Recording your jobsearch when on Universal Credit

[Irish353.109]

Evening everyone.

Like lots of people, I have recently had the misfortune of becoming unemployed and needing to turn to the state for support - and I live in a UC area. The work coach has asked me a few times to record my jobsearch on my Universal Jobmatch account, which I am not happy to do as I have never allowed access. I quoted the regs at her which say claimants can record their jobsearch activity however they choose. Her favourite retort is "Well that was Jobseekers' Allowance, this is Universal Credit!"


However, I've just found this link to what are specifically Universal Credit regulations, and nothing has changed! See clauses J3102 - J3107:

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/562470/admj3.pdf


They still can't force you to show them your UJM account without the Data Protection Act changing (which obviously it hasn't), but many coaches, like the one I see, will try and kid on that that's now the only acceptable way of recording what you have done to look for work. My coach has blatantly lied that "Everybody HAS to use UJM to show what they've done", despite me repeatedly reminding her that that wasn't true, and what's more, she knew I knew.

But as these UC regs prove, they still accept any other methods - whether that's employer/employee correspondence; activity on UJM (only with consent); your written evidence or even your uncorroborated verbal evidence. The only difference is it doesn't have the same advice about how the coaches cannot force you to give access to UJM, but then that goes without saying - again, DPA.

So, basically everyone, if your UC coach gets pedantic about which benefit the rules apply to, this is ammunition they can't really argue with! Well, some might, but then you can ask if their boss is aware they are flouting the rules.

Hope this is useful.

I would be in no position to argue any of this and I would benefit from vastly increased supervision and monitoring of all my jobsearch activity and online activity and I would freely give up all of my privacy rights and all other rights - a little “tough love” and bullying from my job coach would work wonders in making me wake up and grow up in doing the jobsearch as they want it done in thier way, as it is what they think and believe that matters, not what I think, as having been relentlessly bullied in the past “for my own good” this is exactly what I need now

 

[Irish353.109]

I don't mind giving them access to my UJM activities. I note everything I do as I do it, in a spreadsheet with the date, and it takes only a minute or two to upload to UJM. Letting them see my UJM seems to satisfy them in the fastest and easiest way.

It’s always good if everything you do is time stamped as well - how do you timetable each day of your jobsearch? If they see that you record your activity beyond a certain time of day/night they will ask questions and rightly so

 

[Irish353.109]

Once again the blind spots over the attitude cycle rule the roost ...

I have come to realise that this is true in my case

 

[Irish353.109]

Happy belated New Year everybody. As this thread's been bumped, I thought I'd give you all an update.

My usual coach went on a month's annual leave from mid December to January, so I saw someone else, who actually listened to what I had to say and was reasonable. I showed him my written jobsearch record and he asked me if I'd considered writing it up in UJM. I explained my issues with allowing access, and the technical glitches I'd had with it. He just said that was fine as long as I was keeping a record of some description, and never brought it up again. It goes to show the answer will be different depending on which member of staff you're speaking to, which is why I like to keep up to date with the official regulations. It does feel as though each of them makes up rules as they go along.

The lady I usually see is also OK most of the time, to be fair. When I first met with her after making my UC claim in October, that's the first time she tried the line about it being mandatory to allow DWP access to your UJM account. I knew this wasn't true from reading the UJM toolkit when I briefly claimed JSA in early 2015. At that time she said "Whatever way you're comfortable with" and put a note on the system to say I recorded my jobsearch in clerical format.

In November, I briefly got some casual restaurant work, which got me away from the DWP for a bit, but it was a shitty zero hour contract and they stopped giving me hours so I had to re-engage with the Jobcentre and got the same coach. On 7th December 2016, I went for our weekly appointment and she was 10 minutes late seeing me because she was in a one-to-one with her manager. When she came out, I handed her my written record as usual, and that's when she brought up the UJM thing again, quite aggressively. It didn't take a fly on the wall to work out that this manager must have been giving her a hard time and pressuring her to be tougher on claimants. I stood firm and said "I'm not allowing access and that's that. Your regs prove you have no right to insist on it" which is when she tried to tell me the rules under UC were different (which prompted me to dig around online and make this thread). She gave me some vague BS about the "district checking it" (read: the regional manager gives her a hard time if she's not bullying enough claimants to use it and allow access) and how if I didn't give access to UJM, it could look like I wasn't really jobsearching. I asked why typing the same information into the activity notes magically made it more valid than if it was handwritten, and her reply was "They discourage it [handwritten evidence]." I said "They can discourage it all they like, but until you can show me a change in the rules that specifically says I have to allow access to my UJM account because no other method is accepted, they're wasting their time." Once again, she backed off.

