St. Agnes Place - Putting Up A Resistance

[jæd]

Have you tried getting somewhere to live in London when you have very little money?

I thought one of the key points was that the residents were offering to pay rent to Lambeth...? If they can afford to do that then they should be able to find alternative accommodation...

And yes, I've had to find places to live in London when I've been unemployed and have had very little money. (And this has included when I was living about two hours train ride from London...)

 

[Blagsta]

I thought one of the key points was that the residents were offering to pay rent to Lambeth...? If they can afford to do that then they should be able to find alternative accommodation...

So you think its easy to come up with £2000 needed to move into a new place? Lucky you.

And yes, I've had to find places to live in London when I've been unemployed and have had very little money. (And this has included when I was living about two hours train ride from London...)

How did you come up with a months advance rent and 6 weeks deposit while on benefits? How do people get credit references and landlord references?

 

[tarannau]

There's a huge difference between being willing to pay the rent on a council property and having a month and a half's rent for a commercial property (typically at least £800) ready to pay for a deposit at short notice. And where are they going to get references, let alone find a place at after 6 on a Monday night.

I suspect you're just trying to stir things up here in tiresome troll fashion. Either that or you're an unperceptive plonker of the highest order.

 

[jæd]

So you think its easy to come up with £2000 needed to move into a new place? Lucky you.

...

How did you come up with a months advance rent and 6 weeks deposit while on benefits? How do people get credit references and landlord references?

I've only ever had to pay a months rent as deposit and a month in advance. For one of the first places I moved into that came to £500 in total. (But that was a while back, but it was in Lambeth...) These people have been living rent free -- what have they spending money on...?

 

[jæd]

I suspect you're just trying to stir things up here in tiresome troll fashion. Either that or you're an unperceptive plonker of the highest order.

Just trying to have a discussion about this. So far everything on U75 has been very one-sided.

 

[Blagsta]

I've only ever had to pay a months rent as deposit and a month in advance. For one of the first places I moved into that came to £500 in total. (But that was a while back, but it was in Lambeth...)

As you say - it was a while back. I had to provide a 6 week deposit and a months rent in my last place (total of over a grand) and me and my partner had to come up with 2 grand between us when we recently moved. Not to mention financial references.

These people have been living rent free -- what have they spending money on...?

I don't know. Some of them post on here. Why don't you ask them?

 

[Blagsta]

Just trying to have a discussion about this. So far everything on U75 has been very one-sided.

A discussion based on...what? You not actually having the faintest idea what life is like for a lot of people who have little money? Very good that, well done.

 

[Fuchs66]

A discussion based on...what? You not actually having the faintest idea what life is like for a lot of people who have little money? Very good that, well done.

OK first off I have a lot of sympathy for the people who have been hit by this but I would like to understand it a bit better. Why have they got very little money? If anyone here is from St Agnes please feel free, do/did the people there have normal paid jobs/receive benefits or was it a totally alternative commune that turned it's back on such things. Why oh why seeing as this situation has been rapidly approaching with flags flying and bugles blowing does it appear that no contingent plans have been made for those evicted? Would have saved a lot of heartbreak.

 

[articletwo]

oh for fuck sake!
Time amd time again, they offered to pay rent and sign contracts on the properties which were lying empty and derelict when they moved in.
other councils have followed this enlightened route. did Lambeth? NO!
They - Lambeth BC - are now peddling this line as justification for the fact they are destroying this community, prior to jumping into bed with property developers, so as to cover the gaping wond in housing dept finances, caused by their own incompetence in being fleeced for £3m by a fraudster. jesus, do keep up....

I have no strong view either way re. Lambeth's action, but what I have noticed is that everyone else does: on the council side, people like Fitchett - who seems like a rather unpleasant character, and on the other side, those for whom the St Agnes residents can do no wrong and who have, apparently, created utopia. I suspect the truth is somewhere in between.

It does also seem sensible to me that the social housing that Lambeth have said they will build there is allocated to some of the 12,000 (I think) that are on the Council waiting list, according to principles that have been put in place through a democratic process. Rather than the housing being occupied by those who got there first and were then willing to fight to defend theiroccupation.

 

[Blagsta]

those for whom the St Agnes residents can do no wrong and who have, apparently, created utopia.

Except of course, no has said any such thing.

 

[zenie]

them ??

