Mrs Magpie
On a bit of break...
I am sceptical about this...there is a precedent for my scepticism....I wish I had a quid for every time I have been told the Barrier Block was accidentally built upside-down........Bob said:
Meeting on Secondary school in Brixton
- Thread starter Gramsci
- Start date
Mrs Magpie said:I am sceptical about this...there is a precedent for my scepticism....I wish I had a quid for every time I have been told the Barrier Block was accidentally built upside-down........
There's an African tree that looks very odd indeed called a Baobab (picture here http://www.webpro.co.za/tutor/backgrnd/) and the local legend somewhere is that the trees were walking around and doing very naughty things until God got annoyed and picked them up and put them in the ground upside down to stop them walking around. Perhaps that's what happened to the barrier block
My neighbour could well be slightly paranoid - she's spent a lot of her life as an active individual dealing with Lambeth council so is probably right to be paranoid. And the residents of Dolphin Square are very powerful. Still it's a nice story that appeals to me...
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
Bob said:Didn't see this at first so hadn't replied to it, bu I can't find anything quickly but it's clear from the thing below that the Lib Dem Education Spokesman Phil Willis MP is fairly anti Academies - though of course the council have to deal with what they are allowed to do by central government.
http://www.parliament.the-stationery-office.co.uk/pa/cm199900/cmstand/f/st000606/am/00606s01.htm
On your second comment I'm slightly mystified as to what you mean
Good to see that their has been debate on the issues of Academies.Some of the questions Willis was asking were good.I fail to see any evidence presented by New Labour that City Academies will be any better than "bog standard" Comprehensives.
Its a pity the issue of City Academies has not been debated more locally.Is a City Academy the kind of school people want?It looks to me that for all the talk about "diversity" in education people have no choice as the only funding is for City Academies.
"Diversity" one of those catch all meaningless words beloved of New Labour.
My second point is that as Coldharbour/Brixton is always a Labour area it does not politically matter so much about school provision here.Other area of Lambeth are more likely places for Lib/Dem seats.
Mrs Magpie said:
I thought you were the champion of the marginalised....who more marginalised than people with learning disabilities? So they get shoved aside but Carlton Mansions saved? Is it because the residents of Carlton Mansions are cooler or something?
No, the only architecturally worthwhile thing on that site is Carlton. And they are homes. Mrs M, I don't care about what's "cool" - if you really think that you don't know me too well do you. But I do care about shitty buildings.
The other buildings are less than shit. Whether the disability thing goes or stays (and yeah that site may prove unsuitable for a school/maybe imagination could fix it/Shakespeare Rd may be a better option), that building should go.
It's the admin's (Lambeth's) will that's the problem. Lots of problems and delays with this Lib Dem/com administration lately. Some of the councillors really seem to be obstructing good things.
Gramsci said:
The Coucil organised separate public meetings to discuss the proposed secondary schools/city academies in West Norwood and Brixton last year as part of the LEA's consultation process.
The purpose of the Brixton meeting (held at the Town Hall on 20th November '03) was to "provide information on City Academy initiatives and give people the opportunity to say what kind of school they would like for their own area." If memory serves me correctly there were presentations followed by 'focus group' style sessions.
Cllr Bottrall and representatives from the LEA, DfES and City Academies Unit all attended.
Mrs Magpie
On a bit of break...
I care more about people than buildings. The training centre provides work for people with learning disabilities. That is hugely important. To people with Learning Disabilities having work rather than sitting around in dreadful day centres is really important. It's about gaining respect and a sense of worth when the vast majority of people see them as worthless, useless and beneath respect. For people who can choose whether to work or whether to sign on or do whatever, I think there is a lack of understanding about how important and defining employment is if you have a disability, particularly a learning disability.hatboy said:
eme
turn a frown upside down!
What;s the deal with the school (empty) on Effra Parade?
Can they not use a previous school site (with playground!) rather than kick out whichever services - training, water, refuse - that are on the sites which are currently being talked about?
(sorry if this has been discussed before...)
Can they not use a previous school site (with playground!) rather than kick out whichever services - training, water, refuse - that are on the sites which are currently being talked about?
(sorry if this has been discussed before...)
Mrs Magpie
On a bit of break...
