Orca kills keeper in Seaworld, Florida - cover up in progress

[smokedout]

it's a bogus argument you have there.

this thread is about the Orcas held captive for entertainment in an inadequate environment.
.

what about pigs held in far more inadequate environments for food

no biggie, im used to people getting angry with me because i dont eat meat

just pointing out a double standard thats all

 

[invisibleplanet]

what about pigs held in far more inadequate environments for food

no biggie, im used to people getting angry with me because i dont eat meat

just pointing out a double standard thats all

Make a thread about domesticated animal welfare. I don't care whether you eat meat or not, though obviously if you do eat meat, I'd prefer it if you didn't eat factory farmed meat.

This thread is about wild Orcas, captured for entertainment, one of whom (more than one actually) has killed their captor (the one who controls their food and sublimates their hunting instinct into 'tricks for dollars').

 

[smokedout]

Make a thread about domesticated animal welfare. I don't care whether you eat meat or not, though obviously if you do eat meat, I'd prefer it if you didn't eat factory farmed meat.

This thread is about wild Orcas, captured for entertainment, one of whom (more than one actually) has killed their captor (the one who controls their food and sublimates their hunting instinct into 'tricks for dollars').

so you dont think its relevant when someone points out that animals are routinely horrifically abused for food on a thread where people are concerned about animal abuse?

would you approve of factory farming whales?

 

[invisibleplanet]

is this thread about eating Orcas?

or is this thread about a wild Orca, captured aged 2, separated from it's mother & herd, transported thousands of miles, held in a tank too small, in unsuitable environmental conditions, forced to sublimate its hunting instinct into tricks for fish-scraps, that has killed humans in its proximity 3 times in the last 14 years.

like i said before - make a new thread about domesticated animal welfare, or discuss the actual thread - otherwise you're just being a troll.

 

[smokedout]

is this thread about eating Orcas?

or is this thread about a wild Orca, captured aged 2, separated from it's mother & herd, transported thousands of miles, held in a tank too small, in unsuitable environmental conditions forced to sublimate its hunting instinct into tricks for fish-scraps, that has killed humans in its proximity 3 times in the last 14 years.

like i said before - make a new thread about domesticated animal welfare - otherwise you're just being a troll.

no the thread diverged into a wider discussion about the ethics of using animals

someone pointed out that the orca had a far better existence than most farm animals and that it was a bit hypocritical to object to one and not the other

some people disagreed with that

is that such a problem for you, that a conversation may move on?

 

[invisibleplanet]

someone pointed out that the orca had a far better existence than most farm animals and that it was a bit hypocritical to object to one and not the other

Who pointed out that the Orca "had a far better existence than most farm animals" ?

There was a misunderstanding, with the captive Orca wrongly thought to have been domesticated (in it's own lifetime, no less!) and fallaciously equated with domesticated animals. Then another specious argument claimed that any meat eater had no right to complain about the treatment of wild Orcas in captivity, with the same person who'd tried to present those two fallacious arguments, also perversely expressing their lack of sympathy for the keeper who was killed by the captive wild Orca. You then came into the thread and sought to reinforce those first two specious arguments, then tried to equate captive wild Orcas held for entertainment with factory farming - another non-comparable argument which you claim expands the discussion, but which I look at as unsophisticated trolling.

The conversation isn't moving on - you're stuck on the same fallacious argument that was addressed by several different posters, several posts ago.

 

[smokedout]

You then came into the thread and sought to reinforce those first two specious arguments, then tried to equate captive wild Orcas held for entertainment with factory farming - another non-comparable argument which you claim expands the discussion, but which I look at as unsophisticated trolling.

you dont think it's relevent to compare one type of animal abuse to another?

 

[girasol]

what about pigs held in far more inadequate environments for food

no biggie, im used to people getting angry with me because i dont eat meat

just pointing out a double standard thats all

People get angry at you because you don't eat meat? Are you sure that's the real reason?

Maybe it's more to do with your vegetarian fundamentalism.

 

[smokedout]

People get angry at you because you don't eat meat? Are you sure that's the real reason?

Maybe it's more to do with your vegetarian fundamentalism.

far from it, i couldnt give a shit what anyone else thinks or eats

 

[stanie]

It's not pointless if you're killing it for food.

