Loughborough Junction public space improvements - consultation begins
- Thread starter Leo Chesterton
- Start date
bimble
floofy
Yes, and they should listen to you and disregard all objections recorded to date because your view on things is clearly more valid and has the gravitas to outweigh those of the 748 people who signed the petition against the closures, plus the 446 on the change.org one, plus etc and anon.
Winot
I wholeheartedley agree with your viewpoint
Oh come on, democracy isn't a case of blindly following petitions.
Why are you so against giving it some time to settle in and the seeing what the outcome is?
bimble
floofy
I feel really misunderstood!
It's true that I think the choice of closing Loughborough Road, the only big road here, is a really bad choice.
Also true that personally I'm negatively impacted because diverted traffic comes past my home on Flaxman Rd, which was quiet.
But honestly, what I really feel strongly about is the failure of consultation and the fact that Lambeth are unable to carry out the consultation they promised because they sacked the communications department which would have dealt with this due to budget cuts.
It's true that I think the choice of closing Loughborough Road, the only big road here, is a really bad choice.
Also true that personally I'm negatively impacted because diverted traffic comes past my home on Flaxman Rd, which was quiet.
But honestly, what I really feel strongly about is the failure of consultation and the fact that Lambeth are unable to carry out the consultation they promised because they sacked the communications department which would have dealt with this due to budget cuts.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Mid-60s, rather than 1980, was when it was first quantified. What I found interesting is that gentrification (in modern terminology) has progressively become more rapid in "converting" areas. back in the early '70s when Battersea started to be gentrified the pace was slow enough that Battersea itself wasn't seen as gentrified until the mid '90s. Probably the biggest difference between then and now (besides the impacts of investment buying and BtL) is that the state (in the form of local government) now openly colludes with developers to re-purpose social housing and gerrymander local demography into something more suitable to the state's needs.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
The meaning has been modified over time, as has the meaning of the term "regeneration".
CH1
"Red Guard"(NLYL)
Ironically she sounds like precisely the type of person enforcing this traffic ban.
CH1
"Red Guard"(NLYL)
I would say gentrification in Brixton started in the early 1980s with the Housing Action Areas where £30,000 council grants (a lot in those days) were available for rehabilitating street properties in designated areas - such as Saltoun Road, Railton Road, Effra Parade and no doubt many more.
Houses which cost £12,000 were transformed into full spec state of the art dwellings fetching £85,000 all with the aid of a council grant.
Certainly gave a major boost to Brixton - and it was originally a Labour scheme before Right to Buy was promoted.
teuchter
je suis teuchter
No they should not disregard objections because "my view on things is more valid".
I said they should disregard objections that amount to claims of negative effects having arisen as a consequence of something that hasn't happened yet.
Likewise, if I wrote in to say that the closures have had such and such a positive effect, before they had actually been enforced and been given time to settle down, then they should disregard that too.
CH1
"Red Guard"(NLYL)
Well sort of ultra-bourgois(e). Making a car trip for family reasons going equipped with gardening tools. Need I say more?
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
The decision to start this scheme was decided by the Council. It was not a decision of LJAG.
So whats the real issue here?
From what I can see the road closure scheme is tangled up with other issues. Such as the Farm and LJAG apparent influence with the Council compared to other local groups.
The Council is the body which takes decisions. Its elected Cllrs are finally responsible.
If the Council has been listening to one group (LJAG) and not other resident groups in the area then its the Council who should be criticised.
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
And that email you got from the officer who is overseeing the this traffic project was interesting. For an officer he is unusually frank.
Its an important issue that the "Coop" Council cannot in reality do consultation.
Why I am concerned that Council think they can choose groups like LJAG and in Brixton- Brixton Green to do this for them.
Its not how things should be done.
bimble
floofy
Exactly. And because Lambeth latch onto LJAG as a way of outsourcing consultation, and because LJAG is not representative of a real cross-section of the local demographic, the feeling of division here gets deeper the divide entrenched.
ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
A few parallels, although I will also admit there are differences.
I live in an area of Loughborough Junction not far from the station and not far from the hospital. For many, many years this was free-for-all on road parking. Many mornings were ridiculous when out of town commuters would drive in from the surrounding suburbs and start arriving from 6am so that they could park before catching the train from LJ or Denmark Hill, or work at the hospital. On two occasions I saw people fighting over a parking space.