Thought you'd had a moan in ES sorry

*as you were*

 

[zenie]

I have no strong view either way re. Lambeth's action, but what I have noticed is that everyone else does: on the council side, people like Fitchett - who seems like a rather unpleasant character, and on the other side, those for whom the St Agnes residents can do no wrong and who have, apparently, created utopia. I suspect the truth is somewhere in between.

It does also seem sensible to me that the social housing that Lambeth have said they will build there is allocated to some of the 12,000 (I think) that are on the Council waiting list, according to principles that have been put in place through a democratic process. Rather than the housing being occupied by those who got there first and were then willing to fight to defend theiroccupation.

If you had bothered to read any of the other threads on this mtter you would know this is not being developed into social housing.

As for the who got there first - try getting your head out your arse - over 30 years ago they were first occupied and have done since then. the tennants had a lease until 2000, and tried to make the place a co-op but lambeth was having none of it.

If they were bring evicted so Lambeth could convert the existing houses into flats and then rehouse some of the 10.000 people plus on their waiting lists it would stil be an issue for the residents but not like it is now because it's being sold off for private developments.

Why dont you read the facts before you post such drivel?

 

[newbie]

THIS IS AN EMERGENCY

There is going to be an illegal eviction happening to the couple that live at the south end of St Agnes Place (Bolton Crescent) at 5pm.

I'm sorry I was unable to get along there. What happened, are they alright?

 

[zenie]

I'm sorry I was unable to get along there. What happened, are they alright?

Nope they were illegally evicted

 

[aurora green]

Nope they were illegally evicted

I wonder why Lambeth decided to do this? What a completely shit way to treat it's own residents. This was a long established community, not some group that has turned up in the borough over night.

Do think carrying out illeagal evictions is fair, or in any way justifiable, Bob?

 

[Streathamite]

Just trying to have a discussion about this. So far everything on U75 has been very one-sided.

well yeah, it's hardly f-ing surprising given the facts of the matter. Why don't YOU give us the 'other side' then?

 

[Streathamite]

so as far as you are concerned, Lambeth council in general - and Fitchett in particular - have acted in an entirely honourable, community-minded, socially just and - dare I say it - Liberal manner, in moving heaven and earth to destroy this community, so as to facilitate a private development, yes?
well - yay or nay?

while we're at it Bob - answer to this, please?
(and no, I ain't picking on you. to me, this is a fair question)

 

[Kid_Eternity]

Blink report

 

[Streathamite]

I have no strong view either way re. Lambeth's action, but what I have noticed is that everyone else does: on the council side, people like Fitchett - who seems like a rather unpleasant character, and on the other side, those for whom the St Agnes residents can do no wrong and who have, apparently, created utopia. I suspect the truth is somewhere in between.
.

"I suspect..." you mean; "I don't know a thing about what has happened here, and haven't actually done the digging to establish the facts for myself, so i'm guessing".
The FACTS are;
there has been a continuous community here since 1974. they moved into abandoned properties, and have done rather more to care for them than either the duchy of cornwall or Lambeth BC have. They have repeatedly tried to open rent/contract/residency negotiations with Lambeth, and got nowhere, cos Lambeth are such tossers.
recently, the housing dept got stung for £3m by a fraudster, and did nowt about it. the housing dept is in deep shit. they and their property developer mates have long been excited about the commercial potential, for a cash-poor, incompetent council, of a piece of prime real estate in an up-and-coming area (with a tube station) - and decided to cash in, so screw the community.
FACTS.

It does also seem sensible to me that the social housing that Lambeth have said they will build there is allocated to some of the 12,000 (I think) that are on the Council waiting list, according to principles that have been put in place through a democratic process. Rather than the housing being occupied by those who got there first and were then willing to fight to defend theiroccupation

FFS! There is NO promise of 'social housing', only 'affordable' housing. 'affordable' lies in the eyes of the beholder. Mr fitchett occupies a delectable bijou residence opposite brocky park, so I suspect his definition of 'affordable' is rather different to those evicted from St Agnes, or those in rushcroft and clifton.
LBL have done NOTHING elsewhere to ease the waiting list problems.

jesus, save me from these 'reasonable' wet liberal middle-of-the-roaders...

 

[jæd]

well yeah, it's hardly f-ing surprising given the facts of the matter. Why don't YOU give us the 'other side' then?