I agree, wrong choice of words, i should have said "needless".

The meat I eat isn't detrimental to human survival. It's reared in Britain on our glorious pasture-land. The game I eat isn't detrimental to human survival - it's reared in the wild, and sold in our local game shop (seasons over on pheasant now). The venison I eat is farmed locally. So is the Ostrich. I don't eat beef raised on land GM soya grown on land that used to be rainforest. The chicken I eat is organic free range (local) as are the eggs. I buy meat when I can afford it.

Ha ha, you fired out all the usual excuses there!

Heres why the meat you eat and the milk you drink IS detrimental to humans;
http://www.earthsave.org/globalwarming.htm

The animals that you are eating have been fed with feed from, was it local? I very much doubt it.

http://www.springerlink.com/content/wr27g1h43h234425/

http://redmeatindustryforum.org.uk/supplychain/BeefProduction.htm

"For every kilogram of high-quality animal protein produced, livestock are fed nearly 6 kg of plant protein."

The above makes no sense to somebody who claims their diet is not detrimental.

The milk cows were born between 3 and 7 years ago. Cows don't have calves until they're two. The mutton I eat is old sheep, which tastes better than lamb, in my opinion. Do you want to know something? Your argument is pants.

Ok, 3 to 7 on the farm you visit (so you say) tho its more like 3-5 years old when they are no longer good for milk production. The average age for a cow to live in its natural state would be around 25 years.
Do you want to know something? Your guilt is hilarious! You are SO defensive which is the obvious sign of a guilty conscience

You'd like to think there is, but I'm not eating Orca, last time I looked. I'm eating British-reared animals, raised organically, mostly local. It's all sustainable. There's no conflict between me eating flesh and speaking out about the ill-treatment of a wild animal that's being held captive in an inadequate environment for entertainment. It's not like any of the animals I eat are kept in unnatural environments.

Cows arent native to the uk, so, hardly a natural environment for them.
The fact that you cannot see the hypocrisy in your above statement really makes me wonder if its worth debating with you, you are so far behind.

So when are you actually going to comment on the thread, rather than this pathetic stance of yours which says no-one who eats meat has the right to speak out about how wrong it is to take wild Orcas by force from their natural habitat, and use them in a multi-million entertainment industry.

What do you think ive been doing? Youre making yourself look stupid, id take a stab at too much red meat!

Food, fire, water, shelter. Essentials of survival.

Watching a overgrown fish do tricks.

Not in the same ballpark let alone league.

Many people "survive" without eating meat. Its unnecessary.

I don't eat baby animals. Eggs don't count btw, the ones I eat can't become chicks because they haven't been fertilised.

You eat a cow at 2 years old, a cow that would naturally live to about 25. Id say that cow was still a baby

Are you saying that only vegetarians have the right to complain about the capture and imprisonment of wild Orcas to provide 'entertainment' to fee-paying customers of a multi-million dollar industry?

Of course not, im saying people who express concern about incarcerated animals, yet still have animals incarcerated ,and then killed for their selfish egos, are coming across as very hypocritical.

do you need to eat veg for food? When you could be sparing millions of plant lives by eating meat and taking supplements.

Theres always one. Welcome!

smokedout's such a troll! he's devastated and depopulated countless insect habitats with his greedy devouring of plants. he's causing positive harm with his insatiable gluttony. he's a true fiend, this smokedout character.

ok, i think you just pitched the level of your argument quite well

Agreed, invisibleplanet is suffering with a severe guilty conscience, which inevitably leads to crass statements.

what about pigs held in far more inadequate environments for food

no biggie, im used to people getting angry with me because i dont eat meat

just pointing out a double standard thats all

People always feel threatened by people who refuse to eat meat, this thread shows this only too well.

People get angry at you because you don't eat meat? Are you sure that's the real reason?

Maybe it's more to do with your vegetarian fundamentalism.

Uh.....maybe you should re-read what youve just typed, because you questioned that people may not be getting angry at him/her because they are a vegetarian, and suggested it may be because s/he is a fundementalist*
VEGETARIAN ha ha ha

*Would you care to explain what you mean by this word?