The school on Effra Parade, iirc, is a Primary and a lot more space is needed for a secondary...I think also Effra School is earmarked for something else.....can't remember what...maybe it was earmarked for a sell-off 
<edited to add>
The water site has underground resevoirs which can be built on I believe......
<edited to add>
The water site has underground resevoirs which can be built on I believe......
eme
turn a frown upside down!
Mrs Magpie said:The school on Effra Parade, iirc, is a Primary and a lot more space is needed for a secondary...I think also Effra School is earmarked for something else.....can't remember what...maybe it was earmarked for a sell-off
really?
it's huge!...thinking.... actually there *is* a little archway on the righthand side of the street saying Primary School but opposite that is a school building that looks at least 800 - 1000 capacity... surely too big a primary school....
anyhow... sorry to digress...
Mrs Magpie
On a bit of break...
A secondary school site needs to be about 6 point something acres......The site on Somerleyton is about 3 if that gives you a comparison....I can't picture the school on Effra Parade at all......all I can conjure up in my head is contemporary photos of WWII bomb damage.....not much help, I know.....
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
charcol said:
Yes And I went to one of these meetings.The meeting was so organised as to not allow questions from the floor as this was not on the agenda.Their was a rather biased description of City Academies the DfES.No alternative opinions were given a space.The focus groups were a farce.I was in one dealing with where a school should be situated.It was supposed to be brainstorming,When one person suggested a place they were told that was not a reasonable suggestion.
These consultation meetings are a time wasting farce.
Some parents there tried to bring up the issue that schools had been sold off.They were told that this was all in the past and that we should "move on".
I think it should be a capital offence to use the phrase "move on".
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
eme said:really?
thinking.... actually there *is* a little archway on the righthand side of the street saying Primary School but opposite that is a school building that looks at least 800 - 1000 capacity... surely too big a primary school....
anyhow... sorry to digress...
The Effra school was closed a while ago under New Labour administration.Then the Lib/Dem Tory administration took over.Their was a campaign for the Council to keep the site.They decided to sell it to a property developer.
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
Saw letter in SLP today from the Lambeth Teachers Association see here:
http://icsouthlondon.icnetwork.co.uk/letters/ and click on letter "Urgent need for schools"
Th letter is critical of the City Academy initiative.The letter states (correctly) that "they are not accountable to the local community" and that at meetings they have attended its clear that parents want "mixed non denominational comprehensive schools".
At the end the letter states that "Our union will be supporting the lobby of the Council meeting on Monday,June 14th at 6pm and urges teachers and parents to join."
http://icsouthlondon.icnetwork.co.uk/letters/ and click on letter "Urgent need for schools"
Th letter is critical of the City Academy initiative.The letter states (correctly) that "they are not accountable to the local community" and that at meetings they have attended its clear that parents want "mixed non denominational comprehensive schools".
At the end the letter states that "Our union will be supporting the lobby of the Council meeting on Monday,June 14th at 6pm and urges teachers and parents to join."
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
The Guardian have suggested a competition for ideas for parents to raise 10 million to buy two school sites.(they are joking)This is after Keith Hill MP told them to "investigate various creative approaches" 
to raise money themselves.
http://education.guardian.co.uk/egweekly/story/0,5500,1233137,00.html
to raise money themselves.http://education.guardian.co.uk/egweekly/story/0,5500,1233137,00.html
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
Received an email from SSCIL today here is some of it,
"We need you and all your family to come to a demonstration this Monday 14th June at 6:30 outside the Town Hall...SSCIL and the Mandela School Foundation have moved Heaven and Earth to make possible the new schools that Brixton and Herne hill need,and if Lambeth Council would pay just a few million pounds we could have the schools...But they wont unless we all unite and demand the money.The LEA have just this week officially recommended that Lambeth Council spend exactly nothing.
The Executive of the Council,which meets on Monday 14th,can reject this outrageous recommendation,and instruct the LEA to change its position.It can say that the Council should buy the land needed for the new schools.Or it can condemn local children to perpetual unfair and brutal competition for places.
