Labour leadership

[SpookyFrank]

When they say 'outcry' who exactly is crying out? Because none of the people I know would give three fifths of a fuck one way or another who sings the national anthem and who doesn't. They've all got real things to worry about.

 

[Hocus Eye.]

Good for Jeremy. He looked like he didn't know the words and I hope that was true.

 

[andysays]

What's her workings - or yours, as you're going to use them? I can't see any?

Polly doesn't deal with such trivialities as "workings", with her it's all about questionable broad-brush assumptions and appearing to derive definite conclusions from them. Never mind the logic, feel the certainty in her writing.

Labour needs to win 94 English and Welsh seats. For that, four out of five of the requisite extra Labour votes need to be stolen from the Tories. Even summoning the young, the poor and the alienated will not suffice because most of those available votes are in seats already Labour-owned.

 

[kabbes]

What's her workings - or yours, as you're going to use them? I can't see any?

Welcome back. Don't do that again.

 

[J Ed]

What's her workings - or yours, as you're going to use them? I can't see any?

Welcome back BA!!

 

[billy_bob]

When they say 'outcry' who exactly is crying out? Because none of the people I know would give three fifths of a fuck one way or another who sings the national anthem and who doesn't. They've all got real things to worry about.

It used to be just the tabloids that used that rhetorical trick but it's all of them now - even Beeb News Channel was headlining their section on it (for which they interviewed only one person - some gonk from the Spectator) 'Corbyn anthem row'. What row? Instead of reporting on what happened, they're all reporting on how they've reported it. The media will eat itself....

 

[cesare]

What's her workings - or yours, as you're going to use them? I can't see any?

Did you have a good break? Good that you're back.

 

[eoin_k]

What's her workings - or yours, as you're going to use them? I can't see any?

I thought that only 24 per cent of the electorate voted for them. Even in tory marginals there should be votes to be had from non tories.

 

[brogdale]

What's her workings - or yours, as you're going to use them? I can't see any?

I can't yet place any actual workings, but I suspect that this is all of a piece with the notion that, of the 100 seats with lowest turn-out, something like 91 are Labour held already. Hence, if Corbyn's greatest electoral strength were to attract more non-voters back into the process, he would merely pile-up bigger majorities in Labour seats. To make headway into the 100 seats Lab would need to win for power in 2020 they would clearly need to turn 2015 Con voters.

Sorry it's vague; I'll see if I can find some stuff on this.

 

[Balbi]

From far away, everything looks fucking mad as

Tories look like they're trying to win an election, even though they just did. Corbyn appears unruffled and giving very few fucks about anything.

You daft bastards, what the shit is this?

 

[killer b]

the tories are trying to win an election - just putting in the groundwork for 2020

 

[youngian]

When they say 'outcry' who exactly is crying out? Because none of the people I know would give three fifths of a fuck one way or another who sings the national anthem and who doesn't. They've all got real things to worry about.

Corbyn could wear a suit everyday like Ed Miliband and sing the queen to the skies every morning it would make no difference to Corbyn's press coverage. Unlike Ed though Corbyn has clear policies and ideas to communicate. How he will reach people over the press noise remains to be seen. Most people do not use social media and those that do for politics are either the converted or using links to national newspaper and TV stations for their news.

btw, Owen Smith is appalling on Newsnight, supports the overall benefit cap on social security spending and sounds like he endorses the cap on individual benefit payments, doesn't sound much different than Reeves, technocrat.

He's a good performer so I don't know why he was getting himself in an unecessary tangle. Corbyn and McDonnel support caps as well through rent controls or housing expansion.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

One of the ones that amused me was the claim that he never sang the national anthem today. FFS, he is republican, if he sang he would be called a hypocrite.

Indeed.

 

[Wilf]

Polly Filla makes an interesting point that 80% of the votes Corbinladen will need for a majority in 2020 have to come from CON to LAB switchers.

I'm just not going to click on this, but I bet it says 'the size of the task facing...' doesn't it?

 

[brogdale]

I'm just not going to click on this, but I bet it says 'the size of the task facing...' doesn't it?

Harford's R4 stats programme "More or less" did a piece on the (limited) potential of engaging non-voters given our pluralist, majoritarian electoral system.

BBC Radio 4 - More or Less, Is it worth targeting non-voters?

 

[Teaboy]

Polly Filla makes an interesting point that 80% of the votes Corbinladen will need for a majority in 2020 have to come from CON to LAB switchers.

What about all those who didn't vote or are not even registered to vote? What about all those who will be able to vote for the first time in 2020? What about Scotland and all the votes lost to the SNP? What about all the old tories who would have died by then? We've talked about the tories demographic time bomb on here before. Those figures sound very crude to say the least.

 

[Diamond]

Going to be fascinating to see how PMQs pans out this lunchtime.

Might see if I can find somewhere close to work to watch it.

 

[belboid]

Harford's R4 stats programme "More or less" did a piece on the (limited) potential of engaging non-voters given our pluralist, majoritarian electoral system.