On the positive side, I don't think this coach is malicious. One day I'd left the appointment and we'd forgotten to book the next one. She made sure to ring me and tell me when to come in next. If she truly wanted to fuck my life up, she could have easily sent out a letter on the slowest service so I wouldn't get it on time, and she didn't do that. I saw her again too on this Friday just gone, and she was OK then too. She asked what I'd worn to a recent interview and when I said black suit, black shoes and a nice blouse, she said she was sure I'd looked very smart. She can be lovely when she wants to be! But if the subject of UJM comes up again, I'll ask for the manager and ask why they're making staff lie to claimants.

I have used UJM (now find a job) to apply for some roles and I got a callback straight away, so I might consider using it again, as it’s much easier to use than all the other websites (that have endless vacancy repostings) - it would be good for them too, to be able to more closely monitor my jobsearch activity and applications

 

[Irish353.109]

Someone should devise an app that does. Trawls job sites and notes what has or could have been applied for.

That would make it too easy, as the jobcentres have to make life as difficult as possible, as a reflection of the reality of life

- I’m just back from a jobcentre appointment this morning and when I attempted to explain that I was doing all sorts of other things to look for work (although they did not say this “in so many words” while at the same time “banging on about” recording all of these jobsearch related activities in the journal) essentially, the only thing that they are only really interested in is seeing the 7 job applications per day in every Monday to Friday period - if there are any gaps in job applications of more than a day (aside from any other non-recorded jobsearch related activities) questions will be asked and you will be “sailing very close to the wind” in terms of sanctions and rightly so

- personally, I’d give up all my rights to online privacy, (not just while on Universal Credit) and I could see the (positive) benefits of greatly enhanced “bullying” (which I would benefit from) monitoring and (both) more intensive physical and online supervision as positive motivation, if it helped me to find a job more quickly, as I live alone (and should not be doing so anyway)

- in the old days, the only way I found a job was being endlessly nagged and screamed at to “shut up and grow up“ when I was living at home

- I do accept that I do need to be bullied “for my own good” in all aspects of life, regardless of the political or legal side of things, or even the problems with duplicate/fake vacancy issues (which is regarded by others as my making “negative” lame excuses for my failures) as I do admit that I have not taken personal responsibility since my Sept (retailing) redundancy, I have not acted with true maturity and real common sense in reality - these are the harsh lessons of the reality of life that I have had to learn the hard way - and if as a consequence of my immature actions, a (richly deserved) sanction is imposed to make me wake up to reality and to “cop on to myself” so much the better

 

[Irish353.109]

I mean, I have nothing against using UJM to look for work as long as the company have posted their direct contact details on there and it's not through a dodgy third-party recruiter (I worry about scams).

Regarding showing the Jobcentre my UJM content or giving them access, I don't like the Big Brother aspect of it, being monitored all the time. Makes me feel like a kid, or a criminal! When you're unemployed, you have very few rights as it is, so that makes me determined to hang on to the few legal rights I do have, such as privacy. So there's a principle involved.

I have actually tried the digital diary to see what it was like, but it's worse than crap. When you reach the character limit, you have to hit the return key and when I do that, it always ends up crashing and losing what I've put (and I wouldn't put it past the powers-that-be to have designed it that way on purpose so if you've lost everything when you try to show it on signing day, whoops! Sorry, no money for YOU this month!). Writing it all down by hand is less hassle, not to mention covering yourself.

At the end of the day, I'm trying bloody hard to look for work (hopefully have an offer or two coming up soon); I'm keeping a record so it annoys me when all they can do is nitpick about the bloody format I've chosen to present it in. My coach even acknowledges I've done a lot, but when I saw her the other day, she said "You don't need to write down everything you've done; only examples!" Ha ha yeah, and we all know what will happen then. She'll then say I've not done enough! Not falling for that trick.