£10 million spent by Lambeth now will bring £64million in the form of new secondary schools for children who have none...this £10million would buy us a stunning oppurtunity to get things right for the local children but the "professionals" still obviously lay odds that we in Lambeth will lwt this money and oppurtunity slip through our fingers and that crummy business as usual will prevail in Lambeth.
This is decision time.If they dont vote the money,we will probably lose the chance for excellant new schools.We know that the £4million sponsorship money promised to us if we can secure the sites will walk off to other London boroughs that dont expect their children to endure failure forever."
"We need you and all your family to come to a demonstration this Monday 14th June at 6:30 outside the Town Hall...SSCIL and the Mandela School Foundation have moved Heaven and Earth to make possible the new schools that Brixton and Herne hill need,and if Lambeth Council would pay just a few million pounds we could have the schools...But they wont unless we all unite and demand the money.The LEA have just this week officially recommended that Lambeth Council spend exactly nothing.
The Executive of the Council,which meets on Monday 14th,can reject this outrageous recommendation,and instruct the LEA to change its position.It can say that the Council should buy the land needed for the new schools.Or it can condemn local children to perpetual unfair and brutal competition for places.
£10 million spent by Lambeth now will bring £64million in the form of new secondary schools for children who have none...this £10million would buy us a stunning oppurtunity to get things right for the local children but the "professionals" still obviously lay odds that we in Lambeth will lwt this money and oppurtunity slip through our fingers and that crummy business as usual will prevail in Lambeth.
This is decision time.If they dont vote the money,we will probably lose the chance for excellant new schools.We know that the £4million sponsorship money promised to us if we can secure the sites will walk off to other London boroughs that dont expect their children to endure failure forever."
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
Saint Bottrall is at it again 
He now accuse SSCIL of being out of touch with reality-whatever that is in the Lib/Dem universe
http://www.streathamguardian.co.uk/news/localnews/display.var.491199.a_parody_of_reality.php
He now accuse SSCIL of being out of touch with reality-whatever that is in the Lib/Dem universe http://www.streathamguardian.co.uk/news/localnews/display.var.491199.a_parody_of_reality.php
Mrs Magpie
On a bit of break...
I'm going to C&P that SSCIL demo info into a new thread, gramsci......
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
I think half the trouble is that the Council is really a business with the budget of a small country.When a particular administration gets into power they often start to sound like managers.U now how it is with business types.They reel off the usual excuse why your wages/conditions cant improve.Blaming the economy/Government etc.If you complain to much its then you who has the attitude problem/its your fault for doing the job/your not being resonable.
I was listening to the radio to a couple of politicians saying that Councillors should be paid more to attract people with the "skills" to do it-it was a professional job in their view.
The problem with this is that democracy is supposed to give the people representation and some control over their lives.IMO Councillors arent supposed to be middle management.
I was listening to the radio to a couple of politicians saying that Councillors should be paid more to attract people with the "skills" to do it-it was a professional job in their view.
The problem with this is that democracy is supposed to give the people representation and some control over their lives.IMO Councillors arent supposed to be middle management.
lang rabbie
Je ne regrette les gazebos
The Report that went to Monday night's meeting of the Council executive eventually found its way onto the Lambeth website
Expanding Access to Secondary Schools Provision Update
There is also the Council's spin at
Council to examine potential sites for new schools in Lambeth
Expanding Access to Secondary Schools Provision Update
There is also the Council's spin at
Council to examine potential sites for new schools in Lambeth
Mrs Magpie
On a bit of break...
Well for an appalling piece of spin read this, in last weeks SLP.
Sorry can't link to it for some reason, so I've C&Ped it.
We will work to provide schools
Jun 25 2004
BELIEVE it or not, the current shortage of secondary school places is part of a Lambeth success story. It's the story of improving standards in the borough's excellent existing secondary schools.
In terms of "value added" between Key Stages 3 and 4, Lambeth comes fourth in nationwide league tables. The schools are also continuing to improve more quickly than the national average, which is why demand for places is now so high.
The challenge for our whole community is that all our secondary schools are now over-subscribed. We believe it is vital that all kids in the borough have the choice of being educated locally, and they deserve better than how national government has treated them so far.
Providing schools means forming a partnership, which is why we welcome the positive engagement we have had with local parents.
