Jason West
New Member
Hardly if I'm suggesting take your holidays elsewhere. I happen to think the US entry laws will do very little to protect the USA, as I said above the bad guys aren't going to send people with arrest records.
Travelling from the UK to the USA with a criminal record
- Thread starter slish66
- Start date
Jason West
New Member
Or alternatively, you could just lie. Given that the US don't have access to the millions and millions of records of people who have ever been arrested in the UK.
But thanks for drawing everyone's attention to 'the monsters who want to hurt the US for no good reason'
'the monsters who want to hurt the US for no good reason' er, yeah possibly a little over dramatic.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Still don't think this is necessarily great advice.
Maybe if the arrest didn't result in conviction, or the conviction was for a relatively minor offence and/or is "spent". But anything that's likely to upset them I'd be inclined to declare and take my chances pleading my case with the Embassy.
If you get arrested while there for something relatively minor they could apply for (and get) your UK wrap sheet. You could end up getting banged up for falsely gaining entry. Insurance could be invalidated so if you have an accident or medical emergency you may be fucked. If you intend to hire a car, when you sign you declare that you're legally entitled to be in the country, so you'll be bullshitting there ... etc etc.
It's not just about gaining entry.
Jason West
New Member
The bit about 'arrested even without conviction' is more than unacceptable and serves no purpose.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
That's fair enough if you're prepared to take the risks. But at least make others aware of them if you're going to encourage them to do the same. If you don't get arrested, don't wreck a hire car, don't have a massive medical insurance claim ... etc, etc, you'll likely get away with it.
But people should be aware that making that false declaration is a criminal offence in itself, and could potentially turn relatively minor mishaps into proper U.S. bumfuck-jail time, when they do it.
1927
Funnier than he thinks he is.
I think its almost certain that they will be on the system. As always stated on these threads the only way they will know about minor coinvictions is if YOU tell them i.e by applying for a visa. failed visa applicaton means no entry, end of.
trashpony
Hag
Umm that simply isn't true. Like I said above, I've claimed on my medical insurance. It's very, very unlikely that they would check your UK record unless you were arrested for committing a crime.
Okay, I will change my advice to 'if you've committed a crime in the UK and you want to go to the US, you may not be able to get in if you've committed a crime of moral turpitude and declare it. If you don't declare it and then go to the US and commit another crime, then you will be in deep shit for lying in the first place.'
I still think you're being a pedantic git.
1927
Funnier than he thinks he is.
I think thats fair Trashy. I was advised that I should apply for a visa after my DUI, I took the opinion that it was not a crime of moral surpitude so I could answer honestly that I had not committed such a crime. Had I applied for a visa then I was disclosing information that US immigartion would never have found out had I not divulged it. As I keep saying on this type of thread people have to make their own decisions, it is not a black and white issue, but you take your own risks. On the other hand I think the chances of getting found out are very slim, there is no agreement between UK and US to share criminal record information and do people really believe that the US has a data base of every crime committed by every person in the world? The databases held within the US on their own residents are so large that they cannot even cross reference effectively. I have a friend living illegally in USA with a false National Insurance number who was always wary that he might have a knock on the door at any time. He was arrested for not having his dog on a leash one day and had to appear in court. Despite his strange accent no one picked up on fact he was an illegal, no cross referencing of immigration computer records. He then realised that the knock on the door was very unlikley to ever come. He was even on the local police benevolent committee.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Not quite. It's very highly likely that they would apply for (and receive - it can be done in a couple of hours-) your UK record if you were arrested for committing a crime. Regarding your medical insurance claims, as I said it's major claims that could cause a problem. Even in the UK insurance companies employ people to investigate major claims with a view to avoid coughing-up. The bigger the claim, the harder they dig. So whilst relatively minor claims are unlikely to cause problems, those running to larger amounts (perhaps involving third party damages, repatriation costs, or serious medical bills) may present potentially life-changing problems.
(My bold)
Where (*) = "or are involved in a host of other unlikely but possible scenarios", would be better.
Well when encouraging others to commit a criminal act that could have serious consequences, however unlikely, a degree of pedantry is warranted, IMO.
