The first few seconds of the Big Bang: What we know and what we don't

[Orang Utan]

You raise an interesting point. Before the before there wasn't a before, so the not before isn't actually a not before (which is an after), but an absence of before.

And before that?

 

[Orang Utan]

Work that out, eh, boffins?

 

[discokermit]

And before that?

they have no idea so will try to bullshit you with any old shit.

 

[Orang Utan]

they have no idea so will try to bullshit you with any old shit.

A bunch of long words

 

[NoXion]

i built a model plane but my model broke down before i reached new york. i now declare new york does not exist according to my model, which is correct in every detail except for being made of balsa.

We already know New York exists.

he claims time and the universe existed today like it did yesterday and the day before. you are the one claiming that ages ago none of it existed. i think its you who has to offer the proof.

But the universe isn't static, so it hasn't always existed "like it did yesterday". Even the fundamental forces of physics as we observe them today have not always been around.

 

[discokermit]

Work that out, eh, boffins?

they can't. they have lost their specs. which are on their head!

 

[Orang Utan]

We already know New York exists.



But the universe isn't static, so it hasn't existed "like it did yesterday". Even the fundamental forces of physics as we observe them today have not always been around.

Yeah well you can say anything with words, but where’s your graph?

 

[discokermit]

Yeah well you can say anything with words, but where’s your graph?

dont. they love a graph, these cunts.

 

[discokermit]

druids had it right. writing makes you stupid.

 

[fishfinger]

Here's a graph on a t-shirt:

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

We actually have a 5* universe

If what we have is 5* then god help the poor sods living in something worse.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

"Before" is only a concept which existed from the moment of creation onwards. So there wasn't a before.

Yeah there was. That bit before that moment.

 

[Zapp Brannigan]

Yeah there was. That bit before that moment.

Excluding events and objects massive enough to warp the fabric of space time (e.g. black holes) time at a fixed point is to all intents and purposes linear. It traces back from time = x secs (+ive) to time = 0. It does not go into minus numbers.

Interestingly, the big bang is very much one of those events which warps space time so time was not linear in the first moments after creation. But it still doesn't go into minus numbers.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Excluding events and objects massive enough to warp the fabric of space time (e.g. black holes) time at a fixed point is to all intents and purposes linear. It traces back from time = x secs (+ive) to time = 0. It does not go into minus numbers.

Interestingly, the big bang is very much one of those events which warps space time so time was not linear in the first moments after creation. But it still doesn't go into minus numbers.

Yeah it does. You have this “start” moment. Then you go back a second or two. Job done.

 

[WouldBe]

Excluding events and objects massive enough to warp the fabric of space time (e.g. black holes) time at a fixed point is to all intents and purposes linear. It traces back from time = x secs (+ive) to time = 0. It does not go into minus numbers.

Interestingly, the big bang is very much one of those events which warps space time so time was not linear in the first moments after creation. But it still doesn't go into minus numbers.

Yet we always get a t-10 countdown to things.

 

[WouldBe]

Actually if the big bang was us being shat out of the other end of a black hole then time must have existed before the big bang or we wouldn't have been able to fall into the black hole in the first place.

 

[Kevbad the Bad]

What grants are you prepared to offer?

A couple of pies

Yeah well you can say anything with words, but where’s your graph?

Will a pie chart do it?

 

[Zapp Brannigan]

Yeah it does. You have this “start” moment. Then you go back a second or two. Job done.

You have 5 bricks. Take 1 away, you have 4 bricks. Keep taking them away until you have no bricks. Take another one away? You can't, there are no bricks to take.

It's been 5 seconds since the moment of creation. Go back 1 second, it's been 4 seconds since moment 0. Keep going back until you're at that moment. Go back another second? You can't, there is no time left to travel.

 

[Orang Utan]

You have 5 bricks. Take 1 away, you have 4 bricks. Keep taking them away until you have no bricks. Take another one away? You can't, there are no bricks to take.

It's been 5 seconds since the moment of creation. Go back 1 second, it's been 4 seconds since moment 0. Keep going back until you're at that moment. Go back another second? You can't, there is no time left to travel.

What about the second before that?

 

[Zapp Brannigan]

Actually if the big bang was us being shat out of the other end of a black hole then time must have existed before the big bang or we wouldn't have been able to fall into the black hole in the first place.

If the big bang was the other side of a big contraction (now a widely discredited theory but let's run with it), then the time in the other universe would not be the same time as in ours. Time, as space, is a property of the universe in which it resides.

 

[Zapp Brannigan]

What about the second before that?

There wasn't a second before that. I can do this all day

 

[Orang Utan]

There wasn't a second before that. I can do this all day

There must have been. It must have gone somewhere. Have you checked the universe before that?

 

[High Voltage]

. . . then the time in the other universe would not be the same time as in ours

Hence the phrase "A New York minute"

 

[Zapp Brannigan]

There must have been. It must have gone somewhere. Have you checked the universe before that?

Already addressed that one. Next.

 

[Aladdin]

You're the one making the positive claim that time extends infinitely into the past. The burden of evidence is upon your shoulders, not mine.

Question.
If time in this universe does not extend infinitely backwards...
Then it seems that this universe is absolutely finite.
And that future time is limited

 

[WouldBe]

If the big bang was the other side of a big contraction (now a widely discredited theory but let's run with it), then the time in the other universe would not be the same time as in ours. Time, as space, is a property of the universe in which it resides.

But there would still be time just not as we know it.

 

[WouldBe]

There must have been. It must have gone somewhere. Have you checked the universe before that?

Probably down the back of the sofa.

 

[Zapp Brannigan]

Question.
If time in this universe does not extend infinitely backwards...
Then it seems that this universe is absolutely finite.
And that future time is limited

Not necessarily. Time started at 0 but has no definitive upper boundary. The universe will eventually end, but not because time runs out.

 

[Aladdin]

Not necessarily. Time started at 0 but has no definitive upper boundary. The universe will eventually end, but not because time runs out.

Yes...but my point was that
If the universe began before time then how does the universe end without time ending?

 

[Septimus Rufiji]

There must have been. It must have gone somewhere. Have you checked the universe before that?

Probably down the back of the sofa.

It'll be in that drawer everyone has, the one with the old phone chargers and keys for locks that never existed.