Thimble Queen
Called away to another place
Wonder if she was paid for that?
Wondering the same thing.
Reclaim Brixton movement - meetings and April 25th protest planned
- Thread starter editor
- Start date
Wondering the same thing.
Thimble Queen
Called away to another place
Bit of an odd piece in terms of style as well. Hardly any quotes in it. Makes it read more like her version of the day than an 'objective' news report.
Stopped reading beyond "More than a 1,000 people....." 
I'd have guessed a few hundred, although that might be boosted if you counted everyone who was even there for 10 minutes, instead of the most people present at one time.Stopped reading beyond "More than a 1,000 people....."
BTW the amount of smalltime media people was rather large: It seemed to me that there were roughly half as many of them as there were of protestors in the first hour in Windrush Square.
newbie
undisambiguated
I enjoyed yesterday, it was good, old fashioned fun. And good to see a cross section (albeit fairly narrow) of the communities pulling together.
But two things troubled me.
"Whose Brixton, Our Brixton" chants and "Yuppies Out" sprayed on Foxtons both made me uncomfortable. I could characterise it by saying it looked rather like people who've been here 5 years attacking those who've been here 2. Or 10 & 5, 20 & 10, 40 & 20, don't get hung up on the numbers.
Brixton doesn't belong to people who've been here 5,10, 20, 40 years any more than those who've arrived in the last 2, 5, 10, 20 can be dismissed as yuppies. Blaming individuals is not the point as the (excellent) woman who seemed to do much of the compering from the gazebo was at pains to stress. If hers was the line agreed at the planning meeting and endorsed by the organised groups then its a shame it didn't get through to the people with the megaphones and the spray can, and those supporting them. Subculture(s) against subculture isn't going anywhere.
The other thing, well for those that remember the day, years ago, when RTS campaigners closed off the high st and there was a sandpit outside Morleys, it was like that. On that occasion I met an elderly lady with her shopping bags looking utterly defeated as she realised there were no buses and she'd have to walk. Yesterday two teenagers stood at the busstop (just after Foxtons lost its window) and one said the the other "I just want to go home, they're stealing my saturday".
There were members of an awful lot of Brixton communities walking past, taking no notice, ignoring and being ignored. If this is to make a difference, and I hope it does, they have to be engaged and their rights (for want of a better word) have to be considered. Not just in the abstract but properly, responsibly on future occasions like yesterday.
Alternatively, if it's just a party for hundreds or thousands of locals and their mates from far and wide, then fine, but the campaigns, the real, serious self-interest campaigns with a lot to lose, the ones prayed in aid throughout the day, they'll get little except harm from being associated with it.
But two things troubled me.
"Whose Brixton, Our Brixton" chants and "Yuppies Out" sprayed on Foxtons both made me uncomfortable. I could characterise it by saying it looked rather like people who've been here 5 years attacking those who've been here 2. Or 10 & 5, 20 & 10, 40 & 20, don't get hung up on the numbers.
Brixton doesn't belong to people who've been here 5,10, 20, 40 years any more than those who've arrived in the last 2, 5, 10, 20 can be dismissed as yuppies. Blaming individuals is not the point as the (excellent) woman who seemed to do much of the compering from the gazebo was at pains to stress. If hers was the line agreed at the planning meeting and endorsed by the organised groups then its a shame it didn't get through to the people with the megaphones and the spray can, and those supporting them. Subculture(s) against subculture isn't going anywhere.
The other thing, well for those that remember the day, years ago, when RTS campaigners closed off the high st and there was a sandpit outside Morleys, it was like that. On that occasion I met an elderly lady with her shopping bags looking utterly defeated as she realised there were no buses and she'd have to walk. Yesterday two teenagers stood at the busstop (just after Foxtons lost its window) and one said the the other "I just want to go home, they're stealing my saturday".
There were members of an awful lot of Brixton communities walking past, taking no notice, ignoring and being ignored. If this is to make a difference, and I hope it does, they have to be engaged and their rights (for want of a better word) have to be considered. Not just in the abstract but properly, responsibly on future occasions like yesterday.
Alternatively, if it's just a party for hundreds or thousands of locals and their mates from far and wide, then fine, but the campaigns, the real, serious self-interest campaigns with a lot to lose, the ones prayed in aid throughout the day, they'll get little except harm from being associated with it.
I didn't get that impression at all.
