Mation
real life adventure worth more than pieces of gold
Not in my bit of South London, no. It was really weird to see!That's kind of what's been going on right through this 'lockdown' isn't it?
Not in my bit of South London, no. It was really weird to see!That's kind of what's been going on right through this 'lockdown' isn't it?
Which part is that?Not in my bit of South London, no. It was really weird to see!
A bit in which the takeaways and bakery aren't open, other than for delivery. Don't think we've got any butchers.Which part is that?
I'm certainly going to be watching with much interest, what happens if and when we see a true unlockening this summer. Whether, when workers start returning to central London, there will be a notable increase in those cycling in.
Although London's cycle infrastructure is still somewhat rubbish, it's better than it was a year ago. We'll see what percentage of those improvements get ripped out again.
Yup, in my corner of London its been very busy outside throughout. Most cafe's open and all take aways and food shops of different stripes. It can get very crowded in the parks and down by the river.
I've been to Epping Forest a few times over the pandemic , on one occasion we couldn't park as they had reduced the car parks in the forest & the remaining ones were packed !My area of Epping Forest has been absolutely chock-a-block throughout outside.
It's always weird seeing the 10+ cars parked up outside the playground because I'm fairly most of these people live nearby, it's not a huge area of settlement.
Yup, in my corner of London its been very busy outside throughout. Most cafes open and all take aways and food shops of different stripes. It can get very crowded in the parks and down by the river.
I've been to Epping Forest a few times over the pandemic , on one occasion we couldn't park as they had reduced the car parks in the forest & the remaining ones were packed !
Yes!They shut them for most of the summer which was weird
I do both tbfIt's not weird, I wish everywhere like that would shut their carparks during lockdowns, to try and reduce the phenomenon of London's minority of car owners filling up the streets driving to places to go for a walk while everyone else has to make do with whatever walks they can do from their front doors.
It's not possible to both use a car, and also be someone who doesn't have the option.I do both tbf
I mean , I drive occasionally to Epping Forest to go for a walk , and go for a walk from my front door to local green areas.It's not possible to both use a car, and also be someone who doesn't have the option.
I've even heard you sometimes walk to your carI mean , I drive occasionally to Epping Forest to go for a walk , and go for a walk from my front door to local green areas.
My point is that there's loads of people who don't have the option of sometimes driving somewhere different for a change. And those people find their local streets busy with cars driving around the place, cars driven by the minority of Londoners who have that option.I mean , I drive occasionally to Epping Forest to go for a walk , and go for a walk from my front door to local green areas.
I think this is a bit of a straw man, TBH.My point is that there's loads of people who don't have the option of sometimes driving somewhere different for a change. And those people find their local streets busy with cars driving around the place, cars driven by the minority of Londoners who have that option.
I don't want to get into criticising you personally. Maybe some people would disapprove of me doing fifteen mile walks that take me into other boroughs because they don't think the rules allow that. But I'm saying that I think there's a good argument for closing carparks to discourage people from driving around for leisure purposes. In the first lockdown the quietness of the streets compensated greatly for the restrictions on what what activity was allowed. You can perhaps see how having people trapped in their houses and immediate area whilst the streets outside are full of traffic much of which probably shouldn't really be there, might generate resentment.
I think this is a bit of a straw man, TBH.
I don't think there are many people actually trapped in their homes because of cars driving down their local streets, though some may certainly feel it would be more pleasant and even safer without those cars there.
But I do know people who are very wary about going out to local parks etc for daily exercise because at many times of day those areas are crowded to the extent that they feel unsafe ATM.
If some of those regularly exercising in my local park are able to drive (or cycle, etc) somewhere with more space and fewer people every now and again, that would leave more space in the park for those who can't.
But at the same time I can't walk far at all so really am restricted to the very local area. Would love a change of sceneryMy point is that there's loads of people who don't have the option of sometimes driving somewhere different for a change. And those people find their local streets busy with cars driving around the place, cars driven by the minority of Londoners who have that option.
I don't want to get into criticising you personally. Maybe some people would disapprove of me doing fifteen mile walks that take me into other boroughs because they don't think the rules allow that. But I'm saying that I think there's a good argument for closing carparks to discourage people from driving around for leisure purposes. In the first lockdown the quietness of the streets compensated greatly for the restrictions on what what activity was allowed. You can perhaps see how having people trapped in their houses and immediate area whilst the streets outside are full of traffic much of which probably shouldn't really be there, might generate resentment.
Closing some of the car parks in Epping Forest would impact more on the locals than on me (I just turned around and drove the 10 miles back to Hackney. )My point is that there's loads of people who don't have the option of sometimes driving somewhere different for a change. And those people find their local streets busy with cars driving around the place, cars driven by the minority of Londoners who have that option.
I don't want to get into criticising you personally. Maybe some people would disapprove of me doing fifteen mile walks that take me into other boroughs because they don't think the rules allow that. But I'm saying that I think there's a good argument for closing carparks to discourage people from driving around for leisure purposes. In the first lockdown the quietness of the streets compensated greatly for the restrictions on what what activity was allowed. You can perhaps see how having people trapped in their houses and immediate area whilst the streets outside are full of traffic much of which probably shouldn't really be there, might generate resentment.
I doubt that Epping Forest car parks are monitored by parking officials very closely, so you'd just get anyone using those spaces. If all the car parks had been open , there should be enough parking capacity for all. I think I went there when restrictions were being lifted following the 1st lockdown and loads of people had the same idea.I'd have no problem with some parking spaces being provided for blue badge holders only.
Make it clear to people they shouldn't be driving anywhere (or state a definitive distance limit) for leisure purposes, just as it is made clear to people that they shouldn't be using public transport to travel anywhere for leisure purposes.I'm not really sure what the answer is
100s of people descending on Epping Forest won't create the same overcrowding as 100s of people "descending" on my local park (as happens at weekends when the weather is good) because Epping Forest is about 100 times bigger than my local park* and there is far more space for visitors to spread out and avoid overcrowding.Right, but those places with more space and fewer people might only be quieter as a result of putting restrictions on how people can get there - ie. not having car parks open.
It is similar to the public transport situation that Ms Ordinary describes. With trains very empty there is probably very little risk or problem with one individual taking the train to somewhere nice for a change of scenery. But that falls apart if everyone decides to do it. So we have messaging that strongly discourages use of public transport for leisure purposes. It makes sense to do that, and it also makes sense to do the same for car journeys. Because the experience of making an elicit car journey is different to a public transport one (you don't have walk past staff and notices telling you not to do what you're doing) the messaging has to happen in different ways. And closing car parks at leisure destinations seems to be a perfectly sensible way to do this. You'll not stop everyone from using their cars when they're not really supposed to be - but you will hopefully avoid hundreds of people descending by car on places like Epping Forest.
Like I said above I don't want to make it into criticism of individual behaviour; my original point was simply that it's not weird to decide to close car parks at Epping Forest. To me there's good reason to do so.