This is a lot different here in the U.K. in the present day, from the background that I came from in Rural Ireland, where I was raised a Catholic with the Priests and the Nuns, yet in one way, the system back then was (strangely) kinder and much easier, when back then one was clearly given to understand that one did not have any rights or entitlements to anything (save a good hard slap from the Priest, the Nun or the local Garda Seargant) - with today’s rights and entitlements culture and everything being online, on balance, things have been made much more difficult and I was just chatting about this the other day with a neighbour who has an understanding of the Irish culture that I grew up in, in the 1970’s & 1980’s Ireland, where in Rural Ireland, the Catholic Church was much more powerful than it is now (as I am both a Mass-going Catholic still over here in Manchester, even though I am also an older “out” Irish gay man)

 

[Irish353.109]

I mean, I have nothing against using UJM to look for work as long as the company have posted their direct contact details on there and it's not through a dodgy third-party recruiter (I worry about scams).

Regarding showing the Jobcentre my UJM content or giving them access, I don't like the Big Brother aspect of it, being monitored all the time. Makes me feel like a kid, or a criminal! When you're unemployed, you have very few rights as it is, so that makes me determined to hang on to the few legal rights I do have, such as privacy. So there's a principle involved.

I have actually tried the digital diary to see what it was like, but it's worse than crap. When you reach the character limit, you have to hit the return key and when I do that, it always ends up crashing and losing what I've put (and I wouldn't put it past the powers-that-be to have designed it that way on purpose so if you've lost everything when you try to show it on signing day, whoops! Sorry, no money for YOU this month!). Writing it all down by hand is less hassle, not to mention covering yourself.

At the end of the day, I'm trying bloody hard to look for work (hopefully have an offer or two coming up soon); I'm keeping a record so it annoys me when all they can do is nitpick about the bloody format I've chosen to present it in. My coach even acknowledges I've done a lot, but when I saw her the other day, she said "You don't need to write down everything you've done; only examples!" Ha ha yeah, and we all know what will happen then. She'll then say I've not done enough! Not falling for that trick.

Update - I’ve got additional support from my job coach with the Motiv8 programme, as I have been really struggling on my own with the jobsearch, so doing this on Thursday as I would benefit from more intensive 121 - I thought (wrongly) that my IT skills were up to scratch, but obviously not - this is on top of the support that I go to, in the council run computer place near me, because I live alone, in a socially deprived area of Manchester

this experience had taught me that the council are correct in thier (tacit) disapproval of council tenants living alone without (mandatory) tenancy support (of various types) as a basic part of the tenancy agreement, regardless of any other factors, such as personal resilience, property size, individual personal circumstances or anything else, as even if a tenant has internet access from home, attempting the jobsearch when living alone is very difficult, even at home, regardless of IT skills levels, is always considered a bad idea by council staff and the same applies with apps on an iPad, which again I thought (wrongly) was going to be a good idea, which again the council staff in the computer place have strongly advised that they do not approve of the use of such jobsearch apps

- it sounds easy at first glance, but in actuality it is anything but a case of “go and look” as some unsympathetic people (who point-blank refuse to understand these issues) have suggested - it used to be the case that you could hand in your CV into some places, but not any more, it’s all online, which some people refuse to understand - then when you do, the supermarkets have these online tests before allowing an application to proceed - and some of these other jobsearch websites throw back totally irrelevant results with job types, distance etc, in direct searches, not to mention the job alerts by email - I spent yesterday evening emailing my CV to all the most suitable recruitment agencies in Manchester, having already done so to all of the jobsearch websites (and thier useless jobmatch software) because all my efforts to date have been fruitless, so I am beginning to wonder if I am doing something wrong, then you run into problems with some websites as well

 

[Puddy_Tat]

I spent yesterday evening emailing my CV to all the most suitable recruitment agencies in Manchester, having already done so to all of the jobsearch websites (and thier useless jobmatch software) because all my efforts to date have been fruitless, so I am beginning to wonder if I am doing something wrong, then you run into problems with some websites as well

If you've got access to additional support, has anyone else had a look at your CV and said what they think? There's a lot of (in many cases conflicting) advice out there about the 'right' way to put a CV together, but what's seen as best practice does change from time to time (and if you're looking for advice on the internet, also from one country to another - so advice on - for example- an american website may not be so much help.)