Jason West
New Member
The problem with the 'crime of moral turpitude' is vague to say the least as different states have differing ideas as to what a crime of moral turpitude is. For example o r a l s e x is on the list of crimes of moral turpitude, see here http://britishexpats.com/forum/showthread.php?t=559272 as o r a l s e x is illegal in some states in the US, where as in Florida Bestiality wasn't made illegal until October 2011. Still, it's a step too far by the Americans to ban people who were merely arrested and released without charge from entering the US. I was a witness to an 'incident' a few years ago where one person alleged she'd been assaulted by another, I was there and no physical contact between them took place at all, yet there was still an arrest made. After a while the case was dropped, no charge, no conviction, but that poor girl has a record of arrest, and she is 100% innocent. 'Arrested even without conviction' I can't help thinking that the USA is actually a covert theocracy, run by saintly naive fanatics.
superstains83
New Member
Criminal convictions,
16y/o shoplifting
17,18,19 y/o burgalry and car theft, and drugs possesion with intent to supply, criminal damage and intimadating a witnessy over 26 arrests in 3years finally sent to jail for 4years
23 and 24 y/o affray and assault
26 y/o theft from employer totalling 8000g
and most recent driving while band and leaving the scene of an accident
not proud of these i was a stupid kid that new wat was best and dint like ppl taking advantages as got older lol
point been iv been arrested and convicted more times than i care to remember, but iv been traveling to america mainly florida where i have family 3x times a year since i was 10, except when i was on hol at her majesties pleasure. even while on bail.
not once have i had any issues or problems while travelling on my own or with my family. i lie i lie and i lie, im probably on more databases than most but i stil lie.
but its your risk to take thats just my experience i thought id share
GOOD LUCK
16y/o shoplifting
17,18,19 y/o burgalry and car theft, and drugs possesion with intent to supply, criminal damage and intimadating a witnessy over 26 arrests in 3years finally sent to jail for 4years
23 and 24 y/o affray and assault
26 y/o theft from employer totalling 8000g
and most recent driving while band and leaving the scene of an accident
not proud of these i was a stupid kid that new wat was best and dint like ppl taking advantages as got older lol
point been iv been arrested and convicted more times than i care to remember, but iv been traveling to america mainly florida where i have family 3x times a year since i was 10, except when i was on hol at her majesties pleasure. even while on bail.
not once have i had any issues or problems while travelling on my own or with my family. i lie i lie and i lie, im probably on more databases than most but i stil lie.
but its your risk to take thats just my experience i thought id share
GOOD LUCK
gofasterstripes
New Member
I am just wondering if any of you that have a record have ever been taken for secondary inspection whilst travelling? I understand that they scan your passport through some more databases etc and am wondering if this has flagged stuff that might be held on the PNC....I would imagine it is more of a FBI/ US national / Watchlist type database but any stories of people with records getting flagged for a random secondary inspection and still getting through would be interesting.
trashpony
Hag
The answer is on the thread 
Oops - maybe it isn't. Anyway I was held up in 2ary immigration for two hours when I had been on holiday to Mexico because they thought I was working illegally (which I was). They never managed to find out where I worked, so eventually let me back in.
So I think you'll be fine. And sorry for not replying to the PMs, I'm a bit shit at them
Oops - maybe it isn't. Anyway I was held up in 2ary immigration for two hours when I had been on holiday to Mexico because they thought I was working illegally (which I was). They never managed to find out where I worked, so eventually let me back in.
So I think you'll be fine. And sorry for not replying to the PMs, I'm a bit shit at them
Hi evryone, i need a little bit of help, we booked a family holiday to florida last year and were going in 4 weeks, i have a criminal record for violent disorder, 6 years ago, was only 16 at time, anyway my mother was talking to a mate of hers a couple weeks ago and they told her i had to tell them tha iv got a criminal record, foolish of her shes gone through the processs of the police certificate and filling out all sorts of forms, they cant offer me an interview untill the day before i go so there be no chance ill get the visa, i was acceped with the other one, cant remember what its called, so was wondering if i should try my luck and see what happens, any help kindly appreciated, thankS
1927
Funnier than he thinks he is.
i suspect ya fucked to be honest., by filling out the formw yoru mum has basically alerted the US authorities to the fact that you are travelling and a have a criminal record, if she hadnt done that they wouldnt have known.
In your case I wouldnt risk travelling as I think its likely that you will be turned back,
editor
hiraethified
Just as an aside, I had an American singer-songwriter booked at my show a few years back. He got stopped at customs because he was carrying a guitar and some CDs of his stuff. They looked him up on the internet and found that he was listed as playing one free unpaid gig in Richmond (my free gig wasn't even listed) and the poor sod was sent straight home because he had come to "work." The reality was that he was on holiday and he thought playing a pub gig or two might be a treat.
I imagine UK musicians travelling to the US can expect the same.
I imagine UK musicians travelling to the US can expect the same.
1927
Funnier than he thinks he is.
You havent thought this through have you. If you try it and get turned back you will be banned from USA for atleast 10 yrs. You cant use being stupid as a defence, although I'm sure you'd be very convincing, as its a bit hard to say you didnt know you needed a visa when you have already applied for an interview!
To be honest i couldnt care about being banned from usa, im wondering weather i can phone the embassy and say iv cancelled the holiday, dont know what to do, id rather loose 100% off the money i paid and try get in the country than lose 90% and not try if you know what i mean
trashpony
Hag
No, I don't understand what you mean. What good would calling the embassy do?