We'll now have to work together, including lobbying the Government, to deliver the new secondary schools we all want to see in Brixton and the borough as a whole. As well as working on plans for new secondary schools, we've already added 90 places at three schools and provided an extra 150 sixth form places.
We'll also be working with Lambeth's secondary schools to see if together we can provide yet more Year 7 places at our existing schools.
It's a shame that Lambeth's record under Labour between 1998 and 2002 was one of closing primary schools. While in office, Labour failed to add any new secondary school places. It looks to me like they clearly didn't care about Brixton, otherwise they would have taken action when they had the chance. If Labour had listened to parents, then the shortage of places could have been tackled a lot sooner.
Councillor Peter Truesdale
Leader of Lambeth council
Sorry can't link to it for some reason, so I've C&Ped it.
We will work to provide schools
Jun 25 2004
BELIEVE it or not, the current shortage of secondary school places is part of a Lambeth success story. It's the story of improving standards in the borough's excellent existing secondary schools.
In terms of "value added" between Key Stages 3 and 4, Lambeth comes fourth in nationwide league tables. The schools are also continuing to improve more quickly than the national average, which is why demand for places is now so high.
The challenge for our whole community is that all our secondary schools are now over-subscribed. We believe it is vital that all kids in the borough have the choice of being educated locally, and they deserve better than how national government has treated them so far.
Providing schools means forming a partnership, which is why we welcome the positive engagement we have had with local parents.
We'll now have to work together, including lobbying the Government, to deliver the new secondary schools we all want to see in Brixton and the borough as a whole. As well as working on plans for new secondary schools, we've already added 90 places at three schools and provided an extra 150 sixth form places.
We'll also be working with Lambeth's secondary schools to see if together we can provide yet more Year 7 places at our existing schools.
It's a shame that Lambeth's record under Labour between 1998 and 2002 was one of closing primary schools. While in office, Labour failed to add any new secondary school places. It looks to me like they clearly didn't care about Brixton, otherwise they would have taken action when they had the chance. If Labour had listened to parents, then the shortage of places could have been tackled a lot sooner.
Councillor Peter Truesdale
Leader of Lambeth council
Mrs Magpie
On a bit of break...
Here is my reply which is in the SLP hard copy, but not on their website.....they changed it a little bit, so this is the letter as I sent it, not as they printed it.....
Sir;
It is not often I am reduced to apopleptic rage, but Cllr Peter Truesdale (Letters 25th June) managed to reduce me to a spluttering fury with his statement that 'the current shortage of secondary school places is part of 'a Lambeth success story.'
This man is truly the master of spin, and I can only assume he doesn't have school-age children or is so cynical that he doesn't mind making statements that will reduce Lambeth parents to a state of righteous fury.
Is it part of a 'Lambeth success story' that I know of children who travel to such far flung places as Chessington and Feltham for a secondary school education because of a lack of places within Lambeth?
Is it a 'Lambeth success story' that parents have had to raise money to provide adequate future secondary education for their children because of the dire shortage of places available in the borough?
Is it a 'Lambeth success story that I had to send my eldest child to school outside the borough because of the lack of places in Lambeth?
Is it a 'Lambeth success story' that my middle child had to go to a single-sex religious school because of the lack of co-ed secular school places in Lambeth?
Is it a 'Lambeth success story' that my youngest child (one of the very few Lambeth children in a co-ed secular Lambeth school) cannot take History at GCSE because of a lack of staff to offer it as a subject?
I don't think so.
I think it is part of Lambeth's continuing failure (whatever the political complexion of those in past or present administrations) that the talent of Lambeth children is leaching out of the borough, and that the parents of Lambeth children have to mount demonstrations to draw attention to the pathetic effort so far made to give our children the education that they require and deserve and, moreover, that we have paid for.
Shame on you Cllr Truesdale for even imagining that we would be stupid enough to receive your statement with anything other than howls of derision.
I've won a pen for my trouble!
Sir;
It is not often I am reduced to apopleptic rage, but Cllr Peter Truesdale (Letters 25th June) managed to reduce me to a spluttering fury with his statement that 'the current shortage of secondary school places is part of 'a Lambeth success story.'
This man is truly the master of spin, and I can only assume he doesn't have school-age children or is so cynical that he doesn't mind making statements that will reduce Lambeth parents to a state of righteous fury.