It's also often worth having a basic CV on the shelf (or the computer), but tailoring it a bit depending on what sort of job you're going for, what particular experience / skills you're trying to sell to this employer (based on what the job advert etc says they are looking for) - my inner weasel says that tweaking it each time also takes up time towards however many hours a week you're supposed to spend jumping through hoops. just make sure you keep a copy of the one you've sent in a way that you'll find it (e.g. separate folder on computer for each job) so you can remember exactly what you've told that employer.

As I think has already been said, the way people on UC are forced to apply for so many jobs, i guess employers get overloaded with applications / CVs and not sure how the heck they even start to sift for generalist jobs (I was pretty unsuccessful a few years back when I was going after general admin sort of jobs - I've ended up back in something more specialised but it takes a while for that sort of job and in the sort of patch I'm in to come up.

 

[Irish353.109]

If you've got access to additional support, has anyone else had a look at your CV and said what they think? There's a lot of (in many cases conflicting) advice out there about the 'right' way to put a CV together, but what's seen as best practice does change from time to time (and if you're looking for advice on the internet, also from one country to another - so advice on - for example- an american website may not be so much help.)

It's also often worth having a basic CV on the shelf (or the computer), but tailoring it a bit depending on what sort of job you're going for, what particular experience / skills you're trying to sell to this employer (based on what the job advert etc says they are looking for) - my inner weasel says that tweaking it each time also takes up time towards however many hours a week you're supposed to spend jumping through hoops. just make sure you keep a copy of the one you've sent in a way that you'll find it (e.g. separate folder on computer for each job) so you can remember exactly what you've told that employer.

As I think has already been said, the way people on UC are forced to apply for so many jobs, i guess employers get overloaded with applications / CVs and not sure how the heck they even start to sift for generalist jobs (I was pretty unsuccessful a few years back when I was going after general admin sort of jobs - I've ended up back in something more specialised but it takes a while for that sort of job and in the sort of patch I'm in to come up.

I’ve applied for a lot of stuff via the various apps on my iPad so I can keep a record of what I have applied for and even for call centre roles, even attending an interview for one last week and obviously, my email inboxes are swamped with (useless, repeated elsewhere and irrelevant vacancy alerts, some of which I have already applied to) - hopefully next Thursday, because the additional help I’m getting is linked up with partner companies that give jobs to the people they help, I might get something that way (hopefully it will be retail/supermarket/coffee shop) but these jobsearch websites only make the jobsearch even more difficult, especially when some of them are linked with each other/part of each other and thier related apps

 

[LeytonCatLady]

Irish353.109 , thanks for the update. I don't think you're doing anything wrong, sometimes these things just take a while. I was unemployed for seven months from late 2011 until mid 2012, and the UK wasn't even technically in recession. It's just that when there's more people than there are jobs, employers are in a position to be ridiculously fussy. I was rejected for some frankly stupid reasons by employers who I knew for a fact would've snatched my hand off a year before.

By all means listen to feedback you get, but don't go assuming you're at fault somehow!

Keep on going, I know it's hard, but you're doing all the right things.

 

[Irish353.109]

Irish353.109 , thanks for the update. I don't think you're doing anything wrong, sometimes these things just take a while. I was unemployed for seven months from late 2011 until mid 2012, and the UK wasn't even technically in recession. It's just that when there's more people than there are jobs, employers are in a position to be ridiculously fussy. I was rejected for some frankly stupid reasons by employers who I knew for a fact would've snatched my hand off a year before.

By all means listen to feedback you get, but don't go assuming you're at fault somehow!

Keep on going, I know it's hard, but you're doing all the right things.

By the way, what sort of jobs are you going for? - these online tests and jobsearch websites (even with one to one guidance) even with CV matching are a nightmare

 

[Irish353.109]

If you've got access to additional support, has anyone else had a look at your CV and said what they think? There's a lot of (in many cases conflicting) advice out there about the 'right' way to put a CV together, but what's seen as best practice does change from time to time (and if you're looking for advice on the internet, also from one country to another - so advice on - for example- an american website may not be so much help.)