And then Lambeth proposed introducing a limited CPZ (2 hours per day, 12pm-2pm).
Some residents supported this, some didn’t. Fair enough, particularly as we would have to do something that historically we hadn’t had to do - to pay to park outside our own houses (which we often couldn’t do anyway, given the weight of commuter traffic).
People wrote to Lambeth, from outside the area, opposing the CPZ. Comments included, ‘I need to park on xxx Road because I live in Croydon and need to drive and park near a station’, or ‘What will happen if people who work at the hospital can’t park near it? Patients will die’. Or ‘I need to park near the hospital so I can take my children to appointments there’.
To this day, I’ve not heard of any patients dying because a CPZ zone was introduced. Nor have a seen a rise in unemployment rates in Croydon because people couldn’t drive in. Neither has there been a fall in outpatient appointments at Kings’.
What’s the purpose of this? Yes, there was inconvenience for some people, because they had to do things differently. But ultimately, no one, quite literally, died because of a change in driving behaviours. And sure enough, car drivers adapted. Some would have found new places to park, inconveniencing local residents, and some local residents will have be inconvenienced because something they were used to (free parking) was taken away. But if you ask anyone in the Herne Hill or LJ area, do they want to go back to the days of pre-CPZ and heavy local congestion, I can guarantee you will find no one who supports this.
Car drivers can change behaviours when they have to. It won’t be the end of the world.
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ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
This complainant is particularly puzzling. Why, if you're driving from Dulwich Village to Stockwell (I've centered this destination on Stockwell tube, would you go down Loughborugh Road anyway?
Dulwich Village to Half Moon Lane.
Half Moon Lane to East Dulwich Road
Dulwich Road to Brixton Water Lane
Brixton Water Lane to Brixton Hill
Brixton to Stockwell
Shorter than going on a circuitous route through Loughborough Junction.
CH1
"Red Guard"(NLYL)
Surely up Red Post Hill, down Herne Hill Road, all the way round the Loughborough Road dog leg and down Robsart Street would be more direct?
Just a suggestion on why or what might be going on there.
CH1
"Red Guard"(NLYL)
Must have happened years ago?
I hate my own CPZ in the Loughborough Park area of Coldharbour Lane because it makes it difficult to get unplanned maintenance done to the house.
I don't drive or have a car - but I noticed that the zealot who plagued the council to bring it in (back in the late 1980s) was one of those insisting on the right to park HER car outside HER house.
ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
Don't know if it's shorter but you'd be going through the centre of Brixton, which is always clogged up.
Red Post Hill, Herne Hill Rd, Loughborough Rd, Robsart St for me.
Even if you take Loughborough Rd out of the picture, you'd probably be better off going CHL, Gresham Rd, Stockwell Rd.
prunus
Tick tock.
Not that long ago - I remember it coming in and I've only been here since 2001. Frankly I support it absolutely - it was ridiculous the number of commuters that used to come in at 8am-ish and fill all the streets ram-full, the inconvenience of having to have a supply of visitors' permits to hand is nothing in comparison. What's needed now is to extend it to Sundays too, but that's another story.
I think you'd find that if your CPZ was rescinded it would be just as impossible to park near you - worse in fact as it would be all day and no permit would help - as your street would be rammed full of said commuters (as there's nowhere else un-zoned anywhere nearby). Really is the lesser of two evils.
ChrisSouth
Well-Known Member
Or, West Dulwich to Brixton on the overground. Brixton to Stockwell on the tube. Takes less time than driving.
prunus
Tick tock.
Thanks for that.
Some random thoughts:
100 jobs on the farm site? That sounds ambitious (from a position of ignorance), but good.
I live on the South Side (just), and I'd be more than very happy for the north ends of both Hinton Road and Herne Hill Road to be closed (Padfield would have to stay closed too obviously) - it would absolutely delightful at the bottom of the hill without all the through traffic. (Yes, I have and drive a car, but an extra 10 minutes or so to get out of the area doesn't bother me at all).
Are we just giving up on the distinction between affect and effect?
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CH1
"Red Guard"(NLYL)
You lot were evidently "late adopters"
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