Is it part of a 'Lambeth success story' that I know of children who travel to such far flung places as Chessington and Feltham for a secondary school education because of a lack of places within Lambeth?
Is it a 'Lambeth success story' that parents have had to raise money to provide adequate future secondary education for their children because of the dire shortage of places available in the borough?
Is it a 'Lambeth success story that I had to send my eldest child to school outside the borough because of the lack of places in Lambeth?
Is it a 'Lambeth success story' that my middle child had to go to a single-sex religious school because of the lack of co-ed secular school places in Lambeth?
Is it a 'Lambeth success story' that my youngest child (one of the very few Lambeth children in a co-ed secular Lambeth school) cannot take History at GCSE because of a lack of staff to offer it as a subject?
I don't think so.
I think it is part of Lambeth's continuing failure (whatever the political complexion of those in past or present administrations) that the talent of Lambeth children is leaching out of the borough, and that the parents of Lambeth children have to mount demonstrations to draw attention to the pathetic effort so far made to give our children the education that they require and deserve and, moreover, that we have paid for.
Shame on you Cllr Truesdale for even imagining that we would be stupid enough to receive your statement with anything other than howls of derision.
I've won a pen for my trouble!
It is on the website, under 'Letter of the Week' here and here.
Nice call and response - Hallelujah sister!
This issue was raised at Brixton Area Committee on Wednesday. Cllr Bottrell and the Education Director were present. Apparently a fourth site is under consideration, Glenn Brook in Clapham Park, which Cllr Bottrell says is just 5 mins walk from the prison. The Labour councillors were of course full of rightousness and attempted to pin Bottrell down to committing some of the £27m 'windfall' to a new school. Bottrell, who appears a decent enough bloke but hopeless at making his case, resisted this.
Nice call and response - Hallelujah sister!
This issue was raised at Brixton Area Committee on Wednesday. Cllr Bottrell and the Education Director were present. Apparently a fourth site is under consideration, Glenn Brook in Clapham Park, which Cllr Bottrell says is just 5 mins walk from the prison. The Labour councillors were of course full of rightousness and attempted to pin Bottrell down to committing some of the £27m 'windfall' to a new school. Bottrell, who appears a decent enough bloke but hopeless at making his case, resisted this.
Mrs Magpie
On a bit of break...
Thanks pooka...I actually had steam coming from my ears when I wrote it...righteous fury has a metre all of it's own......pooka said:
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
Excellant letter Mrs M-what is the prize 
The SSCIL have been saying that part of the windfall should be used to buy new sites in Brixton.This has been taken up by the Labour Councillors.The thing about the windfall is that is is money with no strings attached.Its a repayment of money by Central government that LBL overpaid to Central government.Therefore Lambeth,if they used some of this windfall to buy new sites would not have to raid other budgets or cut other services.
First time ive heard about the other Clapham site.Wonder what this is all about?
Truesdales letter in SLP correctly reflects the attitude of the present administration.When he says he wants parents to work in "partnership" then that means being "reasonable" in Council terms.Why should they?As Mrs M letter points out their are serious problems with education provision in LBL.It not up to parents to be reasonable.
The SSCIL have been saying that part of the windfall should be used to buy new sites in Brixton.This has been taken up by the Labour Councillors.The thing about the windfall is that is is money with no strings attached.Its a repayment of money by Central government that LBL overpaid to Central government.Therefore Lambeth,if they used some of this windfall to buy new sites would not have to raid other budgets or cut other services.
First time ive heard about the other Clapham site.Wonder what this is all about?
Truesdales letter in SLP correctly reflects the attitude of the present administration.When he says he wants parents to work in "partnership" then that means being "reasonable" in Council terms.Why should they?As Mrs M letter points out their are serious problems with education provision in LBL.It not up to parents to be reasonable.
Mrs Magpie
On a bit of break...
