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Three cheers for the traders of Brixton Road north!

I had a chat with someone on your idea this afternoon MtM.

At first glance the problem is that, whilst there is a lot of concern over the numbers of Tesco's currently out there or being planned, they're nowhere near a monopoly position at the moment. They hold 30% of the grocery market, but from memory their share of the entire convenience sector is just over half of that. Plus, they also operate in the white goods, clothing and electronic sectors as well (the bigger stores) where they ahve a much smaller share again.

So I doubt any attempts to restrict Tescos would stand up to the slightest legal challenge. Disliking the way a commnercial enterprise operates is one thing. Being able to do somethiung about it is another entirely.

I will have a chat with David Boyle and NEF to pick their brains on whether they think anything could be done to clip the wings of the big retailers, but I suspect options will be extremely limited.

As always though, the bottom line rests with people. If enough people stop shopping at Tesco's, they won't be able to have so many stores. It really is that simple.

Wasn't really an idea, but more a thought as to how they're allowed to get away with it, when the breweries weren't supposedly able to get away with it.

On that article I quoted earlier:

In 1989, though, the Thatcher government introduced legislation to tackle the six biggest big brewers, whose dominance was approaching monopoly proportions.

it mentions the six biggest brewers. How much of the market share do Tescos, Sainsbury's and the rest of them have to have for them to be classed as monopolising the markets?

Like I said, I don't understand finance/economics or politics, so I'm genuinely curious
 
Wasn't really an idea, but more a thought as to how they're allowed to get away with it, when the breweries weren't supposedly able to get away with it.

On that article I quoted earlier:



it mentions the six biggest brewers. How much of the market share do Tescos, Sainsbury's and the rest of them have to have for them to be classed as monopolising the markets?

Like I said, I don't understand finance/economics or politics, so I'm genuinely curious

The difficulty is that licensed premises are a very defined sector. They sell alcohol, for consumption on-site, and very little else. Anything else they do (food, entertainment etc) is driven aroiund their core purpose of selling alcohol on premises. So its a very easy sector to define whether or not there is a competition issue. With the brewers it was doubly the case, as they were not only limiting places of consumption, but also the products that could be consumed there in the first place - an inter-linked double monopoly. In addition, licensed premises are legally restricted due to a perception of issues re societal impact, whereas supermarkets/convenience stores aren't.

With the likes of Sainsburys and Tescos etc, the problem is defining what particular market they're in. If you take the entire convenience and grocery sector, they wouldn't have a monopoly position as they are up against tens of thousands of small shops, petrol stations, vending machines etc etc. They are even further from being monopoly providers in a number of categories WITHIN their core operation - e.g. toiletries, where Boots and Superdrugs are also big competitors. And then there's other categories where they're nowhere near monopoly providers at all : electronics, homeware, clothing, petrol etc etc. So the problem is, what particular part of the big supermarket's operations would you focus on to try to claim they were collectively monopoly providers, how would that narrow specification be justified, and would it with-stand legal challenge ?

It's a very tricky issue to frame and then tackle.
 
The difficulty is that licensed premises are a very defined sector. They sell alcohol, for consumption on-site, and very little else. Anything else they do (food, entertainment etc) is driven aroiund their core purpose of selling alcohol on premises. So its a very easy sector to define whether or not there is a competition issue. With the brewers it was doubly the case, as they were not only limiting places of consumption, but also the products that could be consumed there in the first place - an inter-linked double monopoly. In addition, licensed premises are legally restricted due to a perception of issues re societal impact, whereas supermarkets/convenience stores aren't.

With the likes of Sainsburys and Tescos etc, the problem is defining what particular market they're in. If you take the entire convenience and grocery sector, they wouldn't have a monopoly position as they are up against tens of thousands of small shops, petrol stations, vending machines etc etc. They are even further from being monopoly providers in a number of categories WITHIN their core operation - e.g. toiletries, where Boots and Superdrugs are also big competitors. And then there's other categories where they're nowhere near monopoly providers at all : electronics, homeware, clothing, petrol etc etc. So the problem is, what particular part of the big supermarket's operations would you focus on to try to claim they were collectively monopoly providers, how would that narrow specification be justified, and would it with-stand legal challenge ?

It's a very tricky issue to frame and then tackle.

Yeah, I see your point. :(

Thanks for explanation :)

PS: Found out what Rest of Noise is going to become yet? Primark?
 
Yeah, I see your point. :(

Thanks for explanation :)

PS: Found out what Rest of Noise is going to become yet? Primark?

I'm told it's being converted into TWO shops, which would suggest units smaller than the likes of Primani.... :D

Sitting tenants have an automatic right of renewal, but Bonne Marche Centre took the leases back from the pub chain when they expired. To do that legally, though, they have to use them for their own purposes (at least for a while) so it will be interesting to see how they manage that issue.

P.S. When I grew up in Northern Ireland in the 70's and 80's, Primark were a common as muck local chain (called Penny's in the Republic, but the same thing) that was about as fashionable as your granney's old knicker drawer. Funny how things change....
 
I'm told it's being converted into TWO shops, which would suggest units smaller than the likes of Primani.... :D

Sitting tenants have an automatic right of renewal, but Bonne Marche Centre took the leases back from the pub chain when they expired. To do that legally, though, they have to use them for their own purposes (at least for a while) so it will be interesting to see how they manage that issue.

P.S. When I grew up in Northern Ireland in the 70's and 80's, Primark were a common as muck local chain (called Penny's in the Republic, but the same thing) that was about as fashionable as your granney's old knicker drawer. Funny how things change....

I know about Penny's and often have friend's nieces over to stay who insist on going to Primark. They have Penny's but Primark in Oxford Street is much bigger. More shit to spend their money on then :D

TWO units? Maybe we'll have a 98p and 97p shop :hmm:
 
I remember my aunt would drag us round Penny's showing us how great it was when we went back for holidays.
I preferred Dunnes myself...
 
Returning to the wider issue - surely the problem here is that the rents for shops in London (and probably more widely across the UK too) generally are too high for start ups/ independents and so it is only the chains such as Tesco that can rent the shops as they have the resources to weather any short term losses whilst the shop gets established. For this reason landlords presumably prefer dealing with the large comnpanies as they can be sure that they'll pay their rent.

Not sure what can be done - I guess the council has a role in making its premises available for local businesses and subsidising where appropriate or offering reduced rates for news businesses to help them get started.
 
Not sure what can be done - I guess the council has a role in making its premises available for local businesses and subsidising where appropriate or offering reduced rates for news businesses to help them get started.

Like Spacemakers in the market *ducks*
 
Lidl is so much cheaper than Tesco (and it is the first supermarket we get to, heading Tesco-wards) that in recent months our shopping has shifted from 90% Tesco 10% Lidl to the other way about! And their produce is far more seasonal and local than Tesco's ever is (no airmailed mange-touts there!), which is really nice.

And before anybody asks why I don't shop in the market - I do, sometimes, but it's further away and last time I bought veg there I had to throw 1/2 of them away, which was rather off-putting.
 
Oh no! I don't want two Tescos on my doorstep. I love Everfresh. Actually the veg is better at the Lo-Cost further down the road, but they are very friendly in Everfresh and have a good enough range that, combined with the Saturday market, I don't really need to go anywhere else. I really hope they don't suffer.
 
Oh no! I don't want two Tescos on my doorstep.
The tesco at the old pub at the corner of Vassall Road is in an advanced state....the shopfitters are in already...I expect it'll be open within weeks. :(

I'm not sure planning applications have even been put in for the oterh one yet...
 
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