On U75 this is clearly an emotive subject, but in the wider population it doesn't seem to be such a hot item. And yes, this particular type of situation isn't one I've had to deal with so natuarally I'm curious about it...

From that report on Blink... How come the residents were caught unprepared...? And why didn't the Rasterfarians do anything to help...?

 

[lang rabbie]

Lambeth council ... have acted in an entirely honourable, community-minded, socially just and - dare I say it - Liberal manner, in moving heaven and earth to destroy this community, so as to facilitate a private development, yes?

The Kremlin-like approach of Lambeth to releasing information on their plans for the site, for which there no planning application, doesn't do them any favours.

But AFAIK this is not a "private" development. Like any other council, Lambeth doesn't have the ability to finance new council housing itself, so relies on housing associations. The various news reports previously suggested that London & Quadrant Housing Trust were the council's partner, but the BLINK story suggests that Hyde Housing will be constructing 200 new flats. I know that HAs are getting more commercial, but they aren't Berkeley Homes or Countryside Properties.

The scheme is further complicated as Lambeth's press statements claim that it will include a new leisure centre/swimming pool - presumably a replacement for the Kennington Lido next door closed in the 1990s, which locals have been agitating to have replaced ever since.

It is not clear how this is to be financed, and whether the sums only stack up if there is private housing on part of the site - certainly the "75% affordable" housing implied this.

 

[Streathamite]

cheers LR. still leaves us all blindly groping in the dark for a full + clear picture, then?

 

[Bob]

Do think carrying out illeagal evictions is fair, or in any way justifiable, Bob?

No of course I don't believe in illegal evictions. My whole point is that if the evictions are legal then I'm fine with them.

My point is that I agree with the Council in saying that they have an obligation to their lawful tennants and the people on the housing list - and 75% of the replacement housing will be affordable housing.

As it happens I think demolishing nice old houses like that is not a good idea - but that's really a different issue.

 

[Bob]

while we're at it Bob - answer to this, please?
(and no, I ain't picking on you. to me, this is a fair question)

So popular. Ok - I find it hard to think how I would explain to my former neighbours on a north Lambeth council estate who had been on a waiting list for a big enough flat for their kids for something like ten years that a bunch of social housing (150 flats if LR is right) can't be built because some people who have lived in it illegally for a long time have built a nice community. I'm not saying this is an easy decision - clearly there is a community there who have done some good things - but I simply can't see what I'd tell my old neighbours. So yes I think the council have done the right thing overall even if I disagree with some elements of it.

 

[citydreams]

That's all very well Bob, but how much money has this whole debacle cost? Do you really believe it is money well spent? How many properties do you know that are currently empty in Lambeth that could be redesigned to take in Special Needs &c. if only the money was available?

If you take this line with every housing issue then shouldn't we building more skyscrapers to accomodate the thousands upon thousands on the list?

 

[Blagsta]

and 75% of the replacement housing will be affordable housing.

Affordable to who?

 

[William of Walworth]

and 75% of the replacement housing will be affordable housing.

That's Lambeth Council spin. What Blags said.

As it happens I think demolishing nice old houses like that is not a good idea - but that's really a different issue.

No it's not. It's intrinsicly linked.

 

[zenie]

On U75 this is clearly an emotive subject, but in the wider population it doesn't seem to be such a hot item. And yes, this particular type of situation isn't one I've had to deal with so natuarally I'm curious about it...

From that report on Blink... How come the residents were caught unprepared...? And why didn't the Rasterfarians do anything to help...?

if you bothered reading the report on blink then you'd know.

Are you surprised U75 is emotive about this considering what this Bulletin Board spirit is all about?

 

[William of Walworth]

Just trying to have a discussion about this. So far everything on U75 has been very one-sided.

Only just noticed your dishonst return to this issue.

Will get back to it later, no real time now. Others have said their bit to you ... well posted tarannau in particular.

You're being dishonest, given how deliberately contentious and confrontational you were being early in the RIOT POLICE IN ST AGNES THREAD NOW thread, in General.

You were threatened with a ban, remember? Any idea why that was? Because of your reasonability, was it?

More when I have time.

 

[aurora green]

...It's intrinsicly linked.

I agree!
The worst possible out come for Lambeth is the loss of those beautiful houses. They should be listed, in fact I cant imagine why they aren't. I only live down the road, and everything old is caught in a conservation order, and old facades have to be kept even if the bulding is re-developed.