kyser_soze
Hawking's Angry Eyebrow
Wikkid - filled in last night 
Thread for discussing SOCPA lone mass demo with Mark Thomas
- Thread starter TeeJay
- Start date
Yes you do.In Bloom said:
But then you go and spoil your whole angsty, anti-everything, nihilist, defeatist, sniping by admitting that you are involved with the Anarchist Federation, no-id and some swedish anarchists who are trying to crash a job-seekers website (unless that last one was just a piss-take?).
I kind of wonder, if you really believe that no kind of campaigning, political activity or ethical lifestyle is worth doing, why you still pretend to strike political poses. Why not just go out and get on with feathering your own nest?
I also wonder how on earth you think that half the successful campaigns and political movements throughout history have ever started or why any of them actually managed to achieve anything (which they did). Sorry but your cynical pose is shallow and ironically it is more pointless than any of the things you denounce as pointless.
Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that this isn't a good demo and I hope that it works. I like Mark Thomas and I support people sticking up for their right to protest outside parliament (although I thought that it have always been de facto restrictions in parliament square and outside downing street).kyser_soze said:
However, since this is a discussion forum and since this demo is about SOCPA 2005 what is wrong with discussing the details and ins-and-outs of the bill?
Kid_Eternity
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
TeeJay said:
The pedantic level and tone you invoke? No offence mate, but your overly forensic posting can sometimes give the wrong impression of you.
How else do you want to discuss clauses within Acts of Parliament? If someone makes a specific claim about a loophole - on which I am not sure is actually correct - then why the fuck do people have a problem with anyone discussing this loophole?Kid_Eternity said:
I wish the best of luck to everyone doing this - but I don't think anyone is doing themselves any favours by shouting "blargh blargh blargh I'm not listening" when someone wants to discuss the details that the whole demonstarion is about in the first place.
If people simply wanted to challenge this head on then they could just steam down there en mass and engage in some good old fashioned civil disobedience, with no need to discuss loopholes or fill in forms.
For a long time I've been of the opinion that there is a very effective way of highlighting the stupidity of the legislation.
Simply turn up unnannounced in the exclusion zone with a placard saying "I'M BACKING BLAIR". Then sit back and wait while the police arrest you for supporting the Prime Minister.
In the meantime the planned mass action is a good idea and I was going to buy into it until I saw the link at the bottom that connected it with B***** H** and his misguided band of fuckwitted supporters. Sadly that means it is a no-go area as far as I'm concerned. Good luck to everyone else though.
Simply turn up unnannounced in the exclusion zone with a placard saying "I'M BACKING BLAIR". Then sit back and wait while the police arrest you for supporting the Prime Minister.
In the meantime the planned mass action is a good idea and I was going to buy into it until I saw the link at the bottom that connected it with B***** H** and his misguided band of fuckwitted supporters. Sadly that means it is a no-go area as far as I'm concerned. Good luck to everyone else though.
"The new revolutionary Westminster protest camper, Mark Kemp with his Police Farce blank placard"
Link: http://www.peopleincommon.org/
What I talk about on here and what I occupy my time with are two completely different things.TeeJay said:
Because I never said that all forms of campaigning and political activity are worthless. That's just your sad little strawman because you can't handle criticism.
Usually by actually being relevant to the majority of people and being willing to discuss tactics honestly and openly without having a temper tantrum everytime their methods are questions.
Or at least I'd think that'd be a major part of it.
So you say one thing on here and do the opposite in real life? Do you actually believe anything you post?In Bloom said:
I am discussing tactics - this thread is an example of where I have been asking questions yet still support the demo.
You on the other hand never make any kind of helpful suggestion - you just sneer and pronounce everything as pointless like some black hoodie wearing teenager having an hormone attack.
As for things being "relevant to the majority of people" - again you are one to talk ... only supporting the most far out sects and spouting far-left rubbish that is irrelevant outside your ghetto, while laying into far more mainstream campaigners who actually communicate in ways the public can understand and who don't pose around bleating utterly utopian nonsense.
Don't worry, I am sure you will grow up eventually. I just wish you wouldn't inflict this bollocks on u75.
Not what I said. Not that you've ever let little things like what my argument actually is or the subject of the thread get in the way of your personal attacks before.TeeJay said:
I don't talk about everything I do on here, and I have no intention of doing so.