It's also often worth having a basic CV on the shelf (or the computer), but tailoring it a bit depending on what sort of job you're going for, what particular experience / skills you're trying to sell to this employer (based on what the job advert etc says they are looking for) - my inner weasel says that tweaking it each time also takes up time towards however many hours a week you're supposed to spend jumping through hoops. just make sure you keep a copy of the one you've sent in a way that you'll find it (e.g. separate folder on computer for each job) so you can remember exactly what you've told that employer.

As I think has already been said, the way people on UC are forced to apply for so many jobs, i guess employers get overloaded with applications / CVs and not sure how the heck they even start to sift for generalist jobs (I was pretty unsuccessful a few years back when I was going after general admin sort of jobs - I've ended up back in something more specialised but it takes a while for that sort of job and in the sort of patch I'm in to come up.

By the way, I managed to change my UC password (just now) on my iPad by requesting the password reset link and it worked, so I don’t have to lug my Chromebook around, but I found a way on the Chromebook to discover the original password (which I made sure to write down verbatim) - this and the card the jobcentres give out with the security number after I logged back in again and it worked (no thanks to the jobcentre)

 

[Puddy_Tat]

By the way, I managed to change my UC password (just now) on my iPad by requesting the password reset link and it worked, so I don’t have to lug my Chromebook around, but I found a way on the Chromebook to discover the original password (which I made sure to write down verbatim) - this and the card the jobcentres give out with the security number after I logged back in again and it worked (no thanks to the jobcentre)

it was all a bloody sight simpler when you went in to the job centre, read the cards on the board, and made a note of the reference number of anything you wanted to know more about, then went and asked at the desk...

 

[LeytonCatLady]

Well I'm a full time street musician now, so I no longer need the DWP (thankfully) but before that, from age 16 to 30, I was working in various call centres and offices. This included taking inbound calls for a housing association, a London Borough council, a parcel delivery firm, TFL, a bank and an IT company; receptionist at a probation office, admin work at a charity, a telesales job, as well as lots of temping through agencies. I did a lot of what you're doing now and remember how it feels!

 

[Irish353.109]

JOB WEBSITES I USED:

Allthetopbananas.com
Britishjobs.net
Broadbean.co.uk
Clickajob.co.uk
Cv-library.co.uk
Find a Job (most recent/current version of DWP site, was asked to use it daily)
Fish4jobs.co.uk
Guardian.co.uk/jobs
Gumtree.com
Indeed.co.uk
Jobisjob.co.uk
Jobit.co.uk
Jobrapido.co.uk
Jobserve.com
Jobsgopublic.com
Jobsite.co.uk
Monsterjobs.com
Reed.co.uk
Tiptopjobs.co.uk
Totaljobs.com

My experiences of using all of these websites (and thier related iPad apps) to date has been that some of them are part of each other and owned by each other, they share (re-post)each other’s vacancy listings, (which they also share to other third-party iPad apps), putting in parameters in direct searches such as postcode, distance, job type/description, full/part time, contract/permanent, etc is useless, thier CV job matching is a complete joke, as the results are totally irrelevant, the same goes for when you set up a job alert via email, even with Google Jobsearch, which when you have to go through one of these sites to reach the employers recruitment website - someone mentioned earlier about job and recruitment scams going on and I am really beginning to wonder if this is the case - this is the very reason that regardless of your IT skills level, you really need to only do these job searches (with) supervision on a 1-2-1 with someone who really knows what they are doing, as attempting to do so otherwise is not conducive to a successful jobsearch

 

[Irish353.109]

it was all a bloody sight simpler when you went in to the job centre, read the cards on the board, and made a note of the reference number of anything you wanted to know more about, then went and asked at the desk...

I quite agree, as the internet has made jobsearch for jobseekers much more difficult, not easier, as everywhere I have approached in person with a copy of my CV has told me that “you need to apply online, we don’t take CV’s” - some people simply refuse to accept this fact and tell me that “I do not understand that I am wrong”, even when I attempt to present evidence of this, which they dismiss as being irrelevant - recruitment agencies could be doing far more as well - and various community projects of this nature that were set up in socially deprived areas of Manchester in 2002 are no more due to lack of funding, where you could go into a place every day of every week with a CV and get help - I’ve emailed all the (relevant) employment agencies in Manchester with my CV and have received no reply to date

 

[LeytonCatLady]