BBC Radio 4 - More or Less, Is it worth targeting non-voters?

which is basically....yes he could, but it's pretty unlikely

 

[billy_bob]

[Owen Smith]'s a good performer so I don't know why he was getting himself in an unecessary tangle.

Rachel Reeves was one of the most pointless, robotic, content- and ideology-free politicians I've ever witnessed open their mouth and I'd be astounded if she ever persuaded a single waverer to support Labour on anything. So to that extent he doesn't have far to go to outperform the recent past. But this is one area where Labour-under-Corbyn have to start absolutely nailing a clear alternative vision to the Tories every time they speak if they're to attract a larger pool of support.

The 'centrist' Blairite and Brownite factions don't get this because their views and actions are still determined by this sense of having to atone for past mistakes which they've completely internalised because they've heard the Tories beat them up about it so often - and by the belief that the way to do this atonement is to appear very nearly as 'tough' as the Tories. Milliband's campaign should be all the evidence they need that that wasn't working for the electorate, but for some reason they don't get it yet. I think the only way they might start to get it is if they see an alternative approach demonstrably succeeding in winning them more support.

If Corbyn's put people (Smith or otherwise) in place who aren't going to articulate that alternative approach with confidence, he's going to fail quickly and - worse - his opponents in the PLP are going to draw exactly the wrong conclusions about why that's happened.

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

What's her workings - or yours, as you're going to use them? I can't see any?

Great to see you posting again, not that I can account for Pollyannas arithmetic.

 

[marty21]

Corbyn could wear a suit everyday like Ed Miliband and sing the queen to the skies every morning it would make no difference to Corbyn's press coverage. Unlike Ed though Corbyn has clear policies and ideas to communicate. How he will reach people over the press noise remains to be seen. Most people do not use social media and those that do for politics are either the converted or using links to national newspaper and TV stations for their news.



He's a good performer so I don't know why he was getting himself in an unecessary tangle. Corbyn and McDonnel support caps as well through rent controls or housing expansion.

For a 66 year old he seems adept at using social media, more so that 48 year old Dave who posted (or his spad posted) that shite about security threats Corbyn despite being 66 is appealing to young voters who use social media a lot more and a lot of them haven't voted before

 

[cesare]

For a 66 year old he seems adept at using social media, more so that 48 year old Dave who posted (or his spad posted) that shite about security threats Corbyn despite being 66 is appealing to young voters who use social media a lot more and a lot of them haven't voted before

Loads of 66 year olds are quite adept at social media. I just discovered that Duncan Bannatyne is the same age (well, 3 months older tbf) as jezzer for example, and he's also all over twitter like a rash.

 

[Doctor Carrot]

Just saw him on BBC, they're still calling it a row. It's really woeful stuff. Giving him stick for not saying whether or not he'll sing it in the future. It's a fucking song ffs! If he did come out and say 'I'm a republican' it'll be oooh so you're a republican eh? Wanna get rid of the queen do ya? Hate Britain eh? Damned if he does damned if he doesn't. Nothing on policy at all just pathetic attacks over nothing really but I guess that's all they have.

 

[billy_bob]

Just saw him on BBC, they're still calling it a row. It's really woeful stuff. Giving him stick for not saying whether or not he'll sing it in the future. It's a fucking song ffs! If he did come out and say 'I'm a republican' it'll be oooh so you're a republican eh? Wanna get rid of the queen do ya? Hate Britain eh? Damned if he does damned if he doesn't. Nothing on policy at all just pathetic attacks over nothing really but I guess that's all they have.

I wonder how it would impact on how people see him if he just told them to grow the fuck up and spend their time reporting on something that matters. I mean, is there anyone who doesn't think most people in the mainstream media/journalism are massive twats? Wouldn't most people like to see them slapped down like that?

 

[killer b]

Isn't that what he's saying?

 

[marty21]

Loads of 66 year olds are quite adept at social media. I just discovered that Duncan Bannatyne is the same age (well, 3 months older tbf) as jezzer for example, and he's also all over twitter like a rash.

They don't all use it in a good way

 

[billy_bob]

Isn't that what he's saying?

I suppose so, in a way, but why is he now being said to be 'promising to sing it at future events'? That's just 'confirming' that the media have caught him out doing something shameful.

 

[SpookyFrank]

Corbyn could wear a suit everyday like Ed Miliband and sing the queen to the skies every morning it would make no difference to Corbyn's press coverage.

I think he knows this and realises full well that if everyone is going to attack him whatever he does then he might as well keep doing what he's always done.

 

[killer b]

I suppose so, in a way, but why is he now being said to be 'promising to sing it at future events'? That's just 'confirming' that the media have caught him out doing something shameful.

Ah, I'd not seen that. Depressing if true.

 

[dolly's gal]

For a 66 year old he seems adept at using social media

presumably he's got someone who does that for him? not that i think he should because he's 66, but because it's pretty much a full time job, and he's already got one of them