According to them, "a stylish pen"....I shall be waiting with baited breath for it to arrive.Gramsci said:
<edited to add>
AAAARRRGGGHHH I never used to spell it 'baited' till I started coming on this site!
bated
bated
bated
Gramsci said:Excellant letter Mrs M-what is the prize
The SSCIL have been saying that part of the windfall should be used to buy new sites in Brixton.This has been taken up by the Labour Councillors.The thing about the windfall is that is is money with no strings attached.Its a repayment of money by Central government that LBL overpaid to Central government.Therefore Lambeth,if they used some of this windfall to buy new sites would not have to raid other budgets or cut other services.
First time ive heard about the other Clapham site.Wonder what this is all about?
Yes, your right about the repayment. It is new money, no strings tied and hard for the Council to get away from that. Though anyone who's managed a big budget knows that in the course of the year, there will be variance swings of that magnitude anyway within the budget - hence the usual 'spend up' in the public sector at year ends, for example.
Glenn Brook is an existing school within Clapham Park, which is in a bit of a state. But it would need the agreement of the parents on the estate if it;s to become an Academy and (according to Cllr Meldrum) the plans for Clapham Park mean extra kids there anyway, so its not clear there will be room for Brixton kids.
There was also much talk about what the sponsor does and doesn't want. Like you, Gramsci, I found it disturbing that some well heeled bod should be able to dictate the terms, for so small an input.
That said, I thought the indignation of the Labour group a bit brass necked given how eagerly they sold off the sites in the first place.
Mrs Magpie
On a bit of break...
I don't think any of the parties who have been in power previously in Lambeth have done schools any favours at all. I'm pretty pissed off at the way the whole sodding lot of them, past and present, score cheap political points at the lasting expense of our children and have all made disastrous decisions.pooka said:
I'm amazed parents haven't actually mounted a coup with their kids, St Trinian's stylee!
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
I agree with Pooka and Mrs M on the Labour party line.I got SLP to see Mrs M letter and next to it is one from Steve Reed (Labour Group Leader).Its as annoying as Truesdales last week.
See here http://icsouthlondon.icnetwork.co.uk/letters/
click on letter "Breathtaking indifferance"
1)He state that the Lb/Dems have failed to get new secondary school places and that the City Academy in Claphman was started by the last Labour Administration.He omits to say sorry that the last Labour administration messed up by selling off school sites.
2)He states that Bottrall said that the Council did not want to work with the Government because it would not control the Academies.Not correct.At the Executive meeting Bottrall said that he didnt see why the Council should spend its money on school sites when the CAs would be outside the control of the Council.He was arguing that the central Government should put more money in to help buy good sites.
3)He also says that parents just want new schools and dont care who runs them.I dont think this is entirely accurate.At the Executive meeting Cllr Cattermole(Labour-education spokesperson)did state that not everyone agreed that CAs were the best way forward.Its more that desparate parents will accept any type of school as long as the funding for it .Thats why their has not been more debate on the type of school.
However if one reads SSCIL and Mrs Ms letter its clear to me that what a lot of people want in Lambeth are Co educational secular schools without selection.Sounds to me that in New Labour terms a lot of parents are still wedded to bog standard Comprehensive education.Schools that provide for and are part of the local community.Schools that cater for all abilites and interests.
See here http://icsouthlondon.icnetwork.co.uk/letters/
click on letter "Breathtaking indifferance"
1)He state that the Lb/Dems have failed to get new secondary school places and that the City Academy in Claphman was started by the last Labour Administration.He omits to say sorry that the last Labour administration messed up by selling off school sites.
2)He states that Bottrall said that the Council did not want to work with the Government because it would not control the Academies.Not correct.At the Executive meeting Bottrall said that he didnt see why the Council should spend its money on school sites when the CAs would be outside the control of the Council.He was arguing that the central Government should put more money in to help buy good sites.
3)He also says that parents just want new schools and dont care who runs them.I dont think this is entirely accurate.At the Executive meeting Cllr Cattermole(Labour-education spokesperson)did state that not everyone agreed that CAs were the best way forward.Its more that desparate parents will accept any type of school as long as the funding for it .Thats why their has not been more debate on the type of school.
However if one reads SSCIL and Mrs Ms letter its clear to me that what a lot of people want in Lambeth are Co educational secular schools without selection.Sounds to me that in New Labour terms a lot of parents are still wedded to bog standard Comprehensive education.Schools that provide for and are part of the local community.Schools that cater for all abilites and interests.