I quite agree, as the internet has made jobsearch for jobseekers much more difficult, not easier, as everywhere I have approached in person with a copy of my CV has told me that “you need to apply online, we don’t take CV’s” - some people simply refuse to accept this fact and tell me that “I do not understand that I am wrong”, even when I attempt to present evidence of this, which they dismiss as being irrelevant - recruitment agencies could be doing far more as well - and various community projects of this nature that were set up in socially deprived areas of Manchester in 2002 are no more due to lack of funding, where you could go into a place every day of every week with a CV and get help - I’ve emailed all the (relevant) employment agencies in Manchester with my CV and have received no reply to date

With the agencies, feel free to check in with them every couple of weeks to let them know you're still looking. Most of them appreciate that as they can't reply to everyone due to the sheer number of people approaching them for work. However, if you remind them you exist, you'll get more invites to come in and register, and then when a job comes up they'll have put a face to a name, and might be more likely to consider you than someone they haven't met.

 

[Irish353.109]

Well I'm a full time street musician now, so I no longer need the DWP (thankfully) but before that, from age 16 to 30, I was working in various call centres and offices. This included taking inbound calls for a housing association, a London Borough council, a parcel delivery firm, TFL, a bank and an IT company; receptionist at a probation office, admin work at a charity, a telesales job, as well as lots of temping through agencies. I did a lot of what you're doing now and remember how it feels!

Although the Motiv8 did not work out, as although I met two of the conditions, I did not meet the third one - not only do my family in Rural Ireland firmly believe and maintain that I am not doing enough to look for work, as they have said all along since Sept, it has even suggested by one of them that I might have Aspergers, given my previous experiences with bullying, for which regardless of the circumstances, they have always automatically deemed me to be at fault for on each occasion and in every incident, networking with each other and labelling everything I do, say be and act as being wrong and inappropriate in every way, where I had also been attacked by one of thier young friends on Facebook, who appears nice but suddenly turned very nasty as soon as I had arrived in Ireland, posting really horrible personal messages, to which I unfriended and blocked everyone that I knew who had connections to that Irish village - I explained all of this to my job coach as soon as I returned from Ireland (where I was last week, after advice from my job coach to go over) as I had also written an email to the National autistic society detailing my experiences and interactions (my being gay does not help either, as I have had some really nasty comments from other gay people regarding this) and my job coach also sent me an email about a local Aspergers group - something has changed for the better in my local jobcentre, the harshness has gone and there is a real desire to help people

 

[LeytonCatLady]

Although the Motiv8 did not work out, as although I met two of the conditions, I did not meet the third one - not only do my family in Rural Ireland firmly believe and maintain that I am not doing enough to look for work, as they have said all along since Sept, it has even suggested by one of them that I might have Aspergers, given my previous experiences with bullying, for which regardless of the circumstances, they have always automatically deemed me to be at fault for on each occasion and in every incident, networking with each other and labelling everything I do, say be and act as being wrong and inappropriate in every way, where I had also been attacked by one of thier young friends on Facebook, who appears nice but suddenly turned very nasty as soon as I had arrived in Ireland, posting really horrible personal messages, to which I unfriended and blocked everyone that I knew who had connections to that Irish village - I explained all of this to my job coach as soon as I returned from Ireland (where I was last week, after advice from my job coach to go over) as I had also written an email to the National autistic society detailing my experiences and interactions (my being gay does not help either, as I have had some really nasty comments from other gay people regarding this) and my job coach also sent me an email about a local Aspergers group - something has changed for the better in my local jobcentre, the harshness has gone and there is a real desire to help people

I'm glad they're being more compassionate towards you. Maybe now your family will be too.

 

[Irish353.109]

Someone should devise an app that does. Trawls job sites and notes what has or could have been applied for.

Having had my work search activity reduced from 35 hours a week (8 hours a day in 5 day (Mon- Fri) period max & 7 job applications a day) to 20 hours a week (4 hours a day max and at least one job application per day, every day), it can still be difficult to get the self-discipline together to get and stick to a timetable

 

[Irish353.109]

I'm on JSA and have been told I need to record my job searching activities on Universal Jobmatch. Apparently I need to be looking for work for at least 35 hours a week, which is ridiculous. It takes a couple of hours a day, if that.
Have the rules changed?