In any case, even if I did absolutely fuck all, why would it matter? It doesn't make this ill-thought out "lone mass demo" (real funny stuff, by the way) crap any more useful or worthwhile.
kyser_soze
Hawking's Angry Eyebrow
TeeJay said:
Charing X police station is where we have to register our SOCPA forms, not where our individual demonstrations will be taking place Teej...was that not obvious?
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
i duno the thoguht of say even a couple of hundred people all turn up at a police station to help forefill their legal obligation could be considereded a demonstrationkyser_soze said:
i'll explain at 6 this evening where the idea came from ... see you then 
Such unreasonable conditions would not stand up to scrutiny. The police will make conditions they consider reasonable becaus ethey know that any which are not will be challenged by judicial review and will be likely to be overturned.TeeJay said:
As far as I can see the law requires the Commissioner to allow a protest which is notified in accordance with the law, although various conditions can be set.TeeJay said:
I can see no significant difference in the rules for sole protesters and groups, other than in the definition of who has to apply / be notified. There would, however, be a very practical distinction in that a lone protest is likely to be subject to far less conditions / interference than a 10,000 person march!
detective-boy said:
True. But all this is at the discression of the commisioner. He could change the location, duration, timeing and number of people allowed reguardless of the number of people. Therefore someone wanting to protest about a controvertial peice of law going through parliament could have the time of the protest moved untill after the vote has happened.
I believe the most senior officor present can rewrite the rules whilst the protest is on too.
I don;t think the police would make such drastic conditions, certainly to the point of entirely undermining the relevance of the protest, because, as I said in the earlier post, I would expect them to be overruled by the courts as ultra vires (in excess of the extent of the powers granted)memespring said:
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
just got back saw mr soze there and mr dervish and mr thomas was all very ggod natured see you all next thursday
detective-boy said:
the Mya Evens case seems to suggest otherwise. The problem is not with the police though - they shouldent have been put in a position where they are able to make decisions about how and where people can protest outside the palce their laws are made.
My understanding is that she did not apply for an authorisation - hence my comments about excessive conditions are irrelevant. Do you know otherwise?memespring said:
detective-boy said:
Ah, you've got me there.
That said I know someone who was at the first legal demo after the act came in (an Amnesty International one outside Downing Street). She said the whole atmosphere was very odd. They were made to stand in a particular place, no loudspeakers or chantting were alowed and there was a disproportionate police presence.
I think you'd need to view the conditions made for a series of events over time to get a feel for how the police are applying the law. The first one (or few) of something always tends to get a bit of an over-the-top response as both sides find their way. And the "disproportionate police presence" could be expained by over optimistic estimates by Amnesty of how many would turn up!! The conditions on where the protest was allowed would seem likely (there have always been some such restrictions, on virtually every demo and march). Likewise the non-use of loudspeakers (which do have a nuisance value beyond the demo itself). The banning of chanting (if that general, as opposed to restricted to certain areas, for a certain period, not to be offensive or something like that) seems a bit over the top and would be the sort of condition I would expect to be viewed as excessive if chalenged inn the Courts.memespring said:
So have any conditions been notified yet?
Badger Kitten
oof
I got two letters!
Both said it was ok.
I have a problem though in that I have no placard. And no means of getting one as I am at work and have things to do every night that I can't get out of.
Does anyone have a spare blank one?
Or an old one that I can re-cover?
Both said it was ok.
I have a problem though in that I have no placard. And no means of getting one as I am at work and have things to do every night that I can't get out of.
Does anyone have a spare blank one?
Or an old one that I can re-cover?
Just "borrow" an estate agent 'for sale' sign (take a penknife or screwdriver to prize the staples out), cover it with A2 paper (w/masking tape or bluetack) and replace the thick wooden stick with something more lightweight (w/ masking tape).
You should be able to do this en route to work and in the stationary cupboard at work.
You should be able to do this en route to work and in the stationary cupboard at work.
This is the new flashmob isn't it?
Sad.
Sad.
Not at all.chrisshapland said:
Flashmob = pointless bit of wankery
This = a real demonstration about a real issue
Mark Thomas has been doing this kind of stuff way before the term "flash mob" was ever used.
I have noticed that you seem to be drifting from thread to thread trying desperately to get a reaction from people by posting deliberately obtuse comments. I suggest you relieve your boredom some other way that doesn't involve deliberately pissing people off, like some angst-ridden and attention-seeking teenager throwing traffic cones around the street.
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