Whilst I agree in theory it's interesting how you have the skill to ascertain that those involved in the protest were from 'far and wide' whilst those wandering past were 'members of an awful lot of Brixton communities'.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Fairly obvious - stand around, showing locals exactly what the priorities of the criminal justice system are.
newbie
undisambiguated
it's not a skill, it's a personal observation. I have no problem with people from outside the area joining yesterdays protest, but I could observe that they were there. Of the three comments so far, two are from people who don't live in Brixton. I have no problem with that, it's just an observation.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Most of them find it hard to reach the vinegar strokes if they're not giving someone a beating, apparently.
newbie
undisambiguated
I haven't suggested any organisers are responsible. This medium allows for direct communication with people who were there and who will be there in future.
I wasn't on the protest so you're out of luck there I'm afraid.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
True, but they used to pretend to be there to look after everyone. Now they've dropped even the pretence.
newbie
undisambiguated
fair enough. Do you think the people in the newly done up flats in Rushcroft Road didn't get that impression? Or the ones who want to buy something Foxtons are selling?
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Really?
When you only get a visit from the OB if your gaff has been broken into, and stuff actually stolen - when they don't bother about theft from cars anymore, except to give you a crime number?
When you're much more likely to get police assistance if you're a posh shop, and get police hassle if you're a shop that serves the local community (including selling booze)?
When you only see police patrols on the "nice streets" and the town centre, and if you live on an estate you'll mostly only ever see a pair of PCSOs?
Get real. Most of our esteemed OB have wiped their cocks on many of the communities of Brixton.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
editor and Tricky Skills have done separate stories on Central Hill and Knights Walk. Also, IIRC, some Central Hill wallahs are working to get a website and a facebook page set up in the same way Cressingham Gdns has. Knights Walk is, from what I've heard, a bit less "active" because it's so small - less of a pool of talent to draw on.
David Clapson
Well-Known Member
Apologies in advance for this terribly despondent argument, but if there's no violence you get almost no coverage. If there's almost no coverage how do you go about building on what was achieved yesterday to get a good outcome? What's the process? I'm assuming your objective is rent controls and protection of social housing. How can you achieve that? Only the fringe parties support it, so voting won't work. You have to persuade central government to legislate and they just won't do it unless we create a crisis. Maybe a rent strike? I doubt enough people would participate. If it was a workable idea I've have thought the groups who came yesterday would be calling for it. It doesn't appear to be on anybody's agenda, which I find very disheartening. As I said upthread you could try to hurt the local property market by torching the tube station, the police station and Foxtons. That might just wind the clock back to when most white professionals dismissed Brixton as a dangerous ghetto. But realistically it's too extreme...you need a large number of fearless violent people and the risk of fatalities on both sides is too high.
Rioting is hateful but it deserves serious discussion because it gets results. The Chartists and Suffragettes used it to get the vote, the poll tax riot helped get Thatcher out and the 1981 Brixton riot resulted in lots of investment from central govt, which paid for the Rec amongst other things. It also gave Brixton the country's first community police consultative group and (allegedly) less tolerance of police racism and less stop and search.
editor
hiraethified
How do you instinctively know that someone is from outside the are?
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
I don't care what they think.
newbie
undisambiguated
I think that's an odd question to be perfectly honest, what difference does that minor observation make to the general point I made? Do you think it was wrong, are you going to claim every single person protesting was local? Even PM, as evidenced upthread? Anyway, I didn't say anything about instinctively.
But, to give a couple of examples, overhearing people asking for directions- "where are the arches", "where is the Village'.
newbie
undisambiguated
why not? They are, or may be about to become, part of the Brixton communities.
newbie
undisambiguated
What about the teens at the busstop? Do you care what they, and others born and bred locally, think when they hear some 22 year old from the Home Counties megaphoning "Whose Brixton, Our Brixton" along Atlantic Road?
< no, I don't know for sure, does it matter, somebody who heard the chanting was born and bred in the area>
< no, I don't know for sure, does it matter, somebody who heard the chanting was born and bred in the area>
Will gentrification not affect him too then?
You don't know what they may think about yesterday or anything else; go and speak with them then report back with additional information.
newbie
undisambiguated
I edited but you're faster than me. And ftr they were young women.
Of course gentrification will affect them. But that doesn't mean their own thoughts can be discounted. The chanting seems to me to exclude them. And yes, I really can tell the difference between people brought up locally and those who've arrived as adults.
But this suggests that a protest is only legitimate if every single person in the community has been consulted on it. which would be a logistical nightmare. I'm sure following Saturday a lot more people DO know about it and the issues than before it. That's the whole point of gathering together and making a lot of noise.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Just dropped a comment on the Brixton Blog piece asking the author to have a bit of self-respect.
newbie
undisambiguated
It's you that said "I don't care what they think.", not me.
Some of them post, or have posted here, or on the various blogs and so on. It doesn't matter whether I agree with them or loathe every view they hold I don't blame them personally for neo-liberalism, gentrification, our co-operative council or any of the other structural issues at the heart of yesterdays protest. Do you?
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