It’s all online these days and since my redundancy at age 49 after 17 years from retail supermarkets last sept, I find it very stressful, even though I have internet access from home, trawling through all the websites, uploading my CV, even going on Facebook - you are made to feel that you are not doing enough to look for work and even if you don’t apply for a vacancy at least once per day (and record same in journal) you are also still required to record all related jobsearch related activity in UC journal (not just saying that you visited a particular jobsearch website) - it used to be that you had to apply for 7 jobs per day minimum, regardless of suitability or distance but I had to get mine reduced to 20 hours a week as I found it too much

 

[Irish353.109]

Thanks Anton. The good news is I started work today! It's a call centre role at a housing association, and it's 12 weeks on the agency with a look to possibly go permanent after that. I had to ring Universal Credit this morning to explain my change of circumstances and it felt great saying I wouldn't be in tomorrow (she'd booked me onto a group interview thing for a dodgy-sounding zero-hour "opportunity"). As my hours are full time, I won't need to attend any JCP appointments. I'm determined to work fecking hard and really prove myself at this job so they keep me on and I'll hopefully never have to deal with DWP again.

Anyone reading this who's going through the same thing, don't lose heart! I know it's hard when you're not in work, but I promise one day you'll find the perfect fit. I have received some great moral support on this thread from the Urbs, and anyone who could do with the same, please post to this thread when you like and I'll be more than happy to pay it forward and help or advise any way I can.

Don't give up, jobseekers! Your time is gonna come.

Most of the jobs I have found have been call centre roles, not working in an actual shop, even in a junior role and the supermarkets all do these online tests now - I know I would never be able for a call centre

 

[Irish353.109]

It is ridiculous. Handily, you can just make shit up, and they have no way of proving you didn't spend 4 hours searching for work/applications, plus another 3 hours travelling to and from a meeting with an agent. Just nod along and agree to do what they say, then do what you were gonna do anyway and tell them any old shit. They're hardly gonna have the time to check any of it out.

I’m looking for any good apps out there too

 

[LeytonCatLady]

Most of the jobs I have found have been call centre roles, not working in an actual shop, even in a junior role and the supermarkets all do these online tests now - I know I would never be able for a call centre

I did prefer call centre work to retail myself, partly because it paid better and also if someone's rude to you on the phone they can't see you giving them the finger.

But in general, I got sick of hearing "the customer is always right" and opted for busking instead. Now I've no intention of working for a boss again.

 

[Irish353.109]

Having had my work search activity reduced from 35 hours a week (8 hours a day in 5 day (Mon- Fri) period max & 7 job applications a day) to 20 hours a week (4 hours a day max and at least one job application per day, every day), it can still be difficult to get the self-discipline together to get and stick to a timetable

If someone applies for a job, either via a website or app that is mentioned (or otherwise not specified) in the claimant commitment for Universal Credit, that website or app should automatically forward those details to the applicant’s online journal where the Universal Credit login details are entered into that website or app - and this is one of many ways in which these website and app creators could help people applying for jobs while on Universal Credit given the current rules - this is one reason why I prefer to use apps when applying for jobs, as already, it does provide you with a list of all jobs applied for through the app for you to enter into your journal later on, which I would try to do before Midnight that day at the latest

 

[Irish353.109]

It exists.

Universal Automation | Get the Extension

Since having to claim UC since my redundancy from a U.K. supermarket after 17 years at age 49 in Sept 2019, aside from any political considerations one way or the other, I do consider that some aspects of UC need to be reviewed and I do empathise with those who do find some aspects of the system unfair, especially regarding the sanctions regime, which many jobcentre advisors (privately) opposed to the current UC system are very reluctant to impose on people, unless they are forced by thier managers to do so, as they know only too well “at first hand” the hardship that sanctions create

