others.

Since that what is commonly called "God" resides in the abstract, how do you see an abstract concept dominate what we perceive as reality?

Freedom means not submitting and not dominating. Free people don't blame others.

In my view you confuse the idea "freedom" with the idea "taking responsibility for your own actions".

salaam.

 

[Sid's Snake]

Mr Islam.

Can I ask you a bit about the afterlife?

Do you believe in it? What would you expect? If its not a rude question, what would you personally expect might happen to a suicide bomber in the afterlife.

Do you think he would be punished or rewarded

( feel free to ignore this )

 

[fela fan]

In my view you confuse the idea "freedom" with the idea "taking responsibility for your own actions".

salaam.

I'm not confusing that idea, that IS my idea. If you want full freedom, you have to take full responsibility for your own life. With God around, we can always blame him for what we do, or what happens to us.

Committing good in the name of God is what people do. So is committing evil. Just look at the amount of bad shit that happens in our world, all in the name of this religion or that religion.

Look at obl. Look at bush. Look at blair. All in the name of religion, and God.

We need religiousness to guide us in our lives, and we need to get rid of religions, aka dogmas, and God. Until that time, war and injustice will remain our constant guide in life.

 

[Aldebaran]

Mr Islam.

I'm not Islam, that is a concept and a religion. I practice Islam.

Do you believe in it? What would you expect? If its not a rude question, what would you personally expect might happen to a suicide bomber in the afterlife.
Do you think he would be punished or rewarded

I wouldn't be Muslim if I said I don't think there is an after-life.
I would be one very arrogant Muslim if I said to know what constitutes that after-life.
Some would anwer such a quesiton with: "It is being in the presence of God".
My personal idea about this is a situation of all-encompassing peace; the ability to be in complete balance and understanding of everything we struggle with as living human being and are unable to overcome or understand because of the inherent limitations of our human nature.

Suicide is prohibited in Islam. What happens afterwards is for Allah to decide. We believe that only God knows "what is in people's heart" meaning that no human can be in knowledge of the motives and thoughts of others.

( feel free to ignore this )

Why do you suppose I would be inclined to ignore your questions?

salaam.

 

[Aldebaran]

I'm not confusing that idea, that IS my idea. If you want full freedom, you have to take full responsibility for your own life. With God around, we can always blame him for what we do, or what happens to us.

in Islam every person has to accept full responsibility for his thoughts and actions, hence for his life.
How do you suppose a Muslim can "blame God" for anything?
If we could blame Allah for anything then it would be for the decision to create us since nobody asks to be born (let alone that anyone has a say about how he is born or where).
Yet that is a line of reasoning you won't hear from a normal Muslim.

Committing good in the name of God is what people do. So is committing evil. Just look at the amount of bad shit that happens in our world, all in the name of this religion or that religion.

No human can say or do anything "in the name of God" because of the simple, obvious fact that no human is God.
In your reasoning humans ARE God.
Hence in your reasoning humans are responsible for themselves and acting for themselves AS God.
So why do you seem to blame people wo don't claim to be God, yet nevertheless are that delusional about their own ego that they claim to speak or act in the name of God?
Surely you must admit that such people are not consistent in their beliefs, let alone in their reasoning.

You also should make distinction between God and religion. Religion is only a (social) practice of worshipping God.

We need religiousness to guide us in our lives, and we need to get rid of religions, aka dogmas, and God. Until that time, war and injustice will remain our constant guide in life.

In my reading of your posts you speak in contradictions.
Clearly there is no need for religiousness in the lives of those who do not want to be religious and no need for God in the lives of those who don't even believe God exists.
You also claim that no atheïst can ever do something evil, and that atheïsm is going to save the world from everything that goes wrong right now.
Where is your evidence? In my view reality speaks against you thus far.

salaam.

 

[Aldebaran]

Empower yourself, but never at the expense of others.

If you only drink one drop of water that is at the expense of others.

.../... the role of the ego. It definitely is very tied up with this God chappy.

How?

The one is the uniting force, call it God if you want. But that one ego, or more accurately one consciousness, is the bit that makes us human.

Non-human living beings are all conscious in their own way. It is not because humans don't understand or can't picture themselves the level of their consciousness that they have none.

In my view you mix up the patterns of social behaviour inherent to the evolutionary biology of the human species with consciousness.

salaam.

 

[Aldebaran]

I agree, there is nothing for us to achieve, and we are perfect if we just simply accept life and what it gives us, what it does to us, and who we happen to be.

How exactly does that make you perfect?
I learned very young and the hard way that there was nothing else to do then to accept life as it comes and to be who I was born to be and how I was born.
I wouldn't be that arrogant to claim that I am perfect only because I know this.

I will also add that once this kind of understanding has occurred, fear disappears. Especially the ultimate fear, that of death. Fear of death blocks the living of life.

Muslims who understand their religion are not afraid of death. I'm not. I am rather curious about it.

salaam.