Turning the clock back, teaching Latin in state schools

[RileyOBlimey]

The latest Tory initiative: Latin to be introduced at 40 state secondaries in England

So, a total refusal to teach the existing languages (Welsh, Scottish Gaelic, Cornish) but let’s teach the kids poorly what posh kids learn. Fuck sake.

 

[bellaozzydog]

afternoon tea, and fagging for the older boys

 

[JimW]

Teaching Latin to kids who want to learn would be great, doing it out of their own bullshit Rugby School theories, not so much.

 

[kalidarkone]

The latest Tory initiative: Latin to be introduced at 40 state secondaries in England

So, a total refusal to teach the existing languages (Welsh, Scottish Gaelic, Cornish) but let’s teach the kids poorly what posh kids learn. Fuck sake.

This is where a roll eye smiley would be handy. Totally agree with you.
I was taught Latin in a comprehensive in the 80's....but it had changed from a grammar the year I started- 1980.

Matella est in cubiculum.

 

[mx wcfc]

My daughter went to the local comp. They offered (and still offer) Latin GCSE, for a small number of kids with very pushy middle class parents, who couldn't quite afford St Edward VI fees, and thought it would help them get into Oxbridge. No, she didn't do it.

But, yeah, Tory bollocks trying to bring Latin back.

(Amo, amas, amat etc)

 

[marty21]

I was taught Latin at school , 1st 3 years of big school. I didn't see the point of it in the 70s , I don't see the point of it now .

 

[platinumsage]

Seems Latin is studied in the state schools of almost every European country, either compulsorily or as an option. The UK is the odd one out.

Instruction in Latin - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[weepiper]

I did 5 years of Latin at state high school in Scotland in the 90s. I quite liked it because the teacher was very engaging and I was quite into Romans and antiquity at that time. It was very useful in my degree (English and Celtic) because I knew all the terminology and because Latin obviously influenced English and all the Celtic languages.

 

[marty21]

The only legacy of my Latin years is that I use Roman numerals a lot .

 

[Pickman's model]

I think learning latin would be a good thing as Latin is the parent tongue of French, Spanish and Italian. So it'd make learning those languages easier and there's a great deal of interest written in Latin which is either rarely or never translated.

However, being as our schools basically teach to the test and often churn out pupils lacking the degree of knowledge you'd hope in more obviously core subjects like English, maths and history I don't think introducing a new subject is necessarily helpful atm

 

[Pickman's model]

The only legacy of my Latin years is that I use Roman numerals a lot .

Do you scrawl an X on your bar tab and stick up a v when asked to pay it?

 

[danny la rouge]

I did two years of Latin at my local state comprehensive in the 70s (ie I didn’t choose it for O Grade), and would support it being widely available. Not just because it will unlock cultural codes set by the privately schooled to keep the riff raff out (because of course they’ll just set other ones), but because it’s a useful foundation for those interested in European languages.

 

[Saul Goodman]

I was taught Latin at school , 1st 3 years of big school. I didn't see the point of it in the 70s , I don't see the point of it now .

Its only purpose is to allow middle-class kids to tell shit jokes that they think the plebs won't understand.

 

[Poot]

We did about 3 lessons of Latin in my shitty state comp and I absolutely loved it. Wish I could have done more, it was really interesting.

 

[mx wcfc]

I think learning latin would be a good thing as Latin is the parent tongue of French, Spanish and Italian. So it'd make learning those languages easier and there's a great deal of interest written in Latin which is either rarely or never translated.

I did Latin for 5 years and have an absolutely useless O level in it.

I'd rather have just learnt Spanish instead.

I did French to A level, and can't remember my Latin ever being any help in that.

But, yep, sure, I can sometimes guess what an Italian word means. Makes all the "bellum bellum bellorum" bollocks worthwhile.

 

[petee]

nihil esset melius quam linguam latinam discere.

 

[danny la rouge]

nihil esset melius quam linguam latinam discere.

Ecce in pictura est puella parva.

 

[petee]

Ecce in pictura est puella parva.

Grumio est ebrius!

 

[marty21]

Its only purpose is to allow middle-class kids to tell shit jokes that they think the plebs won't understand.

I'm from a working class family , but didn't pick up any Latin jokes then.

 

[krtek a houby]

What have the Romans ever done for us?

 

[oryx]

I did Latin for 5 years and have an absolutely useless O level in it.

I'd rather have just learnt Spanish instead.

I did French to A level, and can't remember my Latin ever being any help in that.

But, yep, sure, I can sometimes guess what an Italian word means. Makes all the "bellum bellum bellorum" bollocks worthwhile.

Pretty much this except I did Latin for about three years. All I can remember is 'Hic lectus sordidus est' from one of the textbooks where they have a family story with pictures.

I don't remember Latin being of any help in learning other languages. I'm trying to learn Italian at the moment and finding that knowing French is more useful.

 

[platinumsage]

Haec dies, stultus omnis lingua qualibet scribere potes, omnia instrumenta possunt per tetigit deprimendo.

 

[petee]

Its only purpose is to allow middle-class kids to tell shit jokes that they think the plebs won't understand.

i have some idea of how L&G were used to enforce class distinctions in england. my dissertation director was a graduate of King's School and Cambridge, and he was quite aware of his position. he told us that he personally knew people who were set passages of Thucydides to translate as part of an application, and if they did well enough, went into the Treasury. the CLC was an attempt to democritize the presentation of latin.

here in the states there's a nationwide network of catholic schools for whom latin isn't a class issue but considered fundamental if you're going to understand your religion. that's where i come from, an immigrant bus driver's kid who learned latin compulsorily next to the sons of trash collectors and millions of others similarly situated. yes it's taught in the private schools but it's not exclusive to upper class education so learning it hasn't that odor.

which will mean nothing to the tories who are using this proposal as part of a cultural propaganda campaign.

 

[petee]

I don't remember Latin being of any help in learning other languages.

i routinely use latin to illustrate spanish in my classes. the conjugation system, the verbal endings, even the sequence of tenses in spanish are basically latin with a few sound changes.

e2a i realize that response comes across a little strongly. you don't need latin to learn any other language but when i tell my students that by learning latin they're learning half a dozen other languages i'm not kidding. the closer you look, there more there is, except for the vocabulary, which in iberia was influenced by arabic, and in romania was influenced by slavic, ee.gg.

 

[DaveCinzano]

I'm from a working class family , but didn't pick up any Latin jokes then.

My dad gave me a Pig Latin joke to tell my teacher on the first day

 

[maomao]

I would only take Latin classes if they had native speaker teachers.

40 schools is not a lot. 'Classics' was one of the few subjects they were offering teacher training bursaries for in 21-22 so they reckon they've rustled together 40 Latin teachers and they wanted a story to keep the Telegraph readers happy.

 

[MickiQ]

Neither opposed nor in favour of it, if it's an optional subject and kids want to take it then fine but don't see a great deal of point in it being compulsory. Modern languages like Spanish are probably more use.
And certainly if there is spare dosh going then there is a lot more needs to be done on teaching maths and science before we invest effort in teaching kids a subject whose primary purpose seems to impressing the admissions officers at Oxford

 

[JuanTwoThree]

I think it might be a good idea at another time for other reasons but is almost certainly being done by oafish Tories for all the wrong ones. I'm willing to bet that the 40 schools will be chosen on some crap 'how will this help the Tories' basis.

 

[quimcunx]

I did a year of Latin in S2. Mostly to avoid domestic science.

 

[JimW]

Apollinaris, medicus Titi Imperatoris hic cacavit bene.