- in one way, I have no problem per se with the current requirements for claimants to prove that they are making serious efforts to look for work given thier personal circumstances and are not “dossing” but the fact remains that there are serious flaws in the current UC system and some of the current rules and requirements tend to be a little excessive and tend to lack compassion and empathy, as many jobcentre advisors know that people are doing all they can to look for work, especially in this online age - the requirement to spend (up to) 35 hours in job search related activity and/or to apply for a certain number of jobs per day/week needs review, again in this online age, which itself makes the job search more difficult, not easier - I “get” that people should be motivated to look for a job but this is a crude instrument and given the attitudes of society towards people who are out of work, it leads to that person hating on themselves as each month passes that they still have not found a job

because everything these days is online, regardless of one’s IT skills or anything else, it is of critical importance that any online jobsearch activity must not be carried out on your own without one to one supervision in a council or community run facility, such as in a job club right from the start, especially in the case of redundancy, where even if you have internet access from home, you are far better off physically going down in person accompanied by a friend well in advance of redundancy date to either citizens advice and/or to your local council housing office for one to one support, including with jobsearch - your ability to think rationally and in a common sense way is seriously compromised because of the unconsciously psychological effects of losing a job and at the start, you simply do not know what you are doing, even if you think you do, as you are being wrong and are deluded if you think otherwise, which as an older Irish gay man myself, I found out to my cost - back home in the old days in Ireland, many of the Catholic religious orders of Priests and Nuns would have helped people in this area and various charities need to be doing similar work to help people now

 

[Irish353.109]

Evening everyone.

Like lots of people, I have recently had the misfortune of becoming unemployed and needing to turn to the state for support - and I live in a UC area. The work coach has asked me a few times to record my jobsearch on my Universal Jobmatch account, which I am not happy to do as I have never allowed access. I quoted the regs at her which say claimants can record their jobsearch activity however they choose. Her favourite retort is "Well that was Jobseekers' Allowance, this is Universal Credit!"


However, I've just found this link to what are specifically Universal Credit regulations, and nothing has changed! See clauses J3102 - J3107:

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/562470/admj3.pdf


They still can't force you to show them your UJM account without the Data Protection Act changing (which obviously it hasn't), but many coaches, like the one I see, will try and kid on that that's now the only acceptable way of recording what you have done to look for work. My coach has blatantly lied that "Everybody HAS to use UJM to show what they've done", despite me repeatedly reminding her that that wasn't true, and what's more, she knew I knew.

But as these UC regs prove, they still accept any other methods - whether that's employer/employee correspondence; activity on UJM (only with consent); your written evidence or even your uncorroborated verbal evidence. The only difference is it doesn't have the same advice about how the coaches cannot force you to give access to UJM, but then that goes without saying - again, DPA.

So, basically everyone, if your UC coach gets pedantic about which benefit the rules apply to, this is ammunition they can't really argue with! Well, some might, but then you can ask if their boss is aware they are flouting the rules.

Hope this is useful.

I’ve gradually discovered over time that I might have Aspergers so trying to get a GP appointment for referral to mental health team for referral to specialist for formal diagnosis, which is more difficult in later life as they focus (quite rightly) on kids first - had been doing research into it a few years ago, noticed things about myself, people had said various things to me over the years, then the last time I was back home, a family friend who knows me from childhood who is interested in psychology (totally out of the blue) came out with it in general chit-chat and for once, it actually made total sense, even though I know how difficult it will be to get a GP referral at my age and might have to go private if I can’t get it on the NHS

- there must be a lot of people with this hidden disability in this area, as the council consistently tell people never to do jobsearch activity unsupervised by council staff in council run facilities and this is certainly been the advice I’ve been given right from the start of my redundancy from anyone in the council that I’ve spoken to - I was even advised (privately) by a council adviser to pretend to be disabled to keep the jobcentre off my back and to avoid sanctions

 

[LeytonCatLady]

I’ve gradually discovered over time that I might have Aspergers so trying to get a GP appointment for referral to mental health team for referral to specialist for formal diagnosis, which is more difficult in later life as they focus (quite rightly) on kids first - had been doing research into it a few years ago, noticed things about myself, people had said various things to me over the years, then the last time I was back home, a family friend who knows me from childhood who is interested in psychology (totally out of the blue) came out with it in general chit-chat and for once, it actually made total sense, even though I know how difficult it will be to get a GP referral at my age and might have to go private if I can’t get it on the NHS

- there must be a lot of people with this hidden disability in this area, as the council consistently tell people never to do jobsearch activity unsupervised by council staff in council run facilities and this is certainly been the advice I’ve been given right from the start of my redundancy from anyone in the council that I’ve spoken to - I was even advised (privately) by a council adviser to pretend to be disabled to keep the jobcentre off my back and to avoid sanctions

I hope you get some answers. Good luck!