If they've turned you down for a visa, they won't let you in. So you're going to be sitting on a plane for fucking hours and then turning round and coming straight home again. I suppose you'll get in flight movies and a couple of beers out of it
not-bono-ever
meh
Just as an aftethought - the ACPO have a sliding scale of items falling off their list - they will always be on for UK internal matters, but for things like Aus/US work permits and suchlike, once the period has passed, they will not divulge to anyone apparently ( unless yer a terrorist naturally ) - short of murder, 10/15 years should see you in the clear for these kind of record checks.
Also, as mentioned, the US does not have access to UK copper Databases - the ACPO have confimed this - unless soemthing signifcant happens in the near future, unless you are flagged on the US systems for whatever reason, its pretty unlikey they can find out.
I am not advocating lying obviously, but faced with a likely visa refusal vs winging it, I would statistically go for the latter.
Also, as mentioned, the US does not have access to UK copper Databases - the ACPO have confimed this - unless soemthing signifcant happens in the near future, unless you are flagged on the US systems for whatever reason, its pretty unlikey they can find out.
I am not advocating lying obviously, but faced with a likely visa refusal vs winging it, I would statistically go for the latter.
sjsub
New Member
My partner and I have booked a holiday to Florida with our 4 kids several weeks ago, at the time we booked we had no idea that if you have a criminal record you won't be let in, he has a drink drive charge on his record which is almost 6 years old now but one of his colleagues told him that he would have to apply for a visa through the US Embassy, and a few people since have told him that they tried to get in with drink drive charges they didn't declare and were picked up in the airport and sent straight home on the next flight, he decided not to risk it and in the past couple of weeks he's gone through every step that the Embassy told him to do, paying for the police report, etc, he had the interview with the Embassy last week and they told him they would be happy to grant him the visa as long as he passed a doctors medical, bearing in mind we live 150 miles from the Embassy, he then had to come home and make an appointment with the doctors office which is 100 yards from the Embassy and travel back to London yesterday, he assumed that a blood test would be taken to check for any alcohol in his blood, a blood test was taken but this was for the purpose of checking for any diseases he may carry (?) and then had an interview with the doctor having to state how much alcohol he consumes in a week, he told them truthfully that he doesn't drink through the week as he works long days, but likes to relax at home on the weekend with maybe 5 or 6 cans, based on this the doctor told him he may not be granted a visa now as this is classed as binge drinking and apparently when people binge drink they will do stupid things! So now we have to sit and wait for the Embassy's decision on whether they will give him the visa or not, granted he did a very stupid thing by getting drunk and driving home and getting caught, granted, he was out of order but he paid the price and hasn't gotten behind the wheel of a car drunk or got into a bit of trouble since, but all because he still enjoys a drink on weekends he is now a risk - who doesn't enjoy a good drink on weekends?? And this was almost 6 years ago.....I've never heard of such ridiculousness, they agreed that if he drank one or two cans per night and had at least 2 days alcohol free then this would be acceptable, where's the logic in that? I wish now we hadn't bothered as it's cost a small fortune overall (£270 for dr's appointment, $160 for the privilege of being interviewed by the Embassy, without the cost of travel, congestion charges, parking, etc) and we still may end up having to cancel the holiday and upsetting the kids, he's going for a family holiday not a lads binge drinking holiday where he'll be at risk of getting off his face and causing trouble in the streets of Florida, I just feel it's one big money making scam, and the basis on which they make their decision is not really justifiable. It does seem very unfair indeed.
Ted Striker
Foot's on the other hand
I've previously worked in US Medical Insurance (and Personal Accident, where the claim would arise as a bolt on to a travel policy), and this sounds like complete and utter bollocks (and nothing like what I've ever heard) tbf.
You don't even sound that convinced yourself
Ted Striker
Foot's on the other hand
sjsub
New Member
I know, thinking about it now he pretty much hanged himself on that, but there you go, can't back track on that now, and if he said he was completely tee total they would've sussed him as a complete bull shitter anyway!A bittbf.
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
I have a drink driving conviction and have arrived in the US numerous times pissed as a fart (the joys of business class flights) and no fucker has ever battered an eyelid, even landing in San Francisco where I was too smashed to speak other than to mumble, "Well, can I have a ciggie yet?"
So I would assume that it's shite and your partner wants to be left home alone for a couple of weeks so he can bone that blond piece with the big norks in accounts.
hth
So I would assume that it's shite and your partner wants to be left home alone for a couple of weeks so he can bone that blond piece with the big norks in accounts.
hth
sjsub
New Member
Oh dear, I'm sorry if that's what the missus did to you, fobbed you off to be boned by Dave from warehouse, or was it John from the coffee shop next door? Either way I'm not surprised you got pissed on the flights
Hooray for you!
wemakeyousoundb
hopefully not gimboid
where can we peruse